lifeblood: listlogs: 1996-10a


=========================================================================
date:         sun, 29 sep 1996 22:11:10 -0400
reply-to:     "elaine m. rigby" <emrigby@naz.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "elaine m. rigby" <emrigby@naz.edu>
subject:      melissa on rosie's show (nigc)

hello to all interested parties!

i just recieved a note from a melissa (etheridge) listee saying that m.e.
is going to be on the rosie o'donnell show on october 14.

ciao!
elaine r.


ps: does anyone that is taping "duets" for me (there are about 4 of you
out there) plan on taping this?  when i send you the tapes, can you
include this... that is, if she sings.  :)
the tapes will be going out by the end of the week.

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 23:47:35 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      re: astrological signs

well, according to emily: "i was born under the sign of cancer, like
brushing cloth, i smooth the wrinkles for an answer..."

~abigail (stargazing, painting picture perfect maps...)

at 04:16 pm 9/30/96 -0700, you wrote:
>on sat, 28 sep 1996, kimberly hobbs wrote:
>
>> amy - b.d. april 12th, 1964
>> i guess that would make e a cancer(?) and a a taurus (?) is that right?
>
>        i believe amy's an aries.  i'm a taurus and i'm sad to say that
>amy and i have missed each other by a whoppin' ten days.
>
>teri
>
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>
"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 29 sep 1996 18:38:35 -0100
reply-to:     sundara <smurphy@ups.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sundara <smurphy@ups.edu>
subject:      danielle howle

hi everyone!    well, last night a bunch of us listmembers met up to see
danielle howle in seattle.  it was soooooooooooooooooo fun :) hi claire,
lynn, sheri, tracy, jeni, greta, brie, lauren, carolyn and stacey.  (i
don't think i left anyone out,  you are all awesome!!)   danielle was
absolutely amazing!  her voice is incredible.  and she is the funniest
person!
greta and her friend brie had driven 3 hours to see dh, and then found out
it was a 21 and over show, and they weren't 21.  so i went in and asked
danielle (since i met her briefly in olympia) if there was anything she
could do (aren't i bold?!)  she was so nice about it,  she asked the owner,
and he said no, so she came out and talked to us, said hi to brie and
greta. she told us about how she got on daemon record's (amy just came up
and asked her)  she also told us that amy and emily are just wonderful
people (like we didn't know)   and she sang the song i wanted her to sing.
yay!   everyone!!!  go buy her cd and go see her if she comes anywhere near
you!   it will be so worth it.
after the show, a bunch of us hung out and re-lived bumbershoot.  oh, the
memories...sigh.  anyway.  i have a big headache from work, so i'm not
gonna babble anymore.  but  us seattle-area listees should meet up again
soon!  you all are fun!  so email me!

peace, love, and john jacob jingle hymer schmidt,
sundara (or sundarling, my new favorite nickname, and the only nickname
i've ever really liked)

"...i know that the fight to end patriarchy, to devour it, to deplete and
dismember it in favor of a system that does not achieve cosmic orgasm
through the oppression of other is a just and valiant fight.  and i will
continue to pursue this glorious end as long as my soul wanders the
earth..."
                --anastasia higginbotham

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 29 sep 1996 22:54:05 edt
reply-to:     herbert huels <73771.760@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         herbert huels <73771.760@compuserve.com>
subject:      nigc:vld@eddie's

any atlantians going to the viva la diva show at eddie's on tuesday???
if yes, is there any way you can tape it?? i heard that this might be an
acoustic show, and i would kill to be able to hear it!!! (however, since i am
stuck in huntsville, al, otherwise known as bumf**k, usa, i won't be able to
make it...)
please email me if you're planning on going!
-moe(simone)

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 29 sep 1996 23:17:37 edt
reply-to:     chickensoprano <creechal@aslan.emu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         chickensoprano <creechal@aslan.emu.edu>
organization: eastern mennonite university
subject:      re: sigc: party at kim's !!!
x-to:         clumber@smtp.prostar.com

on sat, 28 sep 1996, tracy wrote:

>         so who's bringing the grape nuts?

hmm...sounds like this party is getting just a little too
rought for me.  i mean, come on - i'm still under age!!

> tracy <who, with jeni, have decided to get a "partridge family" style bus
> for the trip.. of course we'll decorate it as an abba bus... after we cross
> the border that is...>

y'know - all this talk about abba has reminded me of when i first
grew to love that group.  two years ago as a freshman in college.
ironic that it was the same year that i came to know ig.

> "so your character may be functioning as a lesbian?"
>                 -- paraphrased from a poor memory after rotflmao, david letterman
> interviewing ellen  25 sept 1996

lesbian is a function?  must be something that new ti-92 can do,
'cause i can't find it anywhere on my ti-85...

anna

"so please be careful with me,
i'm sensitive and i'd like to stay that way."
                 -jewel

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 29 sep 1996 23:51:15 edt
reply-to:     chickensoprano <creechal@aslan.emu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         chickensoprano <creechal@aslan.emu.edu>
organization: eastern mennonite university
subject:      re: nigc:  more anti-gay trash (yes, more nigc)
x-to:         jenhall@juno.com

on sun, 29 sep 1996, jen hall wrote:

<snip the tv guide quote>

> i just don't know what to say.  as a heterosexual, i can't help but feel
> the need to apologize on behalf of the ignorant assholes who think in
> this manner.

i add my apolology to jen's.

> the paragraph after that mentioned heat coming from religious groups.
> now, i'm not a religious person by any means, but how come when it comes
> to homosexuality, the bible bangers come out in full force against it,
> but when the topic is capital punishment, they are all against the
> execution of the "human being" a.k.a skum.  isn't "and eye for an eye" in
> the bible?

yes, "eye for an eye" is in the bible.  more specifically, the old
testament - the stuff that happened before christ.  when jesus was
asked about this from time to time, he said that if someone wrongs us,
we are to turn the other cheek.  and, he said that only those who are
without sin may cast judgement.  so, true followers of christ will
say that homosexuality is a sin, because it is written so in both the
old and new testaments.  and, true followers of christ will say that
capital punishment is a judgement we have no authority to make.  we
did not create life - god did.  flame away, but this is my faith, and
i will not be silent.

>  i always thought religious people followed the bible page
> for page - - - not pick and choose what they do and don't want to
> support.

true followers of christ are also fallible human beings.  we are not
perfect, just forgiven, as the slogan goes.  many who have grown up
in the faith, as i have, are not as versed in the bible as we should
be.  many are too new to know all that there is to know about god's
word.  it's no small children's story that you can read in a few
minutes and know completely.  it takes years of study and prayer to
understand fully.  so if it looks like we're picking and choosing, it
is mostly because we're still learning.  every time i read, i find out all sorts of
things about what it means to be a follower of christ that i didn't
know before.

> i think the bible bangers should follow the amish...just keep
> to themselves and make their own life the way they want and leave
> everyone else alone.

the amish have a good idea about how to live as disciples of christ
in the sense that they take the command to keep themselves separate
from the world and focus on god, but they are missing the command to
go out and be ministers to the world.  god has called us to spread
the word, and if we are true followers of christ, that is what we do.
some are more gifted in that area than others.  i, for one, am not.

> why should advertisers base their advertisement dollars on the main
> characters sexual preference?  here, we are confusing business with
> personal opinion.  so does this mean that any advertiser that supports
> "ellen" would be banned from, say, advertising on the super bowl?  where
> will this bullshit end?

when we stop looking at the surface and realize that we are not, nor
ever will be, perfect.

<snip>
> cause, after all, how can anybody love a gay person?
<snip>

a true follower of christ can.  i am trying.  i do.  "they'll know we
are christians by our love," remember?  sometimes we forget this in
the midst of our self-righteous crusades.

> hey, if those conservative, bible bangers, anti-gay or lesbian, etc.
> people don't want to associate with gays or lesbians - - fine.  their
> loss.

amen!  my faith is growing stronger because of a lesbian christian
friend who has given me new perspectives.  and i was once one of
those anti-gay bible bangers.

sorry to bother the list with my nigc, but i can not and will not be
silent about this any longer.

not all christians are bad!!

anna

"pride is a strange disease; it makes everybody
sick except for the one who has it."
          -anonymous

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 29 sep 1996 23:59:54 gmt
reply-to:     patricia hite <phite@cybergate.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         patricia hite <phite@cybergate.net>
subject:      cleveland show!!!

hey everybody!!

i just got back from the woody guthrie tribute show here in cleveland and it
was wonderful!!  the girls were fabulous.  i thought they'd play like one
woody song but nope!!  first they came out and sang backup during ani
difranco's song "i'm not a pretty girl"  (??? forgive me all you ani fans!)
then they came out and did "gypsy rain" (woody guthrie song with a on
mandolin) then came "get out the map" (once again a on mandolin) then came
"this train" and they brought ani back out for an awesome version of
"ramblin' around" at they end a & e participated in the big jam session.
everyone sang "hard travelin'"  "poorboy's lullabye" and "this land is your
land"  well, i have a preety good recording on ig's four songs and bruce
springsteen's set, but i didn't get ani's 3 songs (except for the part where
ig sang backup, sorry guys!) or the jam session cause i ran outta tape :(
those of you who want the four songs i'll be happy to take requests.  i
guess i'll wait & see how many requsts i get before i set up a tree.  gotta
get to bed!  bye y'all!!

had a very indigo day!!

rob

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 00:17:42 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      fun non-lyric quotes

how's about when in watershed, an interviewer is suggesting genres that
could be more risky than nis was and, upon hearing the suggestion of rap,
amy goes "yeah that'd be really risky, just two white girls doing rap!"

i also like the "teach me, oh goddess of wit" bit of amy's!


~abigail

"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 00:34:10 -0400
reply-to:     janinsdale@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         janinsdale@aol.com
subject:      re: best non-lyric quotes
x-to:         indigofrk@aol.com

in a message dated 96-09-28 14:27:29 edt, indigofrk@aol.com (sasha friedman)
writes:

>
>amy:  emily was playin bass on that one.  yeah yeah

this sounds more like a beavis and butthead quote!

yeah, yeah!

(go ahead, flame away, but i got a good laugh out of it!)

happy monday!

jan

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 00:34:23 edt
reply-to:     joan morrison <103161.3515@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         joan morrison <103161.3515@compuserve.com>
subject:      (sigc) catie curtis in nashville

hi folks!

saw catie curtis play in nashville tonight.  she played a live radio broadcast
from 3rd & lindsley bar & grill and it was great!!   the show, "sunday night
live" runs an hour, but catie played three songs for us after the broadcast.
she played everything from the new album.  "radical" got lots of hoots and cheers,
of course!  during her post-broadcast "encore," she played a song that she said
was from her first album, which she put out herself.  i can't for the life of
me remember the name of the song, but i absolutely loved it.  it is a medium-to-
uptempo song that to me is kind of reminiscent of ig's "hand me downs." (the best
comparison i can come up with).  anyway, i was wondering if anyone knows about
this previous album...like what the title is?  'cause i would like to have the
album, if nothing else but for that one song.  catie told some cute little road
stories and thanked us for listening so well.  she said she has never played in
a sports bar where people actually listened to her music.  we were all like,
sports bar!?!?!?   this isn't a sports bar!!!!!!!!!  catie was like, "well, i
saw the tv up at the bar and there was a ball game on so i just figured it
was a sports bar!  the bartender immediately switched the channel to...cspan!!!!
the whole place (including catie) roared with laughter.  a great time was had
by all.  i think catie enjoyed herself.  she commented that she felt a lot
more relaxed once the live radio broadcast was over.  she played two different
guitars (not at the same time, of course) and she had a musician with her who
switched off between acoustic and electric mandolin.  he was excellent - really
added to her sound.  this has nothing to do with her music, but catie
was looking very cute...and seemed very shy and modest.  she also has a
really cute sense of humor...kind of quirky!  *sigh*
peace and catie,
joan ;)

p.s. - i noticed catie has a strumming style similar to amy's...she even
holds her strumming arm kind of the same way.  and she stums kind of hard.
she didn't break any strings though <g>

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 29 sep 1996 22:49:32 -0700
reply-to:     kimberly hobbs <kimlin@vcn.bc.ca>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         kimberly hobbs <kimlin@vcn.bc.ca>
subject:      re: nigc-ellen is taking too long
x-to:         m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
in-reply-to:  <199609291141.haa04854@mime2.prodigy.com>

aaaah, but we have to spoon-feed the masses! this slow boat is not for us
like-minded viewers but for all the "sensitive" watchers out there in tv
land who find it all too frightening and please don't scare us too fast!!
of course "we" want her to get on with it all but that's because it's
what we know...the other 90% don't know and we have to whisper it softly!!!

peace ya'll, kim (n.v.)

on sun, 29 sep 1996, m gordon wrote:

> binky wrote...
> i can't help but feel a teensy bit manipulated....i mean either do it
> or don't, but don't work me. jeez ellen...i guess that's showbiz....
> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
>
>
> i definitely agree....
>
> drop the hints on the show and then send ellen degeneres around on a
> press tour of ny shows (rosie, conan, dave).  what show do they think
> they are?  "spin city"  melissa
>

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 00:27:46 -0500
reply-to:     tracy - home home home home <clumber@smtp.prostar.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         tracy - home home home home <clumber@smtp.prostar.com>
subject:      nigc: toy stores

jen lucero soapboxed (and very well i add....):
> has anyone taken a walk through a toy store lately?  there are the
>boy aisles and the girl aisles...

        toy store?  errr.... me?  <clears throat>  recently ?  ummm.....
errr....  maybe... errr.... <tracy hides behind jeni and lets her answer that>


tracy <who totally agrees and also notes the preponderance of commercial
toys.. like the little mcdonalds stand with plastic big macs to "sell" and
the pizza hut easy bake....>
"i never lie.
        oh, that wasn't the truth..."
                -- danielle howle, 28 august 1996

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 00:29:50 -0500
reply-to:     tracy - home home home home <clumber@smtp.prostar.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         tracy - home home home home <clumber@smtp.prostar.com>
subject:      re: the list

andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu> noted:
>with all of this talk about unneccessary postings, length of postings,
>signatures, etc., i felt that i had to give my opinion.  i have to say,
>that i love this list.  i like reading everyone's comments, whether they
>have igc or not. [snip]

        i reply:
yeah!! whatshesaid!

tracy <still not a member of the bandwidth conservation society>

"isn't it strange, but isn't it wonderful...
        the things we find to fall in love..."
                -- "before the fall"
                        taylor williams

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 01:37:48 -0400
reply-to:     mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
subject:      re: jill sobule (nigc)
x-to:         andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
in-reply-to:  <v01540b18ae75d1a6026d@[130.91.233.114]>

yeah the resistance song kicks asss


on mon, 30 sep 1996, andrea lipman wrote:

> actually, it's jill sobule.  "i kissed a girl" is on her self-titled album,
> which is one of the best albums i've ever heard (after all ig albums!).
> jill is so cool & i recommend her to everyone.  her first album is called
> "things here are different," but it's not as good as the second album.
> there's a link a jill sobule webpage from my homepage.
>
> andi
>
> mark wrote:
>
> >the answer is jill soube i thinks thats how her last name is spelt she did
> >the song supermodel on the clueless soundtrack
>
>
>
> >on sun, 29 sep 1996, pat & shelly wrote:
>
> >> hi all,
> >>
> >> sorry for the nigc but this has been driving me and my so crazy.  we got a
> >> wav of part of the song 'i kissed a girl' and are really wanting to hear the
> >> whole song but no one seems to know who sings it.  even the person who sent
> >> the wav didn't know.  i figured someone out there must know!! please!!  i am
> >> hoping!!!
> >>
> >> drop me an email if you do, i would really appreciate it!
> >>
> >> pat
> >> wingstar@mulberry.com
>
> -_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
>                               andrea lipman
>                        e-mail: ablipman@sas.upenn.edu
>          check out my new webpage, which has nothing too exciting
>           on it yet, but will definitely be cool in the future:
>                    http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~ablipman
>
>                      "it's only life after all."-es
>
>    "you said good friends are hard to come by i laughted and bought you
> a beer 'cause it's too corny to cry well sentiment given and sentiment lost
>   you shook it off with a smirk and a toss and you were only joking."-ar
>
>      "turns out not where but who you're with that really matters."-dm
> _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
>
> --
> administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
> to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
>         with the line: signoff indigo-girls
>

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 08:34:28 -0400
reply-to:     windsurfwm@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         windsurfwm@aol.com
subject:      anyone have any recent ig info?

i've been away for quite some time.  does anyone have a tour schedule for ig?
any upcoming releases?  i heard they were going to be in cleveland, oh (or
near there) soon for some arlo guthrie show?!? please let me know what's
going on with them.  i do need to add since i've been away from the list it
has been "filling up" with nonsense.  what happened to strictly ig content?

thanks, in advance, for your assistance.

dj

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 23:05:53 -0700
reply-to:     jeni saulino <saulinoj@olywa.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jeni saulino <saulinoj@olywa.net>
subject:      re: nigc: toy stores,a total waste of bandwidth

>jen lucero soapboxed (and very well i add....):
>> has anyone taken a walk through a toy store lately?  there are the
>>boy aisles and the girl aisles...
>
>        toy store?  errr.... me?  <clears throat>  recently ?  ummm.....
>errr....  maybe... errr.... <tracy hides behind jeni and lets her answer that>
>

toy stores are very cool..if you stay far far away from the girl aisles.
that pink just makes me wanna puke.  has anyone else ever noticed that
barbies pet are like 10 times the sixe of barbie. no wonder she's so fucked
up.
>
the fao swartz(sp) downtown has a paino like in big. its really cool.  i
even worked in a toy store once. it was really fun, except for all the
kids.

and just one more amazing toys store fact: me and tracy now have a football
so we won't have to go to toys are us anymore to play, but we may
anyway...at midnight right before christmas,  buhahahaha...

jeni (mistress of all emotions and social director)
saulinoj@olywa.net

you've already won me over in spite of me
don't be alarmed if i fall head over feet
don't be surprised if i love you for all that you are
i couldn't help it
it's all your fault

"...and i termed this word cyborg. i remember he said, "oh, that sounds
like a town in denmark."   manfred e clynes

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 09:33:07 -0400
reply-to:     "peter a. barta" <bartap@bulldog.georgetown.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "peter a. barta" <bartap@bulldog.georgetown.edu>
subject:      re: (nigc) save sesame street - not a joke (fwd)

---------- forwarded message ----------
date: mon, 30 sep 1996 07:25:19 -0600 (mdt)
from: cory beth kubishta <kubi7975@blue.univnorthco.edu>
to: "peter a. barta" <bartap@bulldog.georgetown.edu>
subject: re: (nigc) save sesame street - not a joke (fwd)

                  ****update for pbs/nea/npr petition****

to all receivers of this petition,

it has come to our attention, due to the overwhelming support of these
programs, the movement to cut the funding for the nea, npr, and pbs has
been dropped.  to repeat, thanks to your support of these programs, the
danger of losing these programs has passed!!

unfortunately, the due date for this petition was deleted on most or all
of these copies and the petition is still circulating. ***** please delete
all copies of the circulating petition!!!*****  we greatly apologize for any
inconvienence concerning this effort but must ask for the petitions to be
deleted!!!  the overwhelming support we have received has kept us going,
but the fight has been won and we thank you all!
                                 -sincerely,
                                   the authors of the petition

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date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 20:54:49 pst
reply-to:     mike w robinson <mike.mike@juno.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mike w robinson <mike.mike@juno.com>

hello my name is mike what's going on up there?
how about sending me a reply i'd  love to here from you as soon as
possible.
tell me what you discuss about...

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date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 07:21:35 -0700
reply-to:     betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>
subject:      re: nigc-almost live dream

hey, ... i wanna swim with wunda wunda too!!!  can your mom get her to do
the teapot song?  well, at least your moms not swimming with gertrude.

betsy


>haven't had a jp patches dream yet, but i was a patches pal many years
>ago.  and my mom swims at the same pool with wunda wunda.
>

-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
..you see turning off the light switch is their only power
      when we stand like spotlights in a mighty tower
                       all for one and one for all
                    then we sing the common call.....
                                                             e. saliers
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 09:35:04 -0600
reply-to:     nordeelm@caa.mrs.umn.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         lisa on the prairie <nordeelm@caa.mrs.umn.edu>
subject:      re: astrological poll

on fri, 27 sep 1996 14:07:09 -0400, andrea lipman wrote:

>for the record, i'm a cancer...
>

me too.  :)

lisa
******************************************************************************
                                 lisa nordeen
                              (320) 589-6429 (o)
                              (320) 589-4782 (h)
                            nordeelm@caa.mrs.umn.edu

               "i am not an angry girl, but it seems like i have
                                everyone fooled."
                                                  -ani difranco
******************************************************************************

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date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 07:32:47 -0700
reply-to:     betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>
subject:      danielle howle in portland (nigc)

the few hours i spent not driving on sunday, were spent at the "o" in
portland, watching danielle howle.  although the venue was a liitle too
eclectic for my tastes, danielle was cool!.  the place had well over a
hundred people crammed into it, and the phone kept ringing during her set,
but all in all, she was great!   i saw no list shirts (and i don't have
mine yet), but  i think there were some lebanese there....   anyway,  i
recommend seeing her when/if you can.

betsy (an officer in the rabid, ig army, who doesn't remember saying  "oh,
fuck!" ...)

-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
..you see turning off the light switch is their only power
      when we stand like spotlights in a mighty tower
                       all for one and one for all
                    then we sing the common call.....
                                                             e. saliers
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 01:05:56 edt
reply-to:     jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)

okay boys and girls.  remember sesame street?  remember the game where
they showed us 4 items and we picked which one didn't belong?  ok, which
one of these answers the following question:

which one illustrates the type of family that you'd want to be a part of?

a)  the family & specifically the husband that was portrayed in the movie
"the burning bed".  oh, yea, they were a religious bunch too, right?

b)  jeffery macdonald. the husband/father portrayed in the movie "fatal
attraction".  gee, he was an upstanding military citizen and beloved
doctor.

c)  the husband from massachusetts that has his wife and unborn baby son
murdered for insurance money.  can't remember his name, but there way,
yet, another movie made about him that was called "goodnight sweetheart"
or something of that nature.  the husband was portrayed by ken olin from
"30 something".

d)  melissa etheridge and her pregnant wife/girlfriend (can't remember
her name).  julie something.

okay, so which one here represents a family.  the word "traditional" is
moot.  what is traditional to me isn't to others.  so, i'm defining
family.  so what some of the bible bangers here are saying (both the nice
bible bangers and the flamers) is that a family is represented by a man
and woman who can have children.

of the above, which family would you want to belong to....?

peace,
- jen hall (yes again..)


on mon, 30 sep 1996 22:49:10 edt "christopher m. becker"
<cmbecker@space.mit.edu> writes:
>>
>> on sep 29, 1996 12:56:42, 'gwendigo <gkeyt@paul.spu.edu>' wrote:
>>
>>
>> >one of the first to try to include the blessing of same-sex unions
>>
>>
>> i have a question about that...  i don't mean to nitpick, and this
>is
>> totally honest.  there was a gay couple in a temple of a friend of
>mine,
>> and they wanted to go through the jewish marriage ceremony.  in and
>of
>> itself, i would think that's fine, except for one thing.  much of
>the
>> ceremony is based on the "be fertile and increase" type thing.
>> specifically, the marriage is a union with the goal of procreation.
>> bluntly, what is all of your takes on this.  i mean, i don't know
>the
>> ceremony all that well, and i think they have they right to equal
>> treatment, but isn't that a bit of a perversion of the ceremony
>anyway?  i
>> mean, wouldn't that be like (let me think of something that isn't
>> offensive) a catholic priest taking the confession of a buddhist?  i
>mean,
>> sure, it can be done, but does it sort of change the meaning?  i'm
>> undecided on this issue, as i am in favor of equality, and yet,
>while
>> non-religious, i am still sort of understanding of why a
>congregation would
>> not want a marriage of that type.
>>
>> i'd be interested in what you people thought.  if you think it's
>worth a
>> mini-thread, post public, otherwise, a private email is just as
>good...
>> have a nice day,
>>
>
>hi alec,
>
>  a good, honest question, i hope i can give you an equally good,
>honest answer.  to start i'm a straight white male.  catholic,
>practicing catholic.  i also think the church is dead wrong when it
>comes to homosexual issues and i actively work to change that.
>
>  i believe that gay folks should be allowed a religious service
>should they want one provided they proclaim the appropriate faith.
>
>  one can look at it this way, does the church/temple/masque/whatever
>(ctmw) deny marriage in the faith to folks who know they can not get
>pregnant? i have never heard of such a case.  there are lots of
>infertile folks out there, many of them married in faith.  what about
>those folks who actively seek never to have a child?  have they sinned
>by getting married in the ctmw?  if one of those couples decided to
>get married would it raise such an uproar as two homosexuals getting
>married?  depending how those questions are answered, it possibly
>exposes a fairly large hole in the arguement -- why is ok for hets to
>do it but not homos, perhaps fertility isn't the central issue after
>all?
>
>  but that's a surface argement and fairly bullshit at that.  i mean
>there are lots of ways to be fertile and increase without yourself
>bringing a new life into the world.  take a deeper, fuller
>understanding of that phrase to mean "to foster, to teach, to
>nurture."  folks without kids can do all those things just as well
>(and perhaps better) than folks with kids! hets and gays the same.
>what does it matter? by volunteering in the ctmw, living a like of
>morality and ethics that is an upstanding model for a youth to follow.
>don't these things also give rise to fertility and increasing?  think
>of the parable of the sower and the seed.  if the ground the seed
>falls on sucks, the plant will die.
>
>  not to mention, who says a gay parent won't have a kid?  adoption
>and artificial insemination work no matter the sexual preference.
>basically all you need is the parts -- then biology takes over.  i
>don't think anyone would try to claim that a het couple loves their
>own children more than a gay couple would.  i will say this -- there
>is a movement in the gay community which i think is a mistake, the
>coupling of gay men who want kids with gay women who want kids.  while
>i understand why this happens, i personally think the child should be
>a production of love (and yes ai and adoption count here).  there is
>no love between the parents in question -- they do share a love for
>the child, but that isn't enough.  anyway i digress =)
>
>  finally, what is the real purpose of marriage?  to me, its the union
>of two people who love each other so much they want to step in front
>of the world and say, "i love this person so much we have ceased to be
>two people, rather we are some sort of trinity: me - hir - me/hir.
>three but one, one but three.  i want to testify this to my society
>and my god."  while children are a manifestation of this union in
>flesh, just the statement means a great deal.  personally i think its
>sinful to deny someone from being able to express themselves in such a
>way.
>
>   this isn't meant as a flame, rather as an answer to a well-posed
>question.  to me it comes down to this: if you dig deep enough you
>usually find out the surface words are a rationalization of a hidden
>fear. when the surface arguements contadict, what is left standing is
>the real issue.  try on that test and see what you come up with.
>
>                take care and good luck,
>
>                        chris
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>christopher m. becker                       "trying to read the greek
>mit center for space research                 upon the stars...."
>cmbecker@space.mit.edu                           -- e. saliers
>
>        http://www.mit.edu:8001/people/cmbecker/home.html     [my
>homepage]
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 23:39:27 -0700
reply-to:     "kim : goddess in her own reality:)" <rcn@prcn.org>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "kim : goddess in her own reality:)" <rcn@prcn.org>
subject:      re: the list

at 12:29 am 9/30/96 -0500, trace ( in response to andrea lipman's post )wrote:
>>>with all of this talk about unneccessary postings, length of postings,
>>signatures, etc., i felt that i had to give my opinion.  i have to say,
>>that i love this list.  i like reading everyone's comments, whether they
>>have igc or not. [snip]
>
>        i reply:
>yeah!! whatshesaid!
>
>tracy <still not a member of the bandwidth conservation society>
>
>ummm... <achem> "me too!!!" ( but this suprises no-one, i'm sure...)
peace... kim ( north of north van... in powell river...but really inhabiting
a world all her own... )
and that party at my place??? it's been moved, due to popular demand, to
tracy's... all attending *must* wear their bestest retro-beegee look +
parade through trace's town carrying "we are tracy's friends" and "party at
tracy's...*all* welcome ( free beer )" signs....
party on!!!:)
>
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
      <just kim>rcn@prcn.org
"pain from pearls-hey little girl-
     how much have you grown?"
---------------amy ray------------------
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 02:43:36 -0400
reply-to:     mmedido@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mmedido@aol.com
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)

oooh..couldn't resist.....
about the procreate stuff....

last time i checked we homos could have kids too....
:0)

"oma" claire (what the 'kiddles' calls me)

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 02:42:50 -0400
reply-to:     mmedido@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mmedido@aol.com
subject:      re: chiapas & zapatistas on ig demo tour (long)
x-to:         verdi@imap2.asu.edu

in a message dated 96-09-30 20:50:18 edt, ben writes:

<< regardless of what their rationale is they are still a
military group using weapons. they are still killing people!!!
    i'm sorry, i just can't bring myself to agree with this particular
cause. war is war...there is no justification for killing at any time. >>

yes you have a point there i had the same questions when i heard that
ar was supporting them, because of her self idetification as a pacifist.

i just want to recomend that anyone interested in learning more pick
up a book called :

"shadows of tender fury" [the letters and communique's of
subcomandante marcos and the zapatista army of national liberation]

as the title points out, this is a colletion of the writings of subcomandante
marcos and the zapatistas.
it is very interesting and quite illuminating....the zapatistas only took up
arms after all other avenues failed, (peaceful protests were met with
murder and intimidation) they only engage in armed conflict with the
mexican military and follow the geneva conventions strictly, a practice
that (according to them) is not followed by the mexican military.

this book is not only interesting from a historical viewpoint, but is an
engaging literary work, as the subcomandante is a very expressive
and gifted writer...

while i share your distaste for war, i understand their actions.

claire

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 02:45:54 -0400
reply-to:     jen lucero <jlucero@monmouth.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jen lucero <jlucero@monmouth.com>
subject:      re: songs i skip

        hi y'all...it's pretty late (or early) here on the east coast, but i
thought i would join in on this thread...
        there was a time when i skipped over kid fears, center stage, you
and me of the 10,000 wars, tgwtwotwihh, airplane, and language or the
kiss...but then i wised up and began to earnestly listen to what was being
said, or rather inferred...now, about the only song i still avoid is
airplane...i like it, but for some reason, it still grates on my nerves!!!

        on the other hand there are songs i never skip over, and oddly
enough quite a few of them seem to be covers...i love all along the
watchtower...the rawness of amy's voice gives me shivers...and the girls
singing an american tune acapella is incredible...it won't be long and
tangled up in blue are equally awe-inspiring...
        original songs i never miss...mystery, the wood song, r&j, hand me
downs, dead man's hill and walk away...
        well...i guess that's enough for now...
                peace
                        jen

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date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 11:53:52 -0400
reply-to:     dana5@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         trish rubke <dana5@aol.com>
subject:      attn: atlantans (sigc)

i've been lurking in the background here for over a month, and cringe to
think that my first posting is not ::::gasp:::: total ig content!?  i should
be automatically removed from this list now!!  but onto the point...  time is
running out for me to spread the word to my fellow atlantan neighbors.  if
you are up for a nice fall picnic in the park i've got a great place for
you...

wed, oct 2nd
decatur square 12 noon
blue sky concerts

:::::crush:::::  a rising local band will be there and i'd love to have some
of y'all come on out and see them for yourselves.  they've been playing here
for a while (eddie's attic, the otherside, krisitn hall's platinum party last
month, etc...)  they are just fresh out of the studio (last week!).
listening to them, i always think back to when the girls were making their
start..  how time and circumstance betrayed me that i was not there for their
beginning.  just come out if you can...  not for me...  i'll be getting my
satisfaction...  not for them...  playing makes them happy....  but for
yourselves.  email me and let me know what you think... (dana5@aol.com)  i'll
even pass on their email address if you have anything to say.  better yet,
walk up to them and say hi..  what you thought...  and trip them out by
saying you heard about it here!!  if you enjoy it as much as everyone else..
i'll be happy to give their next show date and time (next week, the
highlands).

afterthought on short notice...  maybe this would be a good time to meet some
of your fellow ig net buddies for a picnic?

and one more thing...  going to their shows i am always looking back over my
shoulder waiting to get a glimpse of amy and emily... (or kristin - who
happened to back out last minute taking them into studio last month..  but
they're getting stronger each day despite any minor setbacks)  but, then
again, if you live around here..  or better yet share the passion...  you
probably are always on the look out for the girls anyway!

-peace and love-
         dana

"by grace my sight grows stronger..." -es

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date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 23:57:24 +0000
reply-to:     "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)

just read the post about the sesame street (one of these thing just
doesnt belong here) thing....

ok, this is getting way out of hand!! i have sat by, and listened for
months and months without making judgement on anyone (nor will i ever),
but i will not stand by while you people call me a bible thumper!!
whether you consider me a nice one, or a flamer, matters not.

i have sat back and watched, as a lot of you have discussed your
lifestyles. i have felt a little uncomfortable, but have never felt the
urge to tell anyone here that they are wrong (in my eyes).

now i have watched as you wonderful people (as you call each other),
have started to attack me and the other christians here as a whole!!
why?? you dont know a thing about me!! how dare you attack my religion.

how can anyone possibly take hollywood's films, and use that as an
arguement against us. give me a break. hollywood flicks dont even come
close to showing how a real family functions!! for the record, i think
that straight marriages, and gay marriages are susceptible to many of
the same problems.

why must you feel the need to attack us? what, please tell me, have i
done to you, but show understanding for your lifestyle, and said prayers
for those who have shown that they are hurting. i think some of you need
to go and re-evaluate just how wonderful you are. just because you are
in the majority here, does not give you the right to persecute us. no
more than the christian church has the right to persecute you.

chris payne owen4@adnc.com

(obviously, this is not directed at all of you, and i must apologize to
the ones who had to read this, that had nothing to do with all of this)
--

       "if it doesn't work, force it...
   if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway."

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 00:08:20 -0700
reply-to:     k miller <kmiller@accessone.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         k miller <kmiller@accessone.com>
subject:      re: nigc-wunda wunda
x-to:         betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>

this experience could be yours, should you so desire - just go to
greenlake pool during the day, i think, or is it queen anne? or ballard?
anyway, if you truly wanna see the wunda email me & i'll ask my mom
where/when.  truth be known, she actually does sing in the pool shower
room too. but probably not the teapot song, nor "wunda wunda is my name,
boys & girls, i'm glad you came..." (hey, does anybody remember the rest
of the words?) and she's 'bout 30 years older now, & no more tall hat (&
was that a clown hat, or a witch hat? never could figure it out....)

and who knows, my mom could be swimming w/ gertrude & never know it!
(if it's coed swim, that is)

betsy bertiaux wrote:
>
> hey, ... i wanna swim with wunda wunda too!!!  can your mom get her to do
> the teapot song?  well, at least your moms not swimming with gertrude.
>
> betsy
>
> >haven't had a jp patches dream yet, but i was a patches pal many years
> >ago.  and my mom swims at the same pool with wunda wunda.
> >
>
> -_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
> ..you see turning off the light switch is their only power
>       when we stand like spotlights in a mighty tower
>                        all for one and one for all
>                     then we sing the common call.....
>                                                              e. saliers
> _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-
>
> --
> administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
> to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
>         with the line: signoff indigo-girls

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 00:03:59 +0000
reply-to:     "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
subject:      oops...

when i said "bible thumpers", i meant "bible bangers". that was the
spiteful term used in jen hall's post. and yes, i do believe that the
traditional family is made up of a man and a woman. what is wrong with
that? you have your beliefs, and so do i. the difference is that i never
assaulted you vor having yours. please go to the dictionary and look up
the word "traditional". i think you might find that the word perfectly
define my definition of a tradidtional family. you might not like it,
but it is traditional.

chris payne owen4@adnc.com
--

       "if it doesn't work, force it...
   if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway."

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 11:34:35 -0500
reply-to:     ryan <ryan@ou.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         ryan <ryan@ou.edu>
subject:      nigc:just wondering

i was just wondering if anything has happened.  i was getting fifty letters
a day off the list and i haven't got any in a day or two.  hopefully this
letter won't annoy any of you anti-nigcers.  have a good day.
keep on groovin',
ryan
[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]
"learn to pretend there's
more than love that matters"
             e.  saliers
[][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][][]

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 02:27:30 -0600
reply-to:     greg matthew flamer <gflame@nwu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         greg matthew flamer <gflame@nwu.edu>
subject:      public flame time

> andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu> noted:
>>with all of this talk about unneccessary postings, length of postings,
>>signatures, etc., i felt that i had to give my opinion.  i have to say,
>>that i love this list.  i like reading everyone's comments, whether they
>>have igc or not. [snip]
>
>        i reply:
>yeah!! whatshesaid!
>
>tracy <still not a member of the bandwidth conservation society>

ok--after this one and the whole string of jill sobule crap i am officially
flaming publically.  could it be, tracy home home home, that you agree with
ms lipman because you two have together posted the most garbage!!!!!  and
all that jill sobule stuff--jesus--private email!!!!  a simple who sings
this song and suddenly we're the jill sobule ig list.  instead of thirty
people saying hey it's jill sobule to the list, whoever asked the question
could have received all those repsonses.  wake up wake up wake up!!  you
(major generalization--sorry) are being so inconsiderate to other people.
how selfish can you be to just go ahead and post with some sarcastic "i
don't care about bandwidth" statement.  you could have just as easily
said--" i don't give a flying fuck what any one else thinks because i'm
going to do what i want!"  so here's my official flame for you:  and it's
public because that is how annoying this has become.

>  dear:
>   [ ] clueless newbie         [x] loser           [ ] fed
>   [ ] aoler/euronetter/pier   [x] dork
>   [ ] indy.netter
>   [ ] ix.netcom.com er        [ ] pervert         [ ]
>   [x] me too er               [ ] nerd            [ ] elvis
>   [ ] spammer                 [ ] freak           [ ] flamenet
>   [x] unbearably self-righteous person
>
>  you are being flamed because:
>
>   [ ] you posted a "test" in a newsgroup other than alt.test/nl.test
>   [ ] you posted warez in pieces less than 5000 lines
>   [ ] you posted a binary in a non-binaries group
>   [ ] you quoted an entire post in your reply
>   [ ] you continued a long, stupid thread
>   [ ] you posted the same article more than once
>   [ ] you started an off-topic thread
>   [ ] you posted a "you all suck" message
>   [x] you said "me too" to something
>   [ ] you don't know which group to post in
>   [x] you suck
>   [ ] you brag about things that never happened
>   [ ] your sig/alias/server sucks
>   [ ] you posted a phone-sex ad
>   [x] you posted something totally uninteresting
>   [ ] you crossposted
>   [ ] you posted a message all written in caps
>   [ ] you posted racism
>   [x] i don't like your tone of voice
>   [ ] i think you might be a member of co$
>   [ ] i think you might be a fed
>
>  to repent, you must:
>
>   [ ] give up your aol/euronet/planet internet account
>   [ ] bust up your modem with a hammer and eat it
>   [ ] jump into a bathtub while holding your monitor
>   [ ] actually post something relevant
>   [ ] read the fucking faq
>   [ ] be pat buchanan's love slave
>   [ ] be the guest of honor in alt.flame for a month
>   [ ] apologize to everybody in this newsgroup
>   [ ] post your tests to alt.test/nl.test
>   [x] no forgiveness
>
>  in closing, i'd like to say:
>
>   [ ] blow me
>   [ ] get a life
>   [x] never post again
>   [ ] i pity your dog
>   [ ] go to hell
>   [ ] i think your iq must be 7
>   [ ] take your shit somewhere else
>   [ ] learn how to post or fuck off
>   [x] do us all a favor and jump into some industrial equipment
>   [ ] see how far your tongue will fit into the electric outlet
>   [ ] all of the above

i feel better now.

greg, who is usually in better spirits on this list

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 13:09:39 -0500
reply-to:     cyndigo@txdirect.net
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         cyndi johnson <cyndigo@txdirect.net>
organization: fast fingers
subject:      re: astrological signs
x-to:         juliet long <j.l.a.long@reading.ac.uk>

juliet long wrote:
>
> so ...aren't there really any other pisces out there????
>
> ...sounds kinda fishy to me!! :)
>

oh yes, there is definitely another pisces out here - march 10 to be
exact.  (however, i will omit the year...)!

cyndi

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 08:46:26 gmt
reply-to:     h.burningham@ulst.ac.uk
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         helene burningham <h.burningham@ulst.ac.uk>
organization: university of ulster
subject:      a link between dar and alannis?????nigc

hi there
well, i was listening to dar the other night and then switched to th
radio and heard alannis morisettes song 'isn't it ironic'...and then
i got thinking...after understanding dars 'as cool as i am' and the
bits about how the bf notices another woman and she *notices* her
aswell etc, you know when alannis says 'like meetting the man of my
dreams and then meeting his beautiful wife'...i was wondering, or
rather amusing myself actually that she was really saying 'meeting his
*beautiful* wife'...isn't that ironically ironic!!!
oh the time passes so quickly!
having fun!
love helene
"steer clear of the shore, the coast is rough and rocky"   kate wolf

helene burningham <h.burningham@ulst.ac.uk>
coastal research group
department of environmental studies
university of ulster
coleraine bt52 1sa
northern ireland
44(0)1265 324010

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 13:53:54 -0500
reply-to:     jim fagan <fagan@austin.ibm.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jim fagan <fagan@austin.ibm.com>
subject:      nigc: tabs, copyrights, etc.

i received this from another list i'm on. adam used to be a member
of this list, and has done a wonderful job tabbing a lot of songs.
he may still be a member, but i haven't seen him post for a long time.

>
> fyi: the following article appears in the 9/25/96 issue of _city pages_ out
> of minneapolis, in the music notes section. maybe nothing new, then again
> maybe more and more of the same *is* news. one thing of interest: this guy's
> web page.  check it out re the legal fiasco he encountered with posting
> tabs.  in there he notes that he now understands chord progressions are not
> copyrightable; legal objections can center only upon lyrics. thought some of
> you would like to know while we wait to hear about the new york shows.
>
> http://www.citypages.com   (for the article)
> http://pobox.com/~schneider/adam.html (for this guy's home page)
>
> eileen
>
> ============================================================================
> ==========
> for four years, amateur guitarist adam schneider has been a sort of virtual
> guitar teacher, offering online instructions to a worldwide circle of
> musicians with modems. when he discovered a great new song (lucinda
> williams, suzanne vega, and indigo girls are some of his songwriting
> favorites), he'd strum along with his stereo, watch videotapes, or take
> notes at concerts to learn the chords. then he'd post his tablatures on his
> university of minnesota homepage on the world wide web for other players to
> share and learn. that is, until copyright lawyers stepped in.
>
> earlier this year, emi successfully campaigned for internet hosts to
> dismantle most sites connected with the voluminous on-line guitar archive
> (olga), which provides guitar music of many genres, threatening legal action
> on the grounds of copyright infringement. soon afterward, an unknown party
> coerced university lawyers to make schneider (also an olga
> contributor)remove his own chord files from their system.
>
> copyright run-ins like these have incensed the electronic community over the
> past several months. schneider argues that his website had the potential to
> increase consumer interest and music sales, and says he has always refused
> to take money for his services. "it's not like i'm taking the songbook,
> putting it on my scanner, and putting the picture up on the net. i would
> never do that. i've just put up my own interpretations of how to play these
> songs."
>
> olga users like schneider also cite the "fair use" clause, which permits
> copyrighted materials to be used for educational purposes. this opens yet
> another issue of how the law should apply to the new medium. "it does call
> into question, what is the internet?" says schneider. "is it a global
> conversation, or is it a print or broadcast medium? that's a good question,
> and i don't know the answer."
>
> he does know that his online files--most of which are not available in any
> other medium--are trapped in limbo, waiting for legislation or a compromise.
> ironically, schneider has received approval from many of the artists he
> features. (musician kim richey even sat down with him after her recent fine
> line concert and taught him a song to put online.) and while he could opt to
> place his files with an overseas net provider, he won't be satisfied until
> publishers realize they could cooperate with him. "i'm not interested in
> trying to go around them, to go underground. what i would like to do is work
> out a solution with the people who complained about this--but i don't know
> who complained." until then, schneider maintains his dis-chorded home page,
> featuring his side of the story, a plea for involved parties to contact him,
> and some interesting links.
>
> the address: http://pobox.com/~schneider/adam.html  (simon peter groebner)
>
>
>


--
jim fagan    | aix apar regression test technical lead | fagan@austin.ibm.com
t/l 678-2458 | austin, texas                           | fagan@austin

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 08:58:45 +0100
reply-to:     juliet long <j.l.a.long@reading.ac.uk>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         juliet long <j.l.a.long@reading.ac.uk>
subject:      re: a link between dar and alannis?????nigc
in-reply-to:  <3d87eff7eee@sperrin.ulst.ac.uk>

on tue, 1 oct 1996, helene burningham wrote:

> ........you know when alannis says 'like meetting the man of my
> dreams and then meeting his beautiful wife'...i was wondering, or
> rather amusing myself actually that she was really saying 'meeting his
> *beautiful* wife'...isn't that ironically ironic!!!

yes!!!!! i think that every time i hear it!!!! ...specially the way she
sighs after the line ...like oo...wow!!! lol!!

juliet.
<http://www.rdg.ac.uk/pris/juliet/sed/home2.html>

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 01:33:20 -0700
reply-to:     k miller <kmiller@accessone.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         k miller <kmiller@accessone.com>
subject:      re: public flame time
x-to:         greg matthew flamer <gflame@nwu.edu>

now, now, be nice.  i've been known to do an occasional 'me too' or nigc
posting, so am not entirely guilt-free.  but geez, for the most part i enjoy
reading everything, even the me-too's, just like tracy & andrea.  makes it
seem more like a real conversation, everybody can have their say even if all
they have to say is 'me too'.  the only things i don't like reading are
mean-spirited, rude postings like the one you just sent. get off it!

kathy
p.s. i thought your indigo girls impersonation thing was funny & couldn't
understand why people got so upset.  now that you've gone & pushed my buttons
too i understand a little better.  that your m.o.?

greg matthew flamer wrote:
>
> ok--after this one and the whole string of jill sobule crap i am officially
> flaming publically.  could it be, tracy home home home, that you agree with
> ms lipman because you two have together posted the most garbage!!!!!  and
> all that jill sobule stuff--jesus--private email!!!!  a simple who sings
> this song and suddenly we're the jill sobule ig list.  instead of thirty
> people saying hey it's jill sobule to the list, whoever asked the question
> could have received all those repsonses.  wake up wake up wake up!!  you
> (major generalization--sorry) are being so inconsiderate to other people.
> how selfish can you be to just go ahead and post with some sarcastic "i
> don't care about bandwidth" statement.  you could have just as easily
> said--" i don't give a flying fuck what any one else thinks because i'm
> going to do what i want!"  so here's my official flame for you:  and it's
> public because that is how annoying this has become.
>
> >  dear:
> >   [ ] clueless newbie         [x] loser           [ ] fed
> >   [ ] aoler/euronetter/pier   [x] dork
> >   [ ] indy.netter
> >   [ ] ix.netcom.com er        [ ] pervert         [ ]
> >   [x] me too er               [ ] nerd            [ ] elvis
> >   [ ] spammer                 [ ] freak           [ ] flamenet
> >   [x] unbearably self-righteous person
> >
> >  you are being flamed because:
> >
> >   [ ] you posted a "test" in a newsgroup other than alt.test/nl.test
> >   [ ] you posted warez in pieces less than 5000 lines
> >   [ ] you posted a binary in a non-binaries group
> >   [ ] you quoted an entire post in your reply
> >   [ ] you continued a long, stupid thread
> >   [ ] you posted the same article more than once
> >   [ ] you started an off-topic thread
> >   [ ] you posted a "you all suck" message
> >   [x] you said "me too" to something
> >   [ ] you don't know which group to post in
> >   [x] you suck
> >   [ ] you brag about things that never happened
> >   [ ] your sig/alias/server sucks
> >   [ ] you posted a phone-sex ad
> >   [x] you posted something totally uninteresting
> >   [ ] you crossposted
> >   [ ] you posted a message all written in caps
> >   [ ] you posted racism
> >   [x] i don't like your tone of voice
> >   [ ] i think you might be a member of co$
> >   [ ] i think you might be a fed
> >
> >  to repent, you must:
> >
> >   [ ] give up your aol/euronet/planet internet account
> >   [ ] bust up your modem with a hammer and eat it
> >   [ ] jump into a bathtub while holding your monitor
> >   [ ] actually post something relevant
> >   [ ] read the fucking faq
> >   [ ] be pat buchanan's love slave
> >   [ ] be the guest of honor in alt.flame for a month
> >   [ ] apologize to everybody in this newsgroup
> >   [ ] post your tests to alt.test/nl.test
> >   [x] no forgiveness
> >
> >  in closing, i'd like to say:
> >
> >   [ ] blow me
> >   [ ] get a life
> >   [x] never post again
> >   [ ] i pity your dog
> >   [ ] go to hell
> >   [ ] i think your iq must be 7
> >   [ ] take your shit somewhere else
> >   [ ] learn how to post or fuck off
> >   [x] do us all a favor and jump into some industrial equipment
> >   [ ] see how far your tongue will fit into the electric outlet
> >   [ ] all of the above
>
> i feel better now.
>
> greg, who is usually in better spirits on this list
>

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 07:20:29 edt
reply-to:     oh susanna <oh.susanna@dartmouth.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "susan b. marine" <susan.b.marine@dartmouth.edu>
subject:      love on another right now dammit (nigc)

--- chris wrote:
k, this is getting way out of hand!! i have sat by, and listened for
months and months without making judgement on anyone (nor will i ever),
but i will not stand by while you people call me a bible thumper!!
whether you consider me a nice one, or a flamer, matters not.

***christianity asks us to be patient, kind and gentle in our ways, chris. your
hostility isn't going to open anyone's eyes to your kindness.

i have sat back and watched, as a lot of you have discussed your
lifestyles. i have felt a little uncomfortable, but have never felt the
urge to tell anyone here that they are wrong (in my eyes).

***what makes you uncomfortable? feeling uncomfortable is a judgement, chris.
if you didn't think something was "wrong" with gay love, you wouldn't feel
"uncomfortable", right?

now i have watched as you wonderful people (as you call each other),
have started to attack me and the other christians here as a whole!!

** i don't feel attacked. sounds like a personal problem. i think a lot of what
folks have to say about christianity and its judgmentalism is totally 100% true
and we need to work on those things that incite fear and support hatred.

why?? you dont know a thing about me!! how dare you attack my religion.

***because "your religion" (and mine, or at least the people who speak for our
religion) supports , in a lot of ways, hatred of gays, condemnation of people
who truly love each other, and a whole host of other heinous things in the name
of christ. why don't you join the fight against that kind of hate rhetoric,
which exists in every possible form, instead of condemning list folks. you
doln't know what anyone on this list has gone through either, chris, extend
them the same courtesy you ask of them..

why must you feel the need to attack us?
*** we should ask our christian brothers and sisters the same question

what, please tell me, have i
done to you, but show understanding for your lifestyle,

***be careful chris! you're starting to sound a leetle condescending here

and said prayers
for those who have shown that they are hurting. i think some of you need
to go and re-evaluate just how wonderful you are.
--- end of quoted material ---
***that's not fair chris. the people on this list...gay, straight, bi, purple
(hi sundara) and otherwise are wonderful, loving people. yes, a lot are gay or
bisexual and we have problems like anyone else, and this is a very safe places
to process those problems and support each other, because i know that's what
emily and amy would want.. that's the one thing i do know about this list, its
about love...not about bashing.

i'm sorry you feel attacked. christians have been persecuted for thousands of
years. prayer and reflection helps, but action...loving actions toward your
fellow humans...makes  the difference.

just my .02 and change,
susan the happy quaker

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 23:12:34 -0700
reply-to:     james finn <jfinn@hotmail.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         james finn <jfinn@hotmail.com>
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)

on sep 20 alec@nyc.pipeline.com wrote about the dilemmas facing g&l partners
accesing traditional religious weddings, particularly the
<"be fertile and increase" type thing.

ths is not so much of problem of sexuality as procreation.  straight coupls not
wanting to have kids are in exactly the same boat.

i think the importance of any ritual is in it's interpretation for the
particpants rather than it's literal meaning.  otherwise people would still be
slaughtering lambs to sprinkle the blood over the front steps of their homes.

surely any public celebration of love and commitment "increases" some
understanding of everyone's rights to rites; "increases" access to appropriate
role models; and "increases" they g&l community's relavence to traditional
religion and vice versa.

i think that's quite metaphorically "fertile".

my partner and i have been trying to work out what sort of ceremony we will
have for three and half years, and find it difficult to find any rituals we
both want or don't feel silly for us as two guys.  the only exception is
playing tws (is that the right way to say the wood song?)

this is my first ever posting to a mail list so please excuse any errors in
transmission or protcol.

fnor

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 05:39:50 -0700
reply-to:     dragonman <djarrell@ix10.ix.netcom.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         dragonman <djarrell@ix10.ix.netcom.com>
subject:      re: public flame time

at 01:33 am 10/1/96 -0700, you wrote:
>now, now, be nice.  i've been known to do an occasional 'me too' or nigc
>posting, so am not entirely guilt-free.  but geez, for the most part i enjoy
>reading everything, even the me-too's, just like tracy & andrea.

you are missing the point!!!!  while there are those who have all the time
in the world and enjoy all of the wasted bandwidth, you are still wasting a
lot of people's time and computer resources on ridiculous things that could
be a) taken to private e-mail or b) eliminated all together.  the fact that
you, or a few people like you, enjoy it is not an argument against greg's
very valid points.

>makes it
>seem more like a real conversation, everybody can have their say even if all
>they have to say is 'me too'.

no! no! no! no! no! no! no! no! no! no!

"me too"'s are a complete waste of time and resources.  as of this point, i
will privately flame every single "me too"er to get my point across.  damn
it!  stop being inconsiderate and wasting people's time.  if you want a
fucking conversation, pick up the phone or use irc.

and for god's sake, stop quoting all of the post that you are responding to!
we have all read it once before if we ever gave a shit.

officially pissed off,

:dwayne

djarrell@ix.netcom.com
"you can spend your time alone redigesting past regrets,
or you can realize you're the only one who can forgive yourself
makes much more sense to live in the present tense" - pearl jam

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 10:34:24 -0400
reply-to:     "keates, harry" <hak@crai.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "keates, harry" <hak@crai.com>
organization: charles river associates
subject:      re: a link between dar and alannis?????nigc
in-reply-to:  <b94d7137011c0e00>

helene wrote:
>well, i was listening to dar the other night and then switched to th
>radio and heard alannis morisettes song 'isn't it ironic'...and then
> got thinking...after understanding dars 'as cool as i am' and the
>bits about how the bf notices another woman and she *notices* her
>aswell etc, you know when alannis says 'like meetting the man of my
>dreams and then meeting his beautiful wife'...i was wondering, or
>rather amusing myself actually that she was really saying 'meeting his
>*beautiful* wife'...isn't that ironically ironic!!!

i agree with your alanis interpretation, i've always heard it both ways,
and feel like she intended it that way.  i think a lot of people see how
popular she is and write her off, much like joan osborne, but i think
jagged little pill is a very interesting album with lots of subtlety  et
al.   ironic, huh?   : )

on the other hand, i don't see the same sort of "attraction" in dar's as
cool as i am noticing of "the other woman"  ( which i would change to
"other women" because i don't see it as any one woman in particular).  i
interpret what the narrator notices is that she realizes that the
boyfriend is trying to get her to see women in the same "women as
objects" way that he does and that she is learning this from him and
rejects it, saying that she is the same as these other women he is rating
on a 1-10 scale, saying "i am the others."   that's just my
interpretation though, you may disagree with me.

i guess you could also throw in the ig line (and i'm sure i'm not getting
this exactly right) "...and watch the prettly ladies walking by."
while i think everyone is reading this as a little more blunt than the
ones you mentioned because its ig, if dar williams or alanis sang this
line, it would be similar.  just as if  ig sang the line from ironic, it
would likely be interpreted as being attracted to the beautiful wife.

this has got to be the most poorly written post i've ever made, my high
school english teacher would surely come after me for this, but being
that he is in jail for the rest of his life, i don't think i have to
worry.

  harry a. keates
  email: hak@crai.com

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 22:49:14 +0800
reply-to:     enhiver <enhiver@singnet.com.sg>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         enhiver <enhiver@singnet.com.sg>
subject:      request to all listees (nigc)

hi you people, i have a request :

could the person who originally asked for everyone's astrological signs
please post his/her address ? those interested in participating, please
email privately to him/her.

and for those of y'all interested in the results, like if 80% of the list
are aries or only 5% are pieces, please write to the person doing the
compilation.

this is a good survey, useful information for trading boots, 'cos if 80% of
us are really aries, then surely more than 1 volunteer will be needed for
this sign :-) .

could we also do the same for any future surveys, useful or just plain
silly ?? i sure the individuals compiling them will want to share their
interesting results with us all anyway.

here's to peace, more igc, & shorter signatures !

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:02:56 -0400
reply-to:     mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
subject:      re: oops...
x-to:         "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
in-reply-to:  <32505fef.359b@adnc.com>

you forget one thing new traditions can be started

on tue, 1 oct 1996, christopher d. payne wrote:

> when i said "bible thumpers", i meant "bible bangers". that was the
> spiteful term used in jen hall's post. and yes, i do believe that the
> traditional family is made up of a man and a woman. what is wrong with
> that? you have your beliefs, and so do i. the difference is that i never
> assaulted you vor having yours. please go to the dictionary and look up
> the word "traditional". i think you might find that the word perfectly
> define my definition of a tradidtional family. you might not like it,
> but it is traditional.
>
> chris payne owen4@adnc.com
> --
>
>        "if it doesn't work, force it...
>    if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway."
>
> --
> administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
> to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
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>

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:06:02 -0400
reply-to:     mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
subject:      re: public flame time
x-to:         greg matthew flamer <gflame@nwu.edu>
in-reply-to:  <v01530502ae7679278e86@[129.105.186.43]>

to which i say dont u love folks who bitch about something then go ahead
and do it themselves

on tue, 1 oct 1996, greg matthew flamer wrote:

> > andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu> noted:
> >>with all of this talk about unneccessary postings, length of postings,
> >>signatures, etc., i felt that i had to give my opinion.  i have to say,
> >>that i love this list.  i like reading everyone's comments, whether they
> >>have igc or not. [snip]
> >
> >        i reply:
> >yeah!! whatshesaid!
> >
> >tracy <still not a member of the bandwidth conservation society>
>
> ok--after this one and the whole string of jill sobule crap i am officially
> flaming publically.  could it be, tracy home home home, that you agree with
> ms lipman because you two have together posted the most garbage!!!!!  and
> all that jill sobule stuff--jesus--private email!!!!  a simple who sings
> this song and suddenly we're the jill sobule ig list.  instead of thirty
> people saying hey it's jill sobule to the list, whoever asked the question
> could have received all those repsonses.  wake up wake up wake up!!  you
> (major generalization--sorry) are being so inconsiderate to other people.
> how selfish can you be to just go ahead and post with some sarcastic "i
> don't care about bandwidth" statement.  you could have just as easily
> said--" i don't give a flying fuck what any one else thinks because i'm
> going to do what i want!"  so here's my official flame for you:  and it's
> public because that is how annoying this has become.
>
> >  dear:
> >   [ ] clueless newbie         [x] loser           [ ] fed
> >   [ ] aoler/euronetter/pier   [x] dork
> >   [ ] indy.netter
> >   [ ] ix.netcom.com er        [ ] pervert         [ ]
> >   [x] me too er               [ ] nerd            [ ] elvis
> >   [ ] spammer                 [ ] freak           [ ] flamenet
> >   [x] unbearably self-righteous person
> >
> >  you are being flamed because:
> >
> >   [ ] you posted a "test" in a newsgroup other than alt.test/nl.test
> >   [ ] you posted warez in pieces less than 5000 lines
> >   [ ] you posted a binary in a non-binaries group
> >   [ ] you quoted an entire post in your reply
> >   [ ] you continued a long, stupid thread
> >   [ ] you posted the same article more than once
> >   [ ] you started an off-topic thread
> >   [ ] you posted a "you all suck" message
> >   [x] you said "me too" to something
> >   [ ] you don't know which group to post in
> >   [x] you suck
> >   [ ] you brag about things that never happened
> >   [ ] your sig/alias/server sucks
> >   [ ] you posted a phone-sex ad
> >   [x] you posted something totally uninteresting
> >   [ ] you crossposted
> >   [ ] you posted a message all written in caps
> >   [ ] you posted racism
> >   [x] i don't like your tone of voice
> >   [ ] i think you might be a member of co$
> >   [ ] i think you might be a fed
> >
> >  to repent, you must:
> >
> >   [ ] give up your aol/euronet/planet internet account
> >   [ ] bust up your modem with a hammer and eat it
> >   [ ] jump into a bathtub while holding your monitor
> >   [ ] actually post something relevant
> >   [ ] read the fucking faq
> >   [ ] be pat buchanan's love slave
> >   [ ] be the guest of honor in alt.flame for a month
> >   [ ] apologize to everybody in this newsgroup
> >   [ ] post your tests to alt.test/nl.test
> >   [x] no forgiveness
> >
> >  in closing, i'd like to say:
> >
> >   [ ] blow me
> >   [ ] get a life
> >   [x] never post again
> >   [ ] i pity your dog
> >   [ ] go to hell
> >   [ ] i think your iq must be 7
> >   [ ] take your shit somewhere else
> >   [ ] learn how to post or fuck off
> >   [x] do us all a favor and jump into some industrial equipment
> >   [ ] see how far your tongue will fit into the electric outlet
> >   [ ] all of the above
>
> i feel better now.
>
> greg, who is usually in better spirits on this list
>
> --
> administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
> to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 11:30:31 -0500
reply-to:     twb@zycor.lgc.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         trant batey <twb@zycor.lgc.com>
subject:      re: nigc:  more anti-gay & zapatistas

> yes, "eye for an eye" is in the bible.  more specifically, the old
> testament - the stuff that happened before christ.  when jesus was
> asked about this from time to time, he said that if someone wrongs us,
> we are to turn the other cheek.  and, he said that only those who are
> without sin may cast judgement.

this ties back into the post about the zapatistas support.

jesus also said, "if a man hath not a sword, let him take his cloak and sale
it and buy a sword." a little later he said that the swords shall be beatten
into plow sheers.  my point is that the bible says a lot of things.  and
different bibles say different things with out regard for our hope that it is
devinely inspired.  in the end your going to have to decide for yourself, but if
god is not in your heart, your not going to find him(her) in any book.

as for as killing goes, it is my belief that if i come up on a man who is trying
to rape and murder a woman, and i have no other way of stopping him, that it
is not only my right but my obligation to kill him if i can.  just like when
hitler was murdering 18 million people, i feel it was our obligation to stop
him if we could.


> so, true followers of christ will
> say that homosexuality is a sin, because it is written so in both the
> old and new testaments.

i'm not a bible scolar or anything, but where in the new testament is the
subject even brought up.  i do not remeber it being discussed by jesus accept
in terms of fornication in general.  the thing that i do remember jesus saying
about dealing with homosexuals and everyone else is, "in as much as you have
done it even unto the least of these, so too have you done it unto me."

> and, true followers of christ will say that
> capital punishment is a judgement we have no authority to make.  we
> did not create life - god did.  flame away, but this is my faith, and
> i will not be silent.

i never questioned your faith anna, but why am i condemed for all eturnity
because i disagree with you.  i thought that it was jesus that decides who the
true followers are. man if i'd a known that, i'd a been a lot nicer to ya.

for what its worth,

trant

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 09:42:19 -0700
reply-to:     k miller <kmiller@accessone.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         k miller <kmiller@accessone.com>
subject:      re: public flame time
x-to:         greg matthew flamer <gflame@nwu.edu>

oh boy, i've been flamed, must not be a newbie anymore.  flamers (2
openly, 1 privately so far), thanks for informing me on the netiquette of
not posting the whole previous email; i'd wondered about that & couldn't
decide if it was more polite to leave it there for them to read in case
they hadn't before, or to delete it.  guess i made the wrong choice on
that one, sorry, i really didn't realize that some folks have to pay for
each email.  maybe a polite private email informing me that i was out of
place would have sufficed?  or a nicer (i.e. non-flame) public email for
the edification of the un-informed?

so, guess i'm outnumbered in my enjoyment of all list content.  ironic
thing is, i emailed privately about the whole jill sobule thang.  and my
main beef wasn't even against greg's opinion, though we happen to
disagree, it was on how mean flames can be.... guess i must be naive. so
if you please, you can stop flaming now, i got the point!

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:44:40 -0400
reply-to:     mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
subject:      re: love on another right now dammit (nigc)
x-to:         oh susanna <oh.susanna@dartmouth.edu>
in-reply-to:  <32995323@dancer.dartmouth.edu>

oh susanna oh wont u preach for me because u have a true grasp of
christianity<g> now ill add to your letter<g> :} at susanna<g>

on tue, 1 oct 1996, susan b. marine wrote:

> --- chris wrote:
> k, this is getting way out of hand!! i have sat by, and listened for
> months and months without making judgement on anyone (nor will i ever),
> but i will not stand by while you people call me a bible thumper!!
> whether you consider me a nice one, or a flamer, matters not.
>
matters not?? so if folks think your a nice bible thumper who only does it
on occasion isnt better then the asshole bible thumper who shoves religion
down someones throat to the point where theyy just want to joke them<g>??

> ***christianity asks us to be patient, kind and gentle in our ways, chris. your
> hostility isn't going to open anyone's eyes to your kindness.
>
preach on sister<g>

> i have sat back and watched, as a lot of you have discussed your
> lifestyles. i have felt a little uncomfortable, but have never felt the
> urge to tell anyone here that they are wrong (in my eyes).
>
didnt u just do it here?? u could have said something like i have never
had the urge to tell someoen that homosexuality goes agaisnt my beleifs


> ***what makes you uncomfortable? feeling uncomfortable is a judgement, chris.
> if you didn't think something was "wrong" with gay love, you wouldn't feel
> "uncomfortable", right?
> bingo
> now i have watched as you wonderful people (as you call each other),
> have started to attack me and the other christians here as a whole!!
>
gee lets talk abotu attackign for a minute shall we hmm the inquisistion
the holy war the crusades  lets see your a homo so yoru going to hell your
not a christain so your a heathen  nope christans dont attack at all do
they  did u think that maybe they are not attacking chirstianity as a
whole but the pig headed assholes who have forgotten even though the bible
says homosexuality is wrong(and notice it says nothing about lesbians just
a man and a man is wrong) that the bible also says love thy neighbor
regardless and to love all do on to others as you would have them to on to
u condemning someone because of sexual oreintation isnt forgivng and gay
bshing is the same as being a racist


> ** i don't feel attacked. sounds like a personal problem. i think a lot of what
> folks have to say about christianity and its judgmentalism is totally 100% true
> and we need to work on those things that incite fear and support hatred.
>
> why?? you dont know a thing about me!! how dare you attack my religion.
>
so if someone attacks your religion they are attackign u?? did u ever
think that most of the folks on here were raised catholic or christain???
so perhaps they have been there and know have you ever seen the
incosistancys in the bible like where it says thou shalt not kill which is
a commandment but it also says that if a man lies wiht a beast they both
shall be put to death?>??? and dont say old or new testament cause the old
was handed down by god who created u the new by his son and if u say the
new takes the place of the old u say god made a mistake then which is also
a conderdiction remember we according to religion are paying for adam and
eves mistake this is from the all forgivng god  this si after jesus died
for our sins im paying for somethign someone else did how do u feel about
incest?? you hate it right?? but gee who did caine sleep with he slept
with his sister cause adams family was the only one around at that time
there are other inconsistancys i can point out to needless to say if folks
actually read the bible they would see them and maybe they might see the
love my neighber and act upon it


> ***because "your religion" (and mine, or at least the people who speak for our
> religion) supports , in a lot of ways, hatred of gays, condemnation of people
> who truly love each other, and a whole host of other heinous things in the name
> of christ. why don't you join the fight against that kind of hate rhetoric,
> which exists in every possible form, instead of condemning list folks. you
> doln't know what anyone on this list has gone through either, chris, extend
> them the same courtesy you ask of them..
> amen<g>
> why must you feel the need to attack us?
> *** we should ask our christian brothers and sisters the same question
>
i already covered this?<g>


>  what, please tell me, have i
> done to you, but show understanding for your lifestyle,
>
show udnerstanding for your lifestyle?? sorry not everyone on here is gay
or lesbian i know im not perhaps they have shown understanding for your
lifestyle very condiscending and judgemental statement there


> ***be careful chris! you're starting to sound a leetle condescending here
>
>  and said prayers
> for those who have shown that they are hurting. i think some of you need
> to go and re-evaluate just how wonderful you are.
> --- end of quoted material ---
go reevaluate how wonderfrull u ar eanother big time judgement there
everyoen is wodnerfull to someone

> ***that's not fair chris. the people on this list...gay, straight, bi, purple
> (hi sundara) and otherwise are wonderful, loving people. yes, a lot are gay or
> bisexual and we have problems like anyone else, and this is a very safe places
> to process those problems and support each other, because i know that's what
> emily and amy would want.. that's the one thing i do know about this list, its
> about love...not about bashing.
>
> i'm sorry you feel attacked. christians have been persecuted for thousands of
> years. prayer and reflection helps, but action...loving actions toward your
> fellow humans...makes  the difference.
and christains have attacked others for thousands of years consider the
pagan point of view(once again i dont profess to be pagan) if xtian works
for u thats fine it doesnt work for me so ill have my religion and you
will have yours and we will both be happy i wont try to convert you (most
pagans do not ever try to convert folks they feel if a person is intrested
they will come ie when the teacher is needed they will come) and u dont
try to save my soul and convert me
hugs anthony van pyre the god of all things huggy patron deity of
cyberspace the god of love and to many other titles to numerous to mention
that most here would not get

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 09:28:36 -0600
reply-to:     corinne simpson <corinne@utah-inter.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         corinne simpson <corinne@utah-inter.net>
subject:      homosexuality and christianity...

okay maybe this should be in private email, but i wanted to make my opinion
known to all.  i grew up in a christian home, and i am a lesbian.  i have
seen both sides of it and i much prefer being in the gay community to being
in a christian church.  why?  gays seem to be more accepting and tolerant of
any kind of lifestyle, unlike christians, who claim to love everyone, but
most times really only love people like themselves.  from my point of view,
and from 18 years of going to church, that's how i see it.

chris... you don't know me either.  you don't know my situation.  i have
respect for christians, in fact i still believe in christ and god and all
that stuff.  i just feel that my homosexuality is not a sin in god's eyes.
it is a sin in the eyes of his followers, but i know that god loves gays as
much as he loves his straight children.

you can flame me all you want, but i have already been through it enough
with my family and friends.


corinne

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
got to learn to respect
what we don't understand
--amy ray
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:44:31 edt
reply-to:     jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
subject:      re: nigc: toy stores,a total waste of bandwidth

here here.   down with pink !!  down with pink !!  down with pink !!
down with pink !!  down with pink !! down with pink !!

i'll take the boys department any time.  as a young tyke, i was fully
dressed in football garb - the new england pats no less!! and i loved it.
if i only had someone to play with...  thank god for telephone
polls...!?!?

go vikes,
- jen hall


>toy stores are very cool..if you stay far far away from the girl
>aisles.  that pink just makes me wanna puke.

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 13:11:05 -0400
reply-to:     "peter a. barta" <bartap@bulldog.georgetown.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "peter a. barta" <bartap@bulldog.georgetown.edu>
subject:      re: oops...
x-to:         "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
in-reply-to:  <32505fef.359b@adnc.com>

on tue, 1 oct 1996, christopher d. payne wrote:

> when i said "bible thumpers", i meant "bible bangers". that was the
> spiteful term used in jen hall's post. and yes, i do believe that the
> traditional family is made up of a man and a woman. what is wrong with
> that? you have your beliefs, and so do i. the difference is that i never
> assaulted you vor having yours. please go to the dictionary and look up
> the word "traditional". i think you might find that the word perfectly
> define my definition of a tradidtional family. you might not like it,
> but it is traditional.

the question is not what's traditional but what's right. yes, up till
now, most municipalities have only recognized a man and a woman as a
valid union of marriage.tradition does not, by itself, hold much weight.
slavery was once justified as a soouthern tradiiton. society must
progress and grow, gaining enlightenment.
  marriage is a union based on love, mutual trust and commitment. when
two people love each other enough to spend the rest of their lives
together, they want to express the commitment. the marriage ceremony, in
most religions, is a celebration of that union and all it stands for.
nowhere in that conception is there an inherent requirement that the two
people thus joined must be of opposite sexes. love is not constrained by
"tradition." why should marriage?
  christianity has been attacked on this list for its persecution of
gays, both in doctrine and in practice. this, of course, does not justify
blanket statements indicting all christians. many denominations are more
prpgressive and have moved beyond "tradiitonal" conceptions of what is
"right" or "wrong" and have come to recognize that the themes of love,
respect, and brotherhood far outweigh obsolete notions based on ignorance
and fear.
  the key is to attack the doctrines which prmote discrimination without
resorting to name-calling or generalizations which strike those who are
not deserving of such venom. i respect chris' views, though i strongly
disagree with them. flaming him won't change his views. educating him as
to the realities which make us reconsider tradition might.


peter a. barta
bartap@bulldog.georgetown.edu


"everything that i believe,             "i want to live as an honest man,
crawls from underneath the streets.      to get all i deserve,
everything i truly love,                 and to give all i can,
comes from somewhere high above."        and to love a young woman
                                         that i don't understand."
                        - amy ray
                                                - suzanne vega

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 10:05:37 -0700
reply-to:     "amy j. putnam" <pegasus@crl.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "amy j. putnam" <pegasus@crl.com>
subject:      re: love on another right now dammit (nigc)
x-to:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
in-reply-to:  <pine.osf.3.95.961001122351.32682x-100000@alpha.delta.edu>

> the holy war the crusades  lets see your a homo so yoru going to hell your
> not a christain so your a heathen  nope christans dont attack at all do

just as a point of information here, the opposite of christian is not
necessarily heathen.  i do not think thre *is8 an opposite to
christian since ther are many mnay mnay religious traditions all
across this earth, and no one is better than another.  each is right for
those who follow it.  heathen=pagan=of the earth=nature based traditions.
and if you look closely at the laws of paganism and christianity,
i think you'd find lots of similiraties, esp since christianity
coopted muhc of paganism so the pagans would join the church.


amy p.                          /       who holds your hand
pegasus@crl.com                /        when you're alone
                              /
the original photo monk      /                  --patty larkin

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:44:31 edt
reply-to:     jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
subject:      re: oops...

on tue, 1 oct 1996 00:03:59 +0000 "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
writes:
>when i said "bible thumpers", i meant "bible bangers". that was the
>spiteful term used in jen hall's post.

oops.  i wrote my post before i read this.  i withdraw my comments
concerning bible thumper.

>and yes, i do believe that the traditional family is made up of a man
and a woman. what is wrong with that?

if that is what you choose to believe, that's fine.  but there are other
factors that make up a family other then a man and a woman.

>please go to the dictionary and look up the word "traditional".

tradition (from "the second college edition of the american heritage
dictionary)
1.  the passing down of elements of a culture from generation to
generation, esp. by oral communication.
2a. a mode of thought of behavior followed by a people continuously from
generation to generation, custom or usage.
2b. a set of such customs and usages viewed as a coherent body of
precedents influencing the present.
3. a body of unwritten religious precepts
4. a time-honored practice or a set of such practices
5. the transfer of property to another.

>i think you might find that the word perfectly define my definition of a
traditional >family. you might not like it, but it is traditional.

show me your way oh worldly one!  this doesn't define your definition of
a traditional family.  tradition doesn't = marriage.  tradition can mean
anything that is carried on from one generation to another.  like opening
your presents on christmas eve instead of christmas day.  this definition
does not prove your statement.

gee, maybe i'm the one that is wrong here, but i've received more
personal "thank you's" from list member then flames.  i will continue to
speak up for g&l rights until i'm personally asked not to- by members of
the g&l community. i don't want to make this list one whole fight - which
is it coming out to be.  so i either ask that someone start posting some
igc to get us out of this loop or lets continue fighting about g&l
rights.  i post my share of igc, but enjoy getting a full view of all the
list members here when they post nigc.  and do to this nigc, i have a
totally clear view of christopher.  even his sig tells me about him:

       "if it doesn't work, force it...
   if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway."

a bit violent, don'tcha think?  does this work for children and the
elderly too?

till next time,
- jen hall

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:44:31 edt
reply-to:     jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
subject:      re: public flame time

dwayne - dwayne - dwayne.  "dragonman" huh?  how manly of you.  are you
really as macho as your e-mail tag suggests?

on tue, 1 oct 1996 05:39:50 -0700 dragonman <djarrell@ix10.ix.netcom.com>
writes: at 01:33 am 10/1/96 -0700, you wrote:
> you are missing the point!!!!  while there are those who have all the
>time in the world and enjoy all of the wasted bandwidth, you are still
>wasting a lot of people's time and computer resources on ridiculous
things that
>could be a) taken to private e-mail or b) eliminated all together.  the
fact
>that you, or a few people like you, enjoy it is not an argument against
>greg's very valid points.

you don't have to yell.  the "nigc"  is designated (by the list masters)
to be used when non-ig content is being posted.  and i don't remember
jude stopping by saying that all the nigc is slowing the server down.  so
what, exactly, is your definition of bandwidth.  you know, there is a
newsgroup you can go to.  you don't "have" to be here.

plus, the igc is low because the girls are in the studio now.  but by all
means, you can start a productive igc thread.  go ahead - i dare ya -be a
productive human being.

>no! no! no! no! no! no! no! no! no! no!

aww.  he's yelling again.  boy, he's mad isn't he?

>"me too"'s are a complete waste of time and resources.  as of this
>point, i will privately flame every single "me too"er to get my point
across.
>damn it!  stop being inconsiderate and wasting people's time.  if you
want
>a fucking conversation, pick up the phone or use irc.

you go boy!  you be an asshole.  it's your gawd given right.

>and for god's sake, stop quoting all of the post that you are
>responding to! we have all read it once before if we ever gave a shit.

oh, like i'm doing and like you did?  ooh, i'm sorry.  i will make sure
that whatever i post from now on doesn't upset dragonman.  (did i say
what a "manly" name that was?)

oh and by the way, when you change the "subject" line, you need to
re-quote the original sender because from the subject line, we can't tell
what post you're referring to.

>officially pissed off,

apparently.

>"you can spend your time alone redigesting past regrets,
> or you can realize you're the only one who can forgive yourself
> makes much more sense to live in the present tense" - pearl jam

pearl jam? what the heck are you doing here?

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:44:31 edt
reply-to:     jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)

>but i will not stand by while you people call me a bible thumper!!

banger - - you're a bible banger - - not a bible thumper.  the key to
flaming is to get the text right.

>i have felt a little uncomfortable, but have never felt the
>urge to tell anyone here that they are wrong (in my eyes).

i'm sure the thousands of gays and lesbians have been feeling this for
years - - only to be told by those religious people <this is where i
would have normally put bible banger>  "who disapprove" - they they're
shit.

>why?? you dont know a thing about me!! how dare you attack my religion.

i'm sure thousands of gays and lesbians think this too.

>how can anyone possibly take hollywood's films, and use that as an

umm. these are real life films that were made into movies to illustrate
how unfamily-like "traditional families" can be...  they have them in
books too. they're called "real life drama".  kinda like "cops".  get it?

>why must you feel the need to attack us? what, please tell me, have i
>done to you,

ok.  i'm not gay, so i can't do this exercise.  but every gay and lesbian
on this list, please raise your hand if you've said this - even just once
- to stick up for yourself and defend yourself against homophobia.

> and said prayers for those who have shown that they are hurting.

oh, so now i'm a bad person for sticking up for the gays and lesbians?
oh, ok.  i'll go burn myself with an iron and go to a church and ask for
forgiveness for sticking up for others.  sorry, i didn't know it was a
sin to stick up for others who choose not to speak for themselves in fear
of being fired, kicked out of the family, etc. etc.

>does not give you the right to persecute us.

hey chris, are you gay?  you certainly have their lingo down? perhaps
walked in one gay & lesbian parade maybe?  gee, i could swear this is
what gays & lesbians have been telling you bible thumpers (if you prefer)
for decades.  gee, now the shoe is on the other foot.  how does it feel
bible boy?

>chris payne owen4@adnc.com
>
>(obviously, this is not directed at all of you, and i must apologize
>to the ones who had to read this, that had nothing to do with all of
>this)

that was sweet.

>       "if it doesn't work, force it...
>   if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway."

gee, how violent..  does that work for children and the elderly too?

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:44:31 edt
reply-to:     jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
subject:      re: nigc:  more anti-gay trash (yes, more nigc)

this is from dan perkins, who is temporily off the list.
======
lately it has been a somewhat bad time for gay/lesbian/bi-sexual rights
movement, what with president clinton signing the defense of marriage
act, individual states trying to pass similar legislation, and the
republicans, once again, thumping their collective chests and  grunting
about "family values".

the news about ellen degeneres' character perhaps coming out of the
closet has sparked yet more debate.

>"the 'ellen' news drew immediate fire from the american family
>association.  in a statement last week, afa founder donald wildmon
>said, 'this is a troubling movement in network programming.  if
touchstone
>does do this, advertisers will now have to make a choice.  either
withdraw
>their support of the show or reveal their true allegiances to themes
>which gnaw at traditional family values.' "

this comment is typical of organizations who want to perpetuate an issue
in a divisive, yes or no, black or white, up or down, us or them manner.
it
is simply a political ploy to get the non thinkers out there in t.v.
land to say "oh yea. well i can't support that!"  imho, it seems
comments like this are aimed at the few folks out there whose
intellectual pursuits are limited to the classic literature of reviews
of rereuns of three's  company.

in reality, imho, if advertisers choose to continue backing the ellen
program, even if the character does come out as a lesbian, then perhaps
they are not saying one darn thing about their "allegiances".

question: how can a huge company, like say general motors, have any sort
of "allegiance"? most companies that advertise on national television
are huge. they comprise a lot of individual people. some of whom are
likely homophobic, some of which are likely gay, lesbian, bisexual (or
supportive of).

again, imho, an advertiser who continues to support ellen will most
likely, simply be supporting their own product. trying to sell their
product. after all
that is what advertising is about, not about supporting or not
supporting a life style or political issue.  perhaps, given the
political climate around this issue, at some level they will be also
saying they believe in the constitution of the united states of america
and they support the first amendments guarantee of freedom of speech.
so, what does that mean about the advertisers who leave the program, if
ellen comes out. does it say that they don't support freedom of speech?
does it say they are homophobic? does it say they don't support love?
does it say they are to scared of the right wing conservative groups to
stand up for what they believe in?

i don't know the answers to these questions. i only know how i feel.
this week i am going to watch ellen and write down the names of
advertisers currently supporting the ellen show. then i will write to
them, telling them that i hope that they will continue supporting ellen,
especially if the character comes out of the closet, so that i may
continue purchasing their products. remember: in the united states money
talks.

also, if you feel strongly about this issue, fight for what's right.
join pflag (parents, family, friends of lesbian and gays), the human
rights campaign fund, the aclu, the gay, lesbian rights association or
any other gay, lesbian, bi-sexual rights group you can find.

and write to president clinton (who has lost my vote!) and let him know
how you feel about his signing of the defense of marriage act!

all right. enough. i hope to be back on the list in about 3 weeks!! see
you all soon!

peace and love,

dan perkins

--------- end forwarded message ----------

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 13:21:41 edt
reply-to:     "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
subject:      (nigc) dar concert 10/4 in boston

is anyone else on the list going to see dar at the somerville theatre
this friday (10/4)?  mini-list-meet at the someday cafe afterwards
anyone?  or perhaps pre-festivity frozen yougurt?

before anyone asks, i have no idea what the ticket availiability is
like.  i think the show is availiable through ticketbastard and the
somerville theatre direct (though you may have to call in the early
evening).  student discounts were availiable...

                                -- chris

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 13:38:37 -0400
reply-to:     christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
subject:      re: request to all listees (nigc)
x-to:         enhiver <enhiver@singnet.com.sg>
in-reply-to:  <199610011512.xaa07131@sunflower.singnet.com.sg>

on tue, 1 oct 1996, enhiver wrote:

> hi you people, i have a request :
>
> could the person who originally asked for everyone's astrological signs
> please post his/her address ? those interested in participating, please
> email privately to him/her.

uh, stepping forward reluctantly, that would be me, with one
clarification.  i did not ask for everyone's astrological signs, i merely
asked if anyone else had asked for everyone's astrological signs.  i
have, however, been keeping a loose track of it, and cancer and aries
seem to be ahead.  so, let me publicly and unequivocally apologise for
starting such a wierd conflict/thread/whatever.

my private e-mail is:

talbotc@umich.edu

everyone, please send future astrological info to that address, i'll
start keeping more exact track.

>
> and for those of y'all interested in the results, like if 80% of the list
> are aries or only 5% are pieces, please write to the person doing the
> compilation.
>
> this is a good survey, useful information for trading boots, 'cos if 80% of
> us are really aries, then surely more than 1 volunteer will be needed for
> this sign :-) .
>
> could we also do the same for any future surveys, useful or just plain
> silly ?? i sure the individuals compiling them will want to share their
> interesting results with us all anyway.

thanks!  that was actually the original intent of the post, for it to be
a useful survey--not for people to post ad infinitum about astrological
concerns.

while i'm at it, i'll go ahead and declare my public position--i don't
give a flying fuck about bandwidth conservation, length of signatures,
conservation of which.  i completely understand and sympathise with those
folks who receive list via digest format, there are problems, and for that
reason i keep my signature down to a roman numeral after my name and have
only ever posted 1 nigc message and try to be brief and considerate.  but
as far as making a judgement call about what i consider bandwidth waste
and too long a signature, i won't, i don't care about it!  whatever, don't
flame me.

yours,
chris ii

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 10:49:48 -0700
reply-to:     "kim : goddess in her own reality:)" <rcn@prcn.org>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "kim : goddess in her own reality:)" <rcn@prcn.org>
subject:      to the flame god

and publicly, (cause tracey home home home is my very good friend + i'm mad
as hell about this flame ) i say...
if you only knew the damage your mean spirited words have probably done.
people like us who do find enjoyment here on this list... who get joy and
find a certain acceptance out of "belonging" here have sometimes used it as
a touch stone + a lifeline. it is human contact... without strings attached,
with people who are both intelligent + fun. it is a good place to be, and a
great read. i refuse to feel unwelcome or give others the impression that
they and their views etc... the things that make this list the great thing
it is... are not welcome.how dare you try to trash that? got a point? make
it kindly.
get off your ignorant high horse and wander with humanity for a change. i
find it hard to believe that someone as meanspirited as you come across
could actually find something in the indigo-girl's music that you can relate to.
you are not the majority. thank god.
peace...kim (who's been through all this crap before + sees the list just
keep on growing in popularity...why? because we're fun + it's a cool list ).
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
      <just kim>rcn@prcn.org
"pain from pearls-hey little girl-
     how much have you grown?"
---------------amy ray------------------
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 13:39:20 -0400
reply-to:     mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
subject:      re: love on another right now dammit (nigc)
x-to:         "amy j. putnam" <pegasus@crl.com>
in-reply-to:  <pine.sun.3.91.961001100047.3773a-100000@crl.crl.com>

yes i know this paganism and christianity were suppose to work hand in
hand the christain church however didnt want that (3 faces of the goddes,
the tirnity) )howver as i stated pagans are much more tolaerant about
other relgiions then xtians

on tue, 1 oct 1996, amy j. putnam wrote:

>
> > the holy war the crusades  lets see your a homo so yoru going to hell your
> > not a christain so your a heathen  nope christans dont attack at all do
>
> just as a point of information here, the opposite of christian is not
> necessarily heathen.  i do not think thre *is8 an opposite to
> christian since ther are many mnay mnay religious traditions all
> across this earth, and no one is better than another.  each is right for
> those who follow it.  heathen=pagan=of the earth=nature based traditions.
> and if you look closely at the laws of paganism and christianity,
> i think you'd find lots of similiraties, esp since christianity
> coopted muhc of paganism so the pagans would join the church.
>
>
> amy p.                          /       who holds your hand
> pegasus@crl.com                /      when you're alone
>                               /
> the original photo monk      /                --patty larkin
>
>

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:46:26 -0500
reply-to:     arbatson@hsutx.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "hsu amber r. batson" <arbatson@hsutx.edu>
organization: hsu
subject:      re: nigc:  more anti-gay trash (yes, more nigc)

i totally agree with anna(chickensoprano). i've been planning to write
just about the same thing, but i'm a lazy, procrastinating freshman and
i'm busy w/ school.

i find myself tempted to see what it would be like to be gay, yet i
always have believed that it was a sin. however, i don't believe that
it's right to discriminate against homosexuals, look at the example
jesus set -- he associated with zacchaeus and the woman at the well,
both were outcasts and looked down on by their present society. yet he
had a message for them: repent and sin no more. i am confused about how
"gay christians" get around new testament bible verses like 1
corinthians 6:9-11, 1 timothy 1:9-11, and romans 1:18-32 not to mention
the old testament story of sodom and gomorrah (gay jews).

i am not pressing my views on anyone, i am just expressing them. if i
can get all of these stupid messages about astrological signs, i think i
am entitled to post at least one message expressing my views on this
subject that keeps popping up. if you are a gay jew or christian, please
email me. i would like to know how you interpret the above mentioned
verses or stories.

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 14:01:44 -0400
reply-to:     mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
subject:      re: love on another right now dammit (nigc)
x-to:         "amy j. putnam" <pegasus@crl.com>
in-reply-to:  <pine.sun.3.91.961001104327.6970b-100000@crl.crl.com>

a i didnt say u said it i did and b i didnt say it was offered ill see if
i can find the txt file my friend showed me who has since moved away
saying the 2 were to work hand in hand the both sides of the coin thing


on tue, 1 oct 1996, amy j. putnam wrote:

>
> >
> > yes i know this paganism and christianity were suppose to work hand in
> > hand the christain church however didnt want that (3 faces of the goddes,
> > the tirnity) )howver as i stated pagans are much more tolaerant about
> > other relgiions then xtians
> >
>
> no, that's not what i said.  i said christiantiy coopted pagan ways.
> not that they were working hand in hand.  why would they?  yeah pagans
> may be more accpeting but it is one thing to live side by side and
> another to "work" together.  they are different traditions.  they
> cant work together like that.  you make it sound as though paganism
> "offered" things like the triple goddess, which was incindetally renamed
> a christian trinity of male figureheads..  chrisitnaity *took* from
> paganism, aggressively.  i think it is a tremedous stretch to say
> any of it was *offered* by paganism (who would have done it anyway?
> there was no centralization ot pagansim as there was with the medieval
> church, since we are going to be historical here.
>
> >
>
> amy p.                          /       who holds your hand
> pegasus@crl.com                /      when you're alone
>                               /
> the original photo monk      /                --patty larkin
>
>

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 13:59:18 edt
reply-to:     mercy garland <mercy@ldgo.columbia.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mercy garland <mercy@ldgo.columbia.edu>
subject:      igc at the very end, but more christianity talk first!

first off, i apologize to anyone that is tired of this thread, i am a
lurker all the way back to the days when stephen spencer operated the list,
so it seems strange that my first post would be heavily non ig, i will try
work in a ig related question by the end, so anyone craving igc and igc
only, skip to the end!

anna, thanks for you post expressing some of thoughts and views.  in the
past i have felt uncomfortable speaking about my "religious" life because
of commonly held stereotypes. i agree with you- not all christians are bad
people!  fortunately, i have never had to choose between my gay sexuality
and participation in my church.  both parts of my life co-exist with each
other in a very meaningful and nurturing way.

i am interested in your statement that "true believers of christ will say
that homosexuality is a sin because it is written in the old and new
testament."  i know the apostle paul, the most prolific writer of the nt
had some very strong opinions on marriage and the role of the sexes, but
jesus never stated an opinion on homosexuality, pro or con.  he did say a
lot about love and compassion.  and i do not think this means homosexuals
somehow need special compassion (or even worse!) sympathy.  i think it is
dangerous when we get into who is saving who:  "we'll love the homosexuals,
we'll help them understand their sin and get them to repent!"  ick! instant
hierarchy!  my feeling is this- i am not a sinner because i am gay, i am a
sinner because i am human.  and like you said- none of us are perfect, sin
is part of human nature.  the root of the word sin is "without" and i think
the worst things to live without are love, compassion, grace and
generosity.  i know a lot of "secular" people that have a greater capacity
for these things than people that "grew up in the faith."  for me, however,
having the "structure" of my religion and church has been extremely
helpful.

what it comes down to is this- how do you live your life?  how do you
incorporate love into your life, and how do you treat others?  beliefs are
important, but they are like "best intentions"- you have to act on your
beliefs for them to have any meaning.  i teach sunday school, and lead the
youth group in my church with another adult, who is also, coincidentally,
gay.  we start with a bible lesson, but we try to turn it into questions
about how we live.  i'd be much happier if these kids grew up remembering
to feed the hungry rather than only memorizing bible passages.   if you're
gonna talk the talk, then walk the walk!  anyway- thanks for the
opportunity to de-lurk and ramble on...

ig question- if you could pick one "emily" song that you would like to hear
amy sing lead, which would it be... likewise, which "amy" song would you
like to hear emily sing lead?

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:50:49 -0400
reply-to:     mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)
x-to:         james finn <jfinn@hotmail.com>
in-reply-to:  <96oct1.051319pdt.1610830(5)@constitution.hotmail.com>

have u thought about handfasting??

on mon, 30 sep 1996, james finn wrote:

> on sep 20 alec@nyc.pipeline.com wrote about the dilemmas facing g&l partners
> accesing traditional religious weddings, particularly the
> <"be fertile and increase" type thing.
>
> ths is not so much of problem of sexuality as procreation.  straight coupls not
> wanting to have kids are in exactly the same boat.
>
> i think the importance of any ritual is in it's interpretation for the
> particpants rather than it's literal meaning.  otherwise people would still be
> slaughtering lambs to sprinkle the blood over the front steps of their homes.
>
> surely any public celebration of love and commitment "increases" some
> understanding of everyone's rights to rites; "increases" access to appropriate
> role models; and "increases" they g&l community's relavence to traditional
> religion and vice versa.
>
> i think that's quite metaphorically "fertile".
>
> my partner and i have been trying to work out what sort of ceremony we will
> have for three and half years, and find it difficult to find any rituals we
> both want or don't feel silly for us as two guys.  the only exception is
> playing tws (is that the right way to say the wood song?)
>
> this is my first ever posting to a mail list so please excuse any errors in
> transmission or protcol.
>
> fnor
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------
> get your *web-based* free email at http://www.hotmail.com
> ---------------------------------------------------------
>
> --
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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 30 sep 1996 19:22:38 -0400
reply-to:     jennings_sharon/furman@furman.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "<sharon jennings>" <jennings_sharon/furman@furman.edu>
subject:      nigc; band de soleil
x-to:         teddie@telepath.com
in-reply-to:  <01bbaeec.d97d4100@zoom2011.telepath.com>

> howdy!
>
> we were just looking at the daemon records web site, and on the
audio/visual pag
> e, there are two albums listed for band de soleil. one we have,
redemption dream
> , the other is called bird on fire, and is not available from daemon.
does anyon
> e know where we could get a copy of this? is it newer or older than
redemption d
> ream? anyone? anyone? also, the latest daemon catalog says that bds has
been sig
> ned to a major indie label (not daemon??) and that a new album is coming
out. do
> es anyone have any more info on this and/or when the new album will be
out?? tha
> nks for the space!
>
> peace,
> susan and jocelyn

sorry that this reply is going to the whole list but the crap (please
excuse my language) software doesn't allow me to reply to just the sender.

band de soleil have been signed to velvel and the new album "bird on fire"
will be released in january according to michelle. this will be their
second aalbum.

sharon

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 13:53:59 -0400
reply-to:     mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
subject:      not bloody ig related but read anyhow about band with
x-cc:         bobbi gorden <rjgorden@alpha.delta.edu>

alright now folks are bitching abotu band with i have a simple solution u
can thank me later u folks who have to pay for band with (only ones i can
think of is folks on prodigy and stuff like that) do yoruself and all of
us a favor go to http://www.juno.com adn get a copy of juno sent to u it
is a free internet email  box totally free no strings attached with a 1800
number for folks who dont have a local access number then u transfer your
list subscription there and bingo no more bandwith worries plain and
simple
smile  hugs anthony van pyre the problem solver

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 14:46:35 -0400
reply-to:     anne holderried <annieh@mitl.research.panasonic.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         anne holderried <annieh@mitl.research.panasonic.com>
subject:      re: igc at the very end, but more christianity talk first!
x-to:         mercy garland <mercy@ldgo.columbia.edu>

at 01:59 pm 10/1/96 edt, mercy garland wrote:
>first off, i apologize to anyone that is tired of this thread, i am a
>lurker all the way back to the days when stephen spencer operated the list,
>so it seems strange that my first post would be heavily non ig, i will try
>work in a ig related question by the end, so anyone craving igc and igc
>only, skip to the end!
>
>anna, thanks for you post expressing some of thoughts and views.  in the
>past i have felt uncomfortable speaking about my "religious" life because
>of commonly held stereotypes. i agree with you- not all christians are bad
>people!  fortunately, i have never had to choose between my gay sexuality
>and participation in my church.  both parts of my life co-exist with each
>other in a very meaningful and nurturing way.
>
>i am interested in your statement that "true believers of christ will say
>that homosexuality is a sin because it is written in the old and new
>testament."  i know the apostle paul, the most prolific writer of the nt
>had some very strong opinions on marriage and the role of the sexes, but
>jesus never stated an opinion on homosexuality, pro or con.  he did say a
>lot about love and compassion.  and i do not think this means homosexuals
>somehow need special compassion (or even worse!) sympathy.  i think it is
>dangerous when we get into who is saving who:  "we'll love the homosexuals,
>we'll help them understand their sin and get them to repent!"  ick! instant
>hierarchy!  my feeling is this- i am not a sinner because i am gay, i am a
>sinner because i am human.  and like you said- none of us are perfect, sin
>is part of human nature.  the root of the word sin is "without" and i think
>the worst things to live without are love, compassion, grace and
>generosity.  i know a lot of "secular" people that have a greater capacity
>for these things than people that "grew up in the faith."  for me, however,
>having the "structure" of my religion and church has been extremely
>helpful.
>
>what it comes down to is this- how do you live your life?  how do you
>incorporate love into your life, and how do you treat others?  beliefs are
>important, but they are like "best intentions"- you have to act on your
>beliefs for them to have any meaning.  i teach sunday school, and lead the
>youth group in my church with another adult, who is also, coincidentally,
>gay.  we start with a bible lesson, but we try to turn it into questions
>about how we live.  i'd be much happier if these kids grew up remembering
>to feed the hungry rather than only memorizing bible passages.   if you're
>gonna talk the talk, then walk the walk!  anyway- thanks for the
>opportunity to de-lurk and ramble on...
>
>ig question- if you could pick one "emily" song that you would like to hear
>amy sing lead, which would it be... likewise, which "amy" song would you
>like to hear emily sing lead?
>
>--
>administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
>to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
>        with the line: signoff indigo-girls
>
>

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 11:28:58 -0500
reply-to:     tracy - czar of failure <clumber@smtp.prostar.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         tracy - czar of failure <clumber@smtp.prostar.com>
subject:      da' public flame

to be as brief as possible:
        i am usually annoyed by "me too" posts also... annoyed... not sent
into a tizzy.  (that was said with a happy silly grin, btw).  in that case
(my case) i sent a "me too" simply to back up andrea's position without
going into a long explanation of why.  i have sent longer explanations to
this list regarding how i feel about tangents on a couple occasions in the
past and assume that even greg has read them before.  i do get tired of
repeating myself.  my sig (not written self-righteously, but i can see why
it could be read that way... perhaps i should learn how to do a goofy grin
in ascii?) has been used on several occasions before, and usually it gets
laughs.  this was the first time that i know of that it seems to have pissed
anyone off.
        yup - i would agree i post a lot of garbage... no doubt about it.
but my garbage of late as been intended to make folks smile when it seems
like there are several "heavy issues" going on and the thought of y'all
frowning at your monitors bummed me out. oh well. i tried.

tracy <reverting to my old sig>

i may believe something passionately,
               that does not make me right.
i may disagree with you fervently
               that does not make you wrong.
keep talking.  the vital lessons are those that force me
                to change my mind.

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 14:40:02 -0500
reply-to:     arbatson@hsutx.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "hsu amber r. batson" <arbatson@hsutx.edu>
organization: hsu
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)

ok, i'm an ignorant freshman in college and even i know that there are
good and bad people in every group. whether you are talking about
homosexuals, heterosexuals, african-americans, hispanics, anglos,
asians, or purple people. i know someone who was sexually abused by a
homosexual man while living in a foster home. does that mean that i
think all homosexuals are perverts? no. come on people, just relax. not
all christians and heterosexuals are bad, just as not all homosexuals
and hetero-sexuals are bad. in this post, as in my previous post, i
might not have expressed myself totally well. don't be quick to flame
me!

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 14:52:47 -0400
reply-to:     anne holderried <annieh@mitl.research.panasonic.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         anne holderried <annieh@mitl.research.panasonic.com>
subject:      re: igc at the very end, but more christianity talk first!
x-to:         mercy garland <mercy@ldgo.columbia.edu>

mercy rules!!

you go girl!!  thanks for taking the time to respond so eloquently!


annieh

at 01:59 pm 10/1/96 edt, mercy garland wrote:
>first off, i apologize to anyone that is tired of this thread, i am a
>lurker all the way back to the days when stephen spencer operated the list,
>so it seems strange that my first post would be heavily non ig, i will try
>work in a ig related question by the end, so anyone craving igc and igc
>only, skip to the end!
>
>anna, thanks for you post expressing some of thoughts and views.  in the
>past i have felt uncomfortable speaking about my "religious" life because
>of commonly held stereotypes. i agree with you- not all christians are bad
>people!  fortunately, i have never had to choose between my gay sexuality
>and participation in my church.  both parts of my life co-exist with each
>other in a very meaningful and nurturing way.
>
>i am interested in your statement that "true believers of christ will say
>that homosexuality is a sin because it is written in the old and new
>testament."  i know the apostle paul, the most prolific writer of the nt
>had some very strong opinions on marriage and the role of the sexes, but
>jesus never stated an opinion on homosexuality, pro or con.  he did say a
>lot about love and compassion.  and i do not think this means homosexuals
>somehow need special compassion (or even worse!) sympathy.  i think it is
>dangerous when we get into who is saving who:  "we'll love the homosexuals,
>we'll help them understand their sin and get them to repent!"  ick! instant
>hierarchy!  my feeling is this- i am not a sinner because i am gay, i am a
>sinner because i am human.  and like you said- none of us are perfect, sin
>is part of human nature.  the root of the word sin is "without" and i think
>the worst things to live without are love, compassion, grace and
>generosity.  i know a lot of "secular" people that have a greater capacity
>for these things than people that "grew up in the faith."  for me, however,
>having the "structure" of my religion and church has been extremely
>helpful.
>
>what it comes down to is this- how do you live your life?  how do you
>incorporate love into your life, and how do you treat others?  beliefs are
>important, but they are like "best intentions"- you have to act on your
>beliefs for them to have any meaning.  i teach sunday school, and lead the
>youth group in my church with another adult, who is also, coincidentally,
>gay.  we start with a bible lesson, but we try to turn it into questions
>about how we live.  i'd be much happier if these kids grew up remembering
>to feed the hungry rather than only memorizing bible passages.   if you're
>gonna talk the talk, then walk the walk!  anyway- thanks for the
>opportunity to de-lurk and ramble on...
>
>ig question- if you could pick one "emily" song that you would like to hear
>amy sing lead, which would it be... likewise, which "amy" song would you
>like to hear emily sing lead?
>
>--
>administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
>to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
>        with the line: signoff indigo-girls
>
>

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 15:05:55 est
reply-to:     "paul j. sgroi" <paul_j._sgroi@ccmail.c-tec.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "paul j. sgroi" <paul_j._sgroi@ccmail.c-tec.com>
subject:      nigc: christianity & stuff...

     okay, i'm straight, a husband & father, and have some very close
                friends who have come-out in recent years. i have to agree
                with the person who said gay/lesbians are more tolerant
                of 'different' lifestyles. that's my experience, anyway.
                i too, am tolerant, or non-judgemental of any lifestyle.
                maybe, that's why i get along with anybody.

     okay, what did i want to say:  all of this talk of christianity, and
                religion, has reminded me of something i read a long time
                ago that reads "people who are religious are doing their
                best to stay outta hell, spiritual people have already
                been there!" imho, that's the key! spirituality is that
                lightness that one feels, when they can just be!

     hope that makes sense, it does to me

     ---you are all a great bunch of people, i love having a common
               interest(ig) with y'all, and really do respect all of
               the nigc views i read. now, i don't always agree,
               but you have my respect!

     can i conclude with another saying i picked-up in my travels:

     "take what you like and leave the rest"
                                              that's what i do
                                                                ...paul

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 12:39:57 pst
reply-to:     sarah scilley <sarah_scilley@ccmail.uoregon.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sarah scilley <sarah_scilley@ccmail.uoregon.edu>
subject:      your vote, doma, and reality (nigc)

a recent comment on the list has spurred this post.  it is a plea for
intelligent thought and not a campaign speech.

since it's election year and most of us are realizing that we should be
concerned for our basic rights, i'm making a plea to each and every one of us
to think about the big picture and the reality of the situation.

there are many people in the gay and lesbian community that feel betrayed by
president clinton and his signing of doma.  there are a few voices out there
who are mad enough to not vote for him.  i'm making the plea for people to vote
with their heads and not there emotions because the alternative to another four
years of bill clinton terrifies me.

nanci griffith said it pretty well at bumbershoot, "if you don't want george
bush and the christian coalition in your bedroom.  don't vote for him!"  i
would add to that by saying that it is not enough to not vote for someone whom
you do not what to "represent" you, you must make your vote count.  it is
always better to vote than to not vote at all, but when the consequences of
your vote have such a serious impact on societies evolving social issues, you
must invest your vote where it will have the greatest impact.

bill clinton is not the perfect canidate.  his administration, however, is
certainly more gay friendy than any that has preceded him.  more importantly
though, he is the only realistic candidate that can keep george bush from
joining and redoubling forces with newt gingrich and a republican dominated
congress.

if we divide our vote, we will be handing the popular vote to george bush.

please think about the power of you're vote.  there are many people on this
list that could be seriously affected by the outcome of this election and the
next four years.

thanks for listening,

sarah
sarah_scilley@ccmail.uoregon.edu


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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 10:48:53 -0700
reply-to:     "amy j. putnam" <pegasus@crl.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "amy j. putnam" <pegasus@crl.com>
subject:      re: love on another right now dammit (nigc)
x-to:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
in-reply-to:  <pine.osf.3.95.961001133805.11118b-100000@alpha.delta.edu>

>
> yes i know this paganism and christianity were suppose to work hand in
> hand the christain church however didnt want that (3 faces of the goddes,
> the tirnity) )howver as i stated pagans are much more tolaerant about
> other relgiions then xtians
>

no, that's not what i said.  i said christiantiy coopted pagan ways.
not that they were working hand in hand.  why would they?  yeah pagans
may be more accpeting but it is one thing to live side by side and
another to "work" together.  they are different traditions.  they
cant work together like that.  you make it sound as though paganism
"offered" things like the triple goddess, which was incindetally renamed
a christian trinity of male figureheads.  chrisitnaity *took* from
paganism, aggressively.  i think it is a tremedous stretch to say
any of it was *offered* by paganism (who would have done it anyway?
there was no centralization ot pagansim as there was with the medieval
church, since we are going to be historical here.

>

amy p.                          /       who holds your hand
pegasus@crl.com                /        when you're alone
                              /
the original photo monk      /                  --patty larkin

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 13:04:06 -0500
reply-to:     "jenn. brown" <jennb@owlnet.rice.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "jenn. brown" <jennb@owlnet.rice.edu>
subject:      re: love on another right now dammit (nigc)
in-reply-to:  <pine.osf.3.95.961001122351.32682x-100000@alpha.delta.edu>

i think the major conflict about this "bible thumper" thing is the use of
_that phrase_. i am a christian as well, and i find that offensive.
perhaps there are some people who don't, but i do. it's like when people
call lesbians "dykes" or gay men "fags"--not everyone minds that label,
but some people do. in referring to christians that the "referrer"
has no conflict with, it is just so much easier/nicer:)/more appropriate
to use a word that has no negative connotations.

hoping i haven't made a horrible mistake by posting,
jenn.


:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
jennifer nell brown                 :                          630-8530
jenn./jenni b                       :             jennb@owlnet.rice.edu
english major and procrastinator    :            lovett college, rm 305
   extraordinaire                   :      //www.owlnet.rice.edu/~jennb

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 14:12:19 -0400
reply-to:     amy lynn carpenter <carpen48@pilot.msu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         amy lynn carpenter <carpen48@pilot.msu.edu>
subject:      ahhhh!

dear list-
    we all go through enough bullshit in our day.  when it comes to my email, i
do not want to see this crap about my sexuality being a sin.  especially on the
ig list.  if you want to have a big moral philosophical debate with all your
bible quotes, please do it elsewhere.
this is ridiculous.

there is enough hate out there to deal with daily.  even if i don't read this
trash, i still have to see it repeatedly showing up on my email.
please stop!

amy c.

please address all flames to me instead of flooding the list.
carpen48@pilot.msu.edu

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 17:05:00 -0700
reply-to:     marianne barlow <mlb1@axe.humboldt.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         marianne barlow <mlb1@axe.humboldt.edu>
subject:      re: is anyone else getting this?
x-to:         sundara <smurphy@ups.edu>
in-reply-to:  <v01530500ae75c0bc5df2@[192.220.223.83]>

on mon, 30 sep 1996, sundara wrote:

> >sorry. your message could not be delivered to:
> >
> >adrienne bloch (the name was not found at the remote site. check that the name
> >has been entered correctly.)
> >
>
> who is this adrienne bloch?  why is everything i post to the list returned
> with this little note?  i don't like to publicly post this kinda stuff to
> the list,  but i was just curious if anyone else is getting these.
> hmmmm....

yes, i am getting this message too, but i always laugh when i see it
because i pity the poor person who can't read all of our lovely
messages.  sigh....oh well..  =)

the lone coyote

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 14:04:32 -0700
reply-to:     kristina <andrade@az.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         kristina <andrade@az.com>
subject:      favorite non-song quote

well most of my favorite non-song quotes have already been mentioned but
i forget if someone sent this one in yet:

i loved it when emily said this about her dulcimer (at the b-shoot show):

emily: got a screwdriver? oh man, this is bad... yeah we gotta play a
different song to get this tuned y'all, sorry. it's got a life of its
own.. it's got satan in it!

kristina

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
trying to read                                               andrade@az.com
the greek upon the stars                         http://www.az.com/~andrade

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 16:51:07 +0000
reply-to:     "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)
x-to:         jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>

jen hall wrote:
>
> >but i will not stand by while you people call me a bible thumper!!
>
> banger - - you're a bible banger - - not a bible thumper.  the key to
> flaming is to get the text right.

i fixed that in my next post.

> >i have felt a little uncomfortable, but have never felt the
> >urge to tell anyone here that they are wrong (in my eyes).
>
> i'm sure the thousands of gays and lesbians have been feeling this for
> years - - only to be told by those religious people <this is where i
> would have normally put bible banger>  "who disapprove" - they they're
> shit.

but *i* never have, so when you lump me in with all the others who do, i
get defensive.

> >why?? you dont know a thing about me!! how dare you attack my religion.
>
> i'm sure thousands of gays and lesbians think this too.

ok, so turnabout is fair play, i see. i'm sorry, i didnt realize that
two wrongs now mad a right.

> >how can anyone possibly take hollywood's films, and use that as an
>
> umm. these are real life films that were made into movies to illustrate
> how unfamily-like "traditional families" can be...  they have them in
> books too. they're called "real life drama".  kinda like "cops".  get it?

yeah, i get it. but one point you missed is that straight and gay
marriages are both equally susceptible to problems such as abuse, and
neglect, etc. or are you saying that all gay/lesbians are perfect?

> >why must you feel the need to attack us? what, please tell me, have i
> >done to you,
>
> ok.  i'm not gay, so i can't do this exercise.  but every gay and lesbian
> on this list, please raise your hand if you've said this - even just once
> - to stick up for yourself and defend yourself against homophobia.

i am not homophobic, and have a homosexual friend. once again two wrongs
do not make a right.

> > and said prayers for those who have shown that they are hurting.
>
> oh, so now i'm a bad person for sticking up for the gays and lesbians?
> oh, ok.  i'll go burn myself with an iron and go to a church and ask for
> forgiveness for sticking up for others.  sorry, i didn't know it was a
> sin to stick up for others who choose not to speak for themselves in fear
> of being fired, kicked out of the family, etc. etc.

give it a rest jen. that's not what i was saying and you know it. you
were doing more slamming of our/my beliefs than defending the
gay/lesbians.

> >does not give you the right to persecute us.
>
> hey chris, are you gay?  you certainly have their lingo down? perhaps
> walked in one gay & lesbian parade maybe?  gee, i could swear this is
> what gays & lesbians have been telling you bible thumpers (if you prefer)
> for decades.  gee, now the shoe is on the other foot.  how does it feel
> bible boy?

now this is getting childish. i am real sorry you had to take it this
far. i said those words for precisely the reason that you mention. it
reminded you of how the gay/lesbian community has been attacked. i didnt
want to see it happen to the straight minority that happen to be on this
list. shoe on the other foot? bible boy? grow up jen. i never ever
participated in or condoned any anitgay bashing, or reteric. so to put
the shoe on my foot, is to put it on an innocent man. you are showing
your lack of maturity now.

> >chris payne owen4@adnc.com
> >
> >(obviously, this is not directed at all of you, and i must apologize
> >to the ones who had to read this, that had nothing to do with all of
> >this)
>
> that was sweet.
>
> >       "if it doesn't work, force it...
> >   if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway."
>
> gee, how violent..  does that work for children and the elderly too?

once again you have gone too far. to make a statement that i mean that
sig to be hostile in any way to anyone, is simply irresponsible. it is a
joke, you do understand humor dont you?

so in closing. the point was to make those of you who are bashing the
christians here, that we have the right to our beliefs without being
attacked. just the same as you have the right to your beliefs, without
being attacked. jen, however, does not seem to have the maturity to
understand this without trying to put me down in almost every paragraph.

chris payne owen4@adnc.com

--

       "if it doesn't work, force it...
   if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway."

--
administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 20:17:38 -0500
reply-to:     m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
subject:      nigc-dodgers, padres & fairness

christopher wrote...

>>i remember 2 or 3 posts about the dastardly padres not giving up
and
letting your dodgers win the west, not too long ago.

i have to say that the last month has been a very exciting one for
both
our teams, and it couldnt have been scripted any better. but my
padres
swept the dodgers in 3 games to win the west!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

wooooooooooohoooooooooooo pads nl west champs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

sorry, but its been 12 years since we have had a reason to celebrate.
<<<<<<<


it's been a sad few days for me.

first, the padres, acted like "giant-imposters" and defeated my
dodgers.  twas a sad day at the gordon home for the athletically
deranged.  i used to think that the lowest sub-phylum was to be a
"giant".  i guess the correct answer, now, is a padre-fan.

i may be in mourning; i may hate the the padres (& giants), but i am
not totally without class.

chris...congratulations on your sweep.  it's tough to go into someone
elses' backyard & win 3 straight.  i do hope you beat the cards.  the
best of luck.

now, my dodgers...they get to play the braves.  i think it's time to
go into mourning.  can someone please explain how a pitcher (nomo)
throws a no-hitter in coloroado and then loses at home to the padres.
somethings are just beyond my comprehension...sob, sob

bye!

melissa

--
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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 17:02:56 +0000
reply-to:     "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
subject:      re: oops...
x-to:         jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>

>
> gee, maybe i'm the one that is wrong here, but i've received more
> personal "thank you's" from list member then flames.  i will continue to
> speak up for g&l rights until i'm personally asked not to- by members of
> the g&l community.

gee that's funny, i have recieved thank you notes from the straight
christians on this list who tell me they are afraid to speak up, for
fear of being openly flamed for their beliefs. i wonder if all of those
people started posting in defense of our beliefs, how would this be
recieved? i still dont understand how you can lump all of us together,
as bad people. like i said you dont know me.

i don't want to make this list one whole fight - which
> is it coming out to be.  so i either ask that someone start posting some
> igc to get us out of this loop or lets continue fighting about g&l
> rights.  i post my share of igc, but enjoy getting a full view of all the
> list members here when they post nigc.  and do to this nigc, i have a
> totally clear view of christopher.  even his sig tells me about him:
>
>        "if it doesn't work, force it...
>    if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway."
>
> a bit violent, don'tcha think?  does this work for children and the
> elderly too?

give it a rest jen. seems to me that you are just looking for another
point to make here. it is a joke. it happens to apply to machinery, and
i have to wonder why you took it the way you did. the children and
elderly thing were a product or your own mind's interpretation. so what
should this tell us about you?

chris
> till next time,
>  - jen hall
>
> --
> administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
> to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
>         with the line: signoff indigo-girls

--

       "if it doesn't work, force it...
   if it breaks, it needed replacing anyway."

--
administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
        with the line: signoff indigo-girls
=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 20:19:44 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      re: igc at the very end, but more christianity talk first!

>date: tue, 01 oct 1996 17:18:30 -0500
>to: mercy garland <mercy@ldgo.columbia.edu>
>from: abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
>subject: re: igc at the very end, but more christianity talk first!
>
>my amy/emily role reversal for songs are kind of weird picks, but here goes:
>
>for amy: wouldn't it be incredible to hear her version of fare thee well.
it would be so low and beautiful, either as a duet with emily or as a solo.
>
>for emily: i'd like to hear em take a stab at pushin the needle too far. it
would be really different, but i think she'd add some interesting twists to
the song.
>
>just some quirky suggestions from abigail~
>
>
>
>
>
>at 01:59 pm 10/1/96 edt, you wrote:
>>first off, i apologize to anyone that is tired of this thread, i am a
>>lurker all the way back to the days when stephen spencer operated the list,
>>so it seems strange that my first post would be heavily non ig, i will try
>>work in a ig related question by the end, so anyone craving igc and igc
>>only, skip to the end!
>>
>>anna, thanks for you post expressing some of thoughts and views.  in the
>>past i have felt uncomfortable speaking about my "religious" life because
>>of commonly held stereotypes. i agree with you- not all christians are bad
>>people!  fortunately, i have never had to choose between my gay sexuality
>>and participation in my church.  both parts of my life co-exist with each
>>other in a very meaningful and nurturing way.
>>
>>i am interested in your statement that "true believers of christ will say
>>that homosexuality is a sin because it is written in the old and new
>>testament."  i know the apostle paul, the most prolific writer of the nt
>>had some very strong opinions on marriage and the role of the sexes, but
>>jesus never stated an opinion on homosexuality, pro or con.  he did say a
>>lot about love and compassion.  and i do not think this means homosexuals
>>somehow need special compassion (or even worse!) sympathy.  i think it is
>>dangerous when we get into who is saving who:  "we'll love the homosexuals,
>>we'll help them understand their sin and get them to repent!"  ick! instant
>>hierarchy!  my feeling is this- i am not a sinner because i am gay, i am a
>>sinner because i am human.  and like you said- none of us are perfect, sin
>>is part of human nature.  the root of the word sin is "without" and i think
>>the worst things to live without are love, compassion, grace and
>>generosity.  i know a lot of "secular" people that have a greater capacity
>>for these things than people that "grew up in the faith."  for me, however,
>>having the "structure" of my religion and church has been extremely
>>helpful.
>>
>>what it comes down to is this- how do you live your life?  how do you
>>incorporate love into your life, and how do you treat others?  beliefs are
>>important, but they are like "best intentions"- you have to act on your
>>beliefs for them to have any meaning.  i teach sunday school, and lead the
>>youth group in my church with another adult, who is also, coincidentally,
>>gay.  we start with a bible lesson, but we try to turn it into questions
>>about how we live.  i'd be much happier if these kids grew up remembering
>>to feed the hungry rather than only memorizing bible passages.   if you're
>>gonna talk the talk, then walk the walk!  anyway- thanks for the
>>opportunity to de-lurk and ramble on...
>>
>>ig question- if you could pick one "emily" song that you would like to hear
>>amy sing lead, which would it be... likewise, which "amy" song would you
>>like to hear emily sing lead?
>>
>>--
>>administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
>>to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
>>        with the line: signoff indigo-girls
>>
>>
>
"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

--
administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 20:19:48 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      nigc: homosexual rabbis

hi, this is a completely nigc post, but since we're kind of on a religion
spree, i'm wondering if anyone out there is gay and a rabbi and would be
willing to e-mail me to tell me about it. i know that hebrew union college
has officailly oked ordaining gays and lesbians, but i'd imagine it might be
hard finding a position with a congragation if you are out. i'm thinking
about possible future careers and am genuinely interested in how judaism
views homosexuality in general. if anyone can help me, i'd appreciate it!
thanks!


~abigail

"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

--
administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
        with the line: signoff indigo-girls
=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 20:41:36 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      nigc: shawn colvin on world cafe

hi guys,

shawn colvin's live, in-studio interview and performance is going to be
aired tonight on world cafe at a little after 9:00 pm central time, thought
someone out there might be interested!

~abigail

"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

--
administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
        with the line: signoff indigo-girls
=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 16:10:24 -0700
reply-to:     "jessica owen (general)" <a-jessio@microsoft.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "jessica owen (general)" <a-jessio@microsoft.com>
subject:      re: to the flame god
x-to:         "kim : goddess in her own reality:)" <rcn@prcn.org>

preach it sister!


jessi

the fruit of silence is prayer.
the fruit of prayer is faith.
the fruit of faith is love.
the fruit of love is service.
the fruit of service is peace.
-mother teresa


>----------
>from:  kim : goddess in her own reality:)[smtp:rcn@prcn.org]
>sent:  tuesday, october 01, 1996 10:49 am
>to:    multiple recipients of list indigo-girls
>subject:       to the flame god
>
>and publicly, (cause tracey home home home is my very good friend + i'm mad
>as hell about this flame ) i say...
>if you only knew the damage your mean spirited words have probably done.
>people like us who do find enjoyment here on this list... who get joy and
>find a certain acceptance out of "belonging" here have sometimes used it as
>a touch stone + a lifeline. it is human contact... without strings attached,
>with people who are both intelligent + fun. it is a good place to be, and a
>great read. i refuse to feel unwelcome or give others the impression that
>they and their views etc... the things that make this list the great thing
>it is... are not welcome.how dare you try to trash that? got a point? make
>it kindly.
>get off your ignorant high horse and wander with humanity for a change. i
>find it hard to believe that someone as meanspirited as you come across
>could actually find something in the indigo-girl's music that you can relate
>to.
>you are not the majority. thank god.
>peace...kim (who's been through all this crap before + sees the list just
>keep on growing in popularity...why? because we're fun + it's a cool list ).
><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
>      <just kim>rcn@prcn.org
> "pain from pearls-hey little girl-
>     how much have you grown?"
>---------------amy ray------------------
><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
>
>--
>administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
>to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
>        with the line: signoff indigo-girls
>

--
administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 21:51:09 -0400
reply-to:     deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
subject:      hte concert/events from hte foundation

hey all in indigo land!

i got this today and thought it was igc that y'all might be interested in it.

take care and peace!

-deb

forwarded message:
> from honor-announce-owner@m2.monsterbit.com  tue oct  1 18:19:55 1996
> date: tue, 01 oct 1996 16:55:23 -0500 (cdt)
> from: owner-honor-announce@m2.monsterbit.com
> to: doobie@student.umass.edu
> message-id: <199610012155.qaa14039@m2.monsterbit.com>
> content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
> x-authentication-warning: m2.monsterbit.com: majordom set sender to
>  owner-honor-announce using -f
>
> end
> sender: owner-honor-announce
> precedence: bulk
>
> honor the earth campaign report
> september 30, 1996
>
> thanks to everyone for their help and hard work to make the honor cd
> release events in new york and minneapolis a huge success.  attached is a
> summary report that will give you an indication of the positive
> promotional and financial impact of these two events.
>
> as you know, we are now gearing up for the malibu event scheduled for
> october 17 at the shangri-la studios.  you should all receive invitations
> to this event by early next week.
>
> for your friends and colleagues who wish to rsvp to the evening
> reception, the la rsvp phone number is:  310-281-0476.
>
> for all other questions you may have, please call the hte team at dex.
>
> the proposed itinerary for the day of october 17 includes the following:
>
> 10:30 am      press conference at the santa monica pier
> 12:00 noon    live in the music hall performances
> 1:30 pm       honor cd autograph party at virgin megastore, beverly hills
> 7:00 pm       shangri-la event begins
>
> the final schedule will be set to fit the artists schedule.
>
> the event in malibu has already built significant momentum in the music,
> media and retail industries:
>
> l.a. radio market promotion-- ksca/fm 101.9:
>
> ksca/fm 101.9 is the top music station in the la market.  the station is
> hosting a set of exciting and valuable promotional opportunities for the
> campaign, including:
>
> silent auction
> virgin megastores (sunset,costa mesa/irvine and burbank) and fm 101.9
> will host a silent auction of priceless donated items (i.e. a drum head
> signed by toad the wet sprocket).  each store will house a window display
> of the silent auction merchandise for one week, beginning monday, october
> 7 and running through monday, october 21st.  these window displays will
> tie-in with window and in-store displays of the honor cd, and assist in
> promoting the cd, the october 17 virgin megastore autograph party, and
> the evening event at shangri-la, while increasing revenue for the
> campaign.
>
> ksca/fm 101.9 will provide the on-air promotion of the silent auction and
> instruct listeners through the weeks to come by the virgin megastore
> locations to bid on the silent auction merchandise.
>
> note:  we need donated items for the auction.  these can be musical gifts
> signed and donated by artists or gifts from the beneficiary and
> sponsoring groups, like artwork, food, etc.  please contact dex if you
> have any items to donate.  thanks!
>
> honor cd
> fm 101.9 is committed to consistent airing of honor cd cuts and psas.
>
> press event
> fm 101.9 will provide a live remote broadcast of the press conference.
> morning show personality chick moshonz (also host of their earth journal
> broadcasts) will serve as moderator of the press conference.
>
> live in the music hall performance
> fm 101.9 will promote and air day of (october 17) one live in the music
> hall performance to promote the honor the earth campaign, the honor cd
> and the release reception at shangri-la.
>
> shangri-la release reception
> fm 101.9 will provide live remote broadcast of shangri-la reception (live
> cut-ins for selected performances) and donate stage set up at shangri-la.
>
> music hall cd/vol.3
> fm 101.9 has designated the honor the earth campaign and the california
> chicano news media association as joint beneficiaries for their third
> compiled benefit cd music hall/vol.3!! (50% of proceeds will go to fm
> 101.9, and the remaining 50% will be split evenly between joint
> beneficiaries).  music hall/vol.3 will hit record stores in southern
> california on november 25 for sale during the holiday season.  this is a
> really big deal  for the campaign, a great way to raise money--and, we
> dont need to do much work on it!
>
> more exciting news for honor the earth:
>
> a bbdo client
> bbdo, one of the largest ad agencies in the world, has agreed to take
> honor the earth on as a pro bono client!  a proposal was submitted to the
> company several months ago, focusing on the development, production and
> placement of television public service advertisements for the campaign.
> christina mcknight, an employee at the company and
> the producer of the campaigns new slide show, was able to put the
> proposal before the board..  thanks, christina!  this is a great
> opportunity for honor the earth to work with an award winning company and
> deliver a message through the medium of television.  we will keep you up
> to date as this relationship and agreement develops.
>
> athens benefit
> members of the athens observer are organizing a benefit for the honor the
> earth campaign in athens, georgia at the atomic music hall on saturday,
> november 2.  the event will feature a set of great local bands.  steve
> dixon of daemon is the hte liason to the benefit.
>
> whole foods
> whole foods was one of the primary sponsors of the minneapolis concert,
> donating 100% of the catering that night.  there national office is now
> considering becoming a national sponsor of honor the earth.  this would
> include a cash donation plus an honor the earth department in all 70
> stores nationwide.  they will also continue to make in-kind donations to
> upcoming events.
>
> honor autograph signing at the ben and jerrys festival
> toad the wet sprocket did a one hour autograph signing at the ben and
> jerrys festival in minneapolis september 14.  the signing was a huge
> success, with 47 cds and cassettes sold in the hour!
>
> college music journal
> the honor cd is the pick of the week for the october 7 issue of college
> music journal-- this means the cd will appear on the cover of the journal!
>
> native media coverage grows for honor
> the honor cd and honor the earth campaign have generated extensive
> coverage in native media.  articles, reviews and news stories on the
> honor cd and honor the earth campaign have appeared or are scheduled to
> appear in aboriginal voices, native peoples magazine, the circle, news
> from indian country, indian country today, native american press, and
> over national native news.
>
>
>
> please call faye with any questions or input on this report or the
> attached event report, and we hope to see you in malibu!
>
> event summary report
> new york/minneapolis cd release events
> september 27, 1996
>
> honor cd release dinner and showcase, the supper club, september 19
>
> tickets sold:  143
>
> projected net:  $25,000.00  (final report in progress)
>
> merchandise net:  $1,788.08
>
> new hte donor highlights:
> ticket purchasers and contributors included:  independent filmmaker obie
> benz, emmy award winner jerry kupfer;  agnes gund, chair of the board of
> the metropolitan museum of art;  jonathan kraft, owner of the foxboro
> stadium and new england patriots;  unitarian universalist veach program;
> steward mott charitable trust;  michael ratner, attorney and former
> president of the national lawyers guild;  independent funder joshua
> mailman, tribeca films director jane rosenthal; young rascals member
> eddie brigatti, president of seventh generation, inc. jeffrey hollender,
> kimberly otis of the sister fund;  north star fund;  warner brothers
> executive fred wistow;  and national museum of the american indian
> capital campaign manager melissa tallent.
>
> music and entertainment industry support:
> oscar winner susan sarandon (thelma and louise, dead man walking),
> benjamin bratt (star of law and order), julia ormond (sabrina), and
> michael moore (roger and me) all committed either financial or political
> support for the campaign.  matushka, the nationally known model who
> suffered breast cancer, attended the event along with ben bratt, joan
> rivers and steven van zandt.  bmi international and ascap both supported
> the event and sent representatives.  inner city broadcasting corporation,
> (owners of wlib), ted turner and jane fonda of the turner foundation and
> epic records all purchased tables at the event.
>
> promotion:
> a host committee invitation and table sponsor invitation packet was
> mailed to 140 individuals and companies the first week of july.
> invitations were mailed mid-august to 1,300 people, including a set of
> names provided by riptide, inc., artists for a new south africa names,
> and nation subscribers in the high capita zip codes of new york..  many
> new york based organizations and individuals mailed invitations to their
> boards and donors, includingthe funding exchange, north star fund,the
> sister fund, astrea foundation, natural resources defense council (nrdc)
> and gloria steinam.
>
> more than 500 people and companies who received the invitation were
> phoned.
> honor cd release concert, northrop auditorium, september 20
>
> tickets sold:  4,577
>
> projected net:  $50,000.00 (final report in progress)
>
> merchandise net:  $5,567.82
>
> electric fetus honor cd release autograph party:
> minneapolis based retailer electric fetus hosted a hugely successful meet
> and greet on friday, september 20th in celebration of the honor release.
> in attendance and signing copies of honor at the electric fetus were
> indigo girls and bruce cockburn.  nearly 100 cds were purchased at the
> fetus on friday afternoon alone, with strong interest and recorders at
> retail for the honor cd noted throughout the minneapolis market.
>
> internet broadcast:
> monsterbit media is proud to inform you that the live internet audio
> broadcast of the honor cd release concert in minneapolis show was a huge
> success. we had several hundred people tune in from as far away as japan
> and australia.  the show was not only played over monsterbit's server, it
> was featured on yahoo! live "picks" and real audio's "timecast"
> section...both high profile internet presences.
>
> show promotion and sponsorship:
> the honor cd release concert was one of four discover the grammy festival
> concerts in the twin cities market.  sponsorship of the honor cd release
> concert included a $2,000 cash donation, 1-1/2 full pages of print
> advertising support, and one week of radio and public relations support
> in exchange for inclusion of the discover card grammy festival logo on
> all print and radio advertising for the show, signage in the venue, and a
> verbal mention from the stage.
>
> four thousand dollars worth of advertising was run in city pages, the
> weekly alternative, for $2,000 cash and ticket trades.  ads ran weekly
> from july 31 though september 4.
>
> cities 97, ktcz/ktcj ran 33 liners promoting the show as a trade and 24
> 30 second pre-recorded spots.  cities 97 also hosted bruce cockburn on
> the traffic jam, a highly popular in studio show, friday, september 20.
>
> 93.7 the edge donated more than $8,000 worth of promotion between liners
> and pre-recorded announcements.
>
>
> new york press
>
> print media
> jennifer nix, freelance writer for new york magazine and george magazine
>       interviewed winona laduke for a piece in both publications
>
> robin platzer, contributing photographer, people magazine
>       shot and submitted photos of indigo girls with steven van zandt and
> john  trudell for november piece
>
> michele agins, staff photographer, new york times
>       shot and submitted photos of indigo girls with steven van zandt and
> john  trudell;  shot event for possible photo essay in time or life
>
> robert perkinson, progressive magazine
>       interviewed indigo girls, rose main for feature piece in november issue
>
> gail ohara, time out magazine
>       advance event listing
>
> lisa mcglaughlin, time magazine music critic
>
> joe conason, new york observer
>
> lydia defretas, aquarian weekly
>
> television
> merle rubine, producer for dateline, nbc
>       interviewed chris peters
>
> deborah amos, correspondent for abc news and npr
>       interviewed tom goldtooth and winona laduke
>
> danny shecter, rory oconnor and jackie farmer, global vision, producers
> of pbs        rights and wrongs, filmed winona laduke and indigo girls,
> interviewed   winona laduke
>
> radio
> doug echos, wpkn and pacifica radio
>       interviewed chris peters, rose main, rosalie little thunder for
> pacifica story
>
> whur, baltimore
>       september 19 phone interview with chris peters, john trudell and
> rose main
>  twin cities press:
> print media
> star tribune
>       sunday, september 7 calendar highlight with photo of indigo girls
>       friday, september 20 interview with amy ray
>       saturday, september 21 review of show
>
> pioneer press
>       sunday, september 14 showtime highlight with photo of indigo girls
>       saturday, september 21 review of show
>
> city pages
>       wednesday, september 18 spread on sherman alexie with blurb on concert
>
> twin cities reader
>       wednesday, september 18 spread on sherman alexie with box on concert
>
> indian country today
>       september 2-9 issue, arts and entertainment cover article
>
> the circle
>       september issue, cd release story;  concert review to appear in
> october issue
>
> minnesota daily
>       concert review to appear in october issue
>
> news from indian country
>       concert review to appear in october issue
>
> radio
> wcco
>       tuesday, september 17 interview with indigo girls
>
> native america calling
>       tuesday, september 17 interview with indigo girls and tom goldtooth
>
> kfai
>       tuesday, september 17 interview with sherman alexie
>
> cities 97
>       friday, september 20 traffic jam interview with bruce cockburn
>
> television
> kmsp/newscope, channel 9:  new story on honor the earth and the northrop
> concert with indigo girls interview
>
>
>

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 21:58:15 -0400
reply-to:     christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
subject:      re: ahhhh!
x-to:         amy lynn carpenter <carpen48@pilot.msu.edu>
in-reply-to:  <199610011812.oaa22822@pilot01.cl.msu.edu>

at the risk of further flames, can i just add one thing for everyone's
general information?  there is a newsgroup called alt.sex.religion that
discusses this very issue ad infinitum.  you can go there and find all of
the following:  intelligent, lively and tolerant conversations about the
relationship between all varieties of christianity, from the
bible-bashin' fundies to the lgbt quatro-racioethnic pacifist anti-ageist
anti-speciesist unitarian universalist; flame wars from hell; christians
verbally bashing queers; queers verbally bashing christians.  you will
find me there once a week, but i don't post often.  let's chat there?
chris ii

> ig list.  if you want to have a big moral philosophical debate with all your
> bible quotes, please do it elsewhere.

elsewhere, again:
alt.religion.sexuality

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 22:21:19 edt
reply-to:     oh susanna <oh.susanna@dartmouth.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "susan b. marine" <susan.b.marine@dartmouth.edu>
subject:      melissa (igc)

hold on to your pants, ladies and gents, its an actual ig related post !!!

i was wondering if anyone can "point" me to a really good copy of ig covering
melissa (allman bros>) which is my favorite ig cover and definitely in my top
ten favorite songs they play, period.

the only copy i have of it is off of history of us, and from shades of indigo,
and its good...but not great. a little not-so-clear. i'd kill if it was the
same quality as the stuff on, say, reverse 1 live (thanks chris...your
bumberboot is in the mail)

email me privately if you know the secret handshake, or better yet, where i
could find a good copy of melissa.

rock to the beat,
susalamma ding dong

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 02:36:05 gmt
reply-to:     alec heller <alec@nyc.pipeline.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         alec heller <alec@nyc.pipeline.com>
subject:      my post on ssm's and religion (nigc, but somewhat important,
              i think)

i think a little clarifying is in order.

although i haven't recieved any flames, i have gotten some people who seem
to be confronting me, if you didn't intend it that way, i've been
misreading your mail, so don't be offended.

i am wholly (isn't that pronounced holy?  isn't that ironic? :) in favor of
gay marriage.  it is my belief that love transcends everything in
everything.  please don't think that because i presented the case opposed
to the marriage that i necesarily believed in it.  i don't know what to
believe in that particular case.  here's on of my famous examples.  should
females have bris's?  for all you (pick a word for someone who's not
jewish, i don't want to offend anyone)'s out there, a bris is the ritual
circumsision performed on jewish males come their eighth day of existence
or so.  now, to whomever said that "homo's can have kids too", i agree,
physically, but not with each other, which was what i meant, if not what i
said.  which is to say, it takes alot of interesting moving around for a
woman to make another pregnant without biology, no?  that's what i meant by
procreation (taking the word apart, i mean creating something together).
there is, fyi, a sort of equivelent ceremony (which boys don't quite
recieve) which is a naming ceremony, for females.  it is not due to sexism
or anything like that, just due to the fact that women don't have foreskins
to be chopped off.  many of you suggested that a sort of "seperate but
equal" ceremony would be fine.  i can tell you from what actually happened
that it wasn't.  this particular couple decided that they wanted the
ceremony to the word of the tradition.  nothing about procreation could be
left out.  i don't know what that says about the idea, but the temple was
perfectly happy to do something like that, even an edited version of the
actual marriage ceremony, but that wasn't good enough for the couple (not
meant meanly, just factually).

i just wanted to put that out to y'all.  thanks alot.  in addition,
privately, anything y'all have to say about same sex marriage i would love
to obtain, seems as i have to write an essay on it, primary source info is
always the best.

love and hugs to the world,

alec

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 03:00:13 gmt
reply-to:     alec heller <alec@nyc.pipeline.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         alec heller <alec@nyc.pipeline.com>
subject:      shame on you (nigc, excepting the subject)

chris and jen both,

i can't believe i'm hearing such blatent disrespect, ignorance, and all
around stupidity from both of you.  look, i'm willing to risk flame here,
but here's where i gotta take a bit of a stand.  jen, you once apologized
for being straight.  i know there's more to that but lets start there.  i'd
like to say that i'm not sorry for being straight.  i'm perfectly happy
(although i wouldn't mind having another fifty percent prosepctive s/o's...
:)  being so.  it's not my fault that a bunch of idiots, flaunting the
bible, or family values, or their purple polka dotted umbrella decided to
make gay's lives harder than it is.  i'm really sorry to y'all who've
suffered for your sexuality, but it ain't your fault your gay, and it ain't
my fault some people don't like it.  i speak out against intolerance, so
there's that.

chris,

where was there an affront to christians?  nobody said that all christians
were bible bangers.  i think even you agree that some exist, and perhaps
even that they aren't right in what they are saying.  does that mean that
all the people who aren't straight white christian males on this list are
against you?  it hurts me to see that so many people brought here by a
thing of beauty, (namely the music of our beloved girls) can get so
paranoid over something so non-existant.

here's a thought to y'all.  first of all, whoever of you who sent letters
of support to jen or chris, i'd like you to know that y'all may very well
be supporting two sides being equally one sided.  i've seen jen flame chris
for something he corrected for himself, and then apologize for after the
fact, and then have chris come back shooting flames.  shit people, think.
i don't think anybody here is against the christian church.  in the same
vein, i don't think there's anybody here who's against homosexuality.  if
you are, don't yell at me, but you sure have been quiet all this time.

i don't like this, let it stop, huh?

alec

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 22:06:46 -0500
reply-to:     "s. steffen" <ssteffen@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "s. steffen" <ssteffen@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
subject:      teaching rhetoric, etc. (igc)

hey there all, i've been quite a lurker on this list so far, though not on
the dar williams list as dar-fans will tell you, but anyway!  i"m teaching
rhetoric to freshmen at the university of iowa, and one thing we try to
teach is "show, not tell."

so, on that note:
i'm listening to 1200c right now, at the middle of the first disc.  vw,
to be precise.  songs i would skip if i had cds and my own cd player
(rather than using the women's resource and action center's while i write
email and papers!):
power of two  aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaagh!!!!  mariah carey!  whitney
        houston!  give me your tired, your pop songs, your adolescent lovers
        yearning to be free!  no!  (okay, if you're going to flame me,
        how about using my private address please)
wood song.  ditto, with the addition of being a pagan and disliking the
        preachiness of this song (along with 123, yuck)
1,2,3 rocks but see above

i know there are more but i can't think right now, too many papers to
comment on. i _do_ like some emily stuff, and i'm a cancer (had to sneak
it in) so, hey, there we are.  ("as a great man once said, wherever you
go, there you are."--mr.brady)

i am eagerly awaiting my list t-shirt, thanks to that darn
"immature and insecure" deb.  ; )  my sister and brother are also excited
about theirs (b-day presents).  yay!  now we can finally identify each
other out in the wide world of iowa/missouri!

btw, may i add that i, too, enjoy pearl jam.  yes, it's true!  vivaldi,
rem, dar, ani, the girls, pearl jam, bush, and the bangles...love 'em
all.   there are more but at the risk of starting a thread like one that
consumed the dar-list a while back, i won't go into the what people who
like the ig listen to otherwise.

ah, more igc:
listening to "tangled up in blue" right now reminds me to say that i saw
the girls in london on march 4(?) 1993, and joan baez showed up as a
surprise guest.  i have never, ever, ever been able to equal that
experience in concert-going (i was pretty close to the stage too, which
didn't hurt, and i had returned from paris early to see them, so hey it
had to be good!).  if someone has a boot from town & country, 3/4/93
(coould be 3/5?), please let me know!  i'll do anything, anything i
say...except discuss religion and voting for ralph nader, on the list!
you may be wondering why tuib reminds me of this concert; it's because of
the "don't think twice, it's alright" on ring them bells (bob dylan
thread, really) which i adore, and which they sang in london, i think
although it's been almost four years so who the hell knows by now??

peace, please, to all on the list,
love,
suzi (whose hair is still red)

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 23:27:56 edt
reply-to:     joan morrison <103161.3515@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         joan morrison <103161.3515@compuserve.com>
subject:      ok...one more time!

ok, it's clear that i'm gonna have to explain this once again judging by the
gazillion e-mails i've gotten since i posted my explanation the first time.
in my message about emily learning bass and sara playing bass in ani's band,
i typed "traitor!" in my message and proofed it before i sent it.  when i
read it once it had been posted to the list, it read "trait wasor"  i have
had a slew of people writing me asking what "trait wasor" means.  it doesn't
mean anything!!!  something really weird happened, though i don't know what,
since i proofed it before i sent it and i *do* know how to spell traitor. i
hope that clears up any remaining confusion.  btw, tamara mizell told me that
"trait wasor" means "i want donuts" in swahili.   hmmm...

food for thought...<g>

peace,

joan :p

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 19:21:52 -0700
reply-to:     steve moore <whoadave@ix.netcom.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         steve moore <whoadave@ix.netcom.com>
subject:      re: a singing an e song & vice versa

>if you could pick one "emily" song that you would like to hear
>amy sing lead, which would it be... likewise, which "amy" song would
>you like to hear emily sing lead?

how about amy doing "hey jesus" and emily taking lead on "fugitive."

and major kudos to mercy for trying to start a total igc thread.
everyone out there who's as weary of the nigc stuff as me, let's get
igc back in the spotlight, where it belongs. igc-ers, unite!!!


--
"do you ever get down on your knees and give thanks that you know me and
have access to my dementia?"--george costanza

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 23:46:49 -0400
reply-to:     mkd1026@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         molly katherine danzinger <mkd1026@aol.com>
subject:      sulli
x-to:         103161.3515@compuserve.com

just visiting a friend and wanted to say "hey" to everyone out there in
computer
land.  i have not been "online" in years. what's happening??
                                                                      sulli

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 10:14:43 +0100
reply-to:     indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)
x-to:         "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
in-reply-to:  <199610010249.waa06225@netspace.org>

on mon, 30 sep 1996, christopher m. becker wrote:

>   one can look at it this way, does the church/temple/masque/whatever
> (ctmw) deny marriage in the faith to folks who know they can not get
> pregnant? i have never heard of such a case.  there are lots of
> infertile folks out there, many of them married in faith.  what about
> those folks who actively seek never to have a child?  have they sinned
> by getting married in the ctmw?  if one of those couples decided to
> get married would it raise such an uproar as two homosexuals getting
> married?  depending how those questions are answered, it possibly
> exposes a fairly large hole in the arguement -- why is ok for hets to
> do it but not homos, perhaps fertility isn't the central issue after
> all?
>

actually i have heard of a catholic church (in brazil, i think) who refused
to marry a couple because the man was paralysed and couldn't get an erection
unaided (he could get one by having an injection).   the bishop concerned
said that marriage was intended for procreation and therefore to marry them
would be against the teachings of the church.   the couple eventually did
manage to get married (by going to another diocese, i think).   bizarrely,
the catholic church also claims that sex, even within marriage, for purposes
other than procreation is sinful, and that a couple who don't intend to have
any more children (and, presumably, infertile couples) are meant to remain
celibate.   not surprisingly, this does not make the pope very popular, and
most catholics either don't know about this rule and if they do, they ignore
it.   (this is also part of the reason why there is a movement to end
celibacy in the catholic clergy, particularly as it isn't even divine law and
was only imposed to stop church property being passed down into priests'
families.)

mat

------------------------------------------------------------------------
| matthew j smith        \ "[the priest] said that if you have to work |
| mts5@aber.ac.uk         \   for anyone, an absentee boss is best."   |
| indigojo@freenet.hut.fi  \     - jeannette winterson, "the passion"  |
|----------------------------------------------------------------------|
|    billy bragg / indigo girls info:  http://www.aber.ac.uk/~mts5/    |
------------------------------------------------------------------------

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 00:03:15 edt
reply-to:     joan morrison <103161.3515@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         joan morrison <103161.3515@compuserve.com>
subject:      (nigc)  bible thumpers

i'd like to set somthing straight (pardon the pun).  the term "bible
thumper" is generally applied to fundamentalist christians, such as southern
baptists, church of christ, etc. etc., not christians in general.  i am a
christian.  i grew up going to a bible-thumping southern baptist church.
that is exactly what the preacher did...he was a very sweet man, but when he
got worked up during his sermon, he pounded the podium, waved his bible in the
air, raised his voice (he was way into it) and often ended up in tears.  those
type of churches tend to be the ones that are home to more socially conservative,
judgmental churchgoers, i.e., the ones who fervently protest selling beer
in the local arena, selling playboy at the local newstand, abortion and
civil rights for gays and lesbians.  i knew this was not the doctrine or
even style of worship that was right for me and once i moved to tennessee
and got established, i joined the episcopal church.  yes, it is a christian
church, but very different from one i came from.  i am proud to be a
christian, but people like ralph reed, pat robertson, donald wildmon,
phyllis schlafly, et al., give christians everywhere a bad reputation.
christianity is not about being holier than thou.  true, we are called
to "spread the good news," but doesn't the bible also tell us that it is
more favorable in the eyes of god to quietly and humbly worship and serve god
in our everyday lives than to be ostentatious about our religion and
churchgoing?  i don't think religion is a "one size fits all" kind of
thing.  each person worships in his/her own way.  unfortunately, the folks
that earn the nickname of bible thumpers misinterpret spreading the good
news with force feeding people with it.  a good example of this is the southern
baptist convention's recent renewal of its efforts to convert jews to
christianity, and thus salvation.  a couple of years ago the sbc (either them
or the baptist sunday school board) completed a study of people in alabama
that said something to the effect that nearly half of the people in alabama
were in "spiritual danger" because they were not "born again."  in this group,
they included catholics.  catholics, episcopalians, presbyterians, and other
religions that often tend to be socially progressive were outraged and the
group that did the study had some serious damage control to do.  my point is,
sometimes those folks would do more for the cause of spreading the gospel if
they lived it rather than cramming it down people's throats and making people
feel either guilty or that their current religion (be it judaism, islam, etc.)
is the wrong way.  somehow, i don't think that's what jesus intended
when he called us to spread the gospel.

peace and religious harmony,

joan :)

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 00:44:09 +0000
reply-to:     dsrogers@utk.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         david rogers <dsrogers@utkux.utcc.utk.edu>
organization: utk
subject:      re: amy/emily switch

how 'bout amy on the wood song and emily on land of canaan. there can
never be enough land of canaan variations. they should put it on every
album.

can anyone point me in the right direction to find the more obscure ig
music like blue flood, shades of grey, anything. i would very much
appreciate it.

with all the recent talk about religion on this list, i wonder what some
of y'all think about amy as jesus and emily as mary magdalene on jesus
christ superstar. i absolutely love their performances on that album. i
happen to be a straight white male protestant, but i've always thought
ig music and amy and emily displayed jesus' teachings better than most
christians. you know, love, forgiveness, kindness, etc. etc.

"""""""""""""""""""""
"but the question drowns in its futility and even i have got to laugh at
me 'cause no one gets to miss the storm of what will be"
-e saliers
"""""""""""""""""""""

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 15:17:32 +1000
reply-to:     paris lord <p.lord@student.qut.edu.au>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         paris lord <p.lord@student.qut.edu.au>
subject:      language or the kiss
in-reply-to:  <199610020221.taa07581@dfw-ix7.ix.netcom.com>

hello again to each and every ig devotee reading this..
basically, the reason paris is posting this is to get the ball rolling
about one of my all time top 5 ig songs.
when i play "swamp o", i usually put on headphones and sprawl out on the
bed, up the vol. and try to feel the music.
"language..." is a song that's always baffled me. i guess it's because i
still haven't worked out the meaning of the title, if indeed there is one.
to me, "language.." is more an event than a song, much like "fugitive" or
"love will come to you". perhaps he's going overboard, but that's how much
i enjoy ig's music.

about two weeks ago, someone wrote about the brilliance of the live
version of "10,000 wars", with particular reference to amy's incredible
"is there every anything else that makes us take our different sides".
now, someone  said they shivered when they hear that bit. i get
incredibly copious amounts of warm inner glow and goosebumps everytime i
hear "language.." or a couple of other ig numbers.
i love it when songs give you goose bumps..songs such as mark knopfler's
"going home:theme from 'local hero'"...ig have a tendency to do that to
me..

where the smeg is this rant headed?? who knows. i sure as heck don't. i
guess i'm blabbling on because i missed the indigo girls experience (sorry
i had to use it!) when they played in australia last year and i still
haven't forgiven myself...

okay, if you've made it to the bottom of this thingy , you win a pencil.

peace and vegetable rights,
paris..............................

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
heaven knows i'm miserable now
                - the smiths
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 00:24:45 -0500
reply-to:     "jenn. brown" <jennb@owlnet.rice.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "jenn. brown" <jennb@owlnet.rice.edu>
subject:      re: amy/emily switch
in-reply-to:  <3251bad9.4b7b@utkux.utcc.utk.edu>

> how 'bout amy on the wood song and emily on land of canaan.

i think that would be _awesome_. shoot--now i wish those versions existed
somewhere b/c i want to hear them!

:)
jenn.

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 23:57:05 edt
reply-to:     jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)
x-cc:         dperkins@coa1.ci.austin.tx.us

ok.  i'm laying down my sword.  chris pointed out that there are many
hetero's out there that e-mailed him privately supporting his side.  i,
too, have received numerous private e-mails supporting my side.  however,
there are those that don't care either way and just want to get one with
some igc.

i do wish to clear up some things that were said.  my reference to "bible
bangers" is not a umbrella term for all religious people.  i'm sure many
of you know that the term means, but to me, i'm against those "in your
face" religious people who hide behind the bible.  i take what i've
learned over the last 27 years of my life to make the opinions and
decisions that i make.  i do not take my beliefs from a book.  this is my
decision and my opinion.  i take offense to those that preach from the
book and condemn those that are trying to live life in the manner in
which they feel comfortable.
many of those people, on this small list of 1000 people, are in the
closet and are scared to death to even give the slightest hint that they
are gay. they do this to protect themselves from the hatred that has been
written to this list over the past 2 days.  i feel very bad for these
folks.  imagine a teenager who knows that they're gay, but is afraid to
tell anyone.  listening to those anti-gay and hateful comments that were
posted, they'll never come out - and therefore never be really happy.
and there is so much hatred and disgust in the world, that if someone can
be happy by loving someone of their own gender is what'll make them
happy, is that wrong?

we all get defensive when someone speaks against someone else's opinion.
now i may have made childish remarks here and there, but there is nothing
more cruel then to say that gays and lesbians are sinners.  i've deleted
the e-mails so i don't have an actual quote, but someone here openly
disregarded g&l individuals.   now when i attacked chris, he became
defensive stating "you don't know a thing about me!! how dare you attack
my religion" , "why must you feel the need to attack us? what, please
tell me, have i done to you" , "does not give you the right to persecute
us".  if chris can remember how he felt when he said these things.  the
shoe had successfully been placed on the other foot.  cause that's what
g&l's have been saying for years.  you have every right to live life the
way you choose to - let other make a similar choice.

and for those that think we should take this to private e-mails, i don't
think we should.  there are, according to the list greeting when we sign
up, over 1000 people on this list.  if our public fights encourage one
quiet individual to make a choice (in either direction) and take action -
then some good was done.  if one person decided to take a stand and come
out of the closet - then good was done.  if one sister or brother /
mother or father decided to end years of hatred because one of their
siblings / children are gay - then good was done.  (and, yes, these
examples are pro-gay because that's my opinion - i can't come up with a
pro-(anti-gay) stand - - sorry).  when it comes to important issues like
this, it should be broadcast.   we all know that a&e have a strong gay
following - they've said that for years.  so that probably means that
there are quite a number of g&l listers.  when young individuals are
confused about their sexuality and have no one to talk to, many commit
suicide.   who's to say one of those people aren't on this list.  i'm
sorry that some of you don't want to be inundated by strong opinionated
nigc e-mails (and they have been appropriately labeled so if you read
them, you did it willingly) when you get home from a tough days work, but
if this whole discussion saved one individual to come out and talk to
someone and not commit suicide - then isn't that, too, worth it.

my apologies to those that i've offended.  my apologies to those that
think i'm childish. my apologies to those g&l's for words that were said
to hurt and disregard you as worthless human beings.  my apologies to
those religious people who dislike words like "bible banger".   my
apologies to chris and dwayne for the words we've exchanged.

ok.  so now what do we talk about?
- jen hall

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 02:26:03 -0400
reply-to:     lavanonda@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         lavanonda@aol.com
subject:      a final thought(nigc)

as i sit here contemplating all the posts about religious differances and
homosexuality...etc. i feel compelled to express my truth here.as i get
older(i turn 40 on friday oct.4th) i find that i am constantly amazed that
humanity has yet to figure out the bottom line in all this...that we are all
dependent on each other in this life..no matter what our philosophical
differances are.no matter what,you still are dependant on that jewish lesbian
doctor to take out your tonsils,that homophobic farmer in kansas to grow the
wheat for your bread,that afro american talk show host for entertainment and
so on.when a person is attacked for their individual beliefs it diminishes
not only the whole of humanity but the the attacker as well.i may not always
appreciate or understand the views listed here but i try my best to treat all
as i would want to be treated myself.our intrest in ig is the common
ground,and the music brings to each of us a special message.but this list is
a wonderful example of  how  similar our experiences and feelings about the
music are,even in our diversity.
                   appreciative of diversity with great hopes for
humanity..laurabell

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 01:54:38 -0400
reply-to:     deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
subject:      in search of demo-tour boots

greetins to all in indigo land!


i haven't heard anything about boots from the following ig demo-tour
shows.  do any of these shows exist as bootlegs?  if anyone knows,
please email me and hopefully i can get a copy of each.  thanks a lot.

8/16/96  art park, lewiston ny
8/17/96  boathouse, norfolk va
8/20/96  backyard, austin tx
8/21/96  white rabbit, san antonio tx
8/22/96  bronco bowl, dallas tx

thanks for your help!

take care and peace!

-deb

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=========================================================================
date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 15:38:17 -0700
reply-to:     "kim : goddess in her own reality:)" <rcn@prcn.org>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "kim : goddess in her own reality:)" <rcn@prcn.org>
subject:      in light of recent flamage.

i no longer find this list something i want to be part of. i withdraw my
subscription. bye all... it's been fun. the girls still rock but some of you
really suck at life.
peace... kim
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
      <just kim>rcn@prcn.org
"pain from pearls-hey little girl-
     how much have you grown?"
---------------amy ray------------------
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 17:25:31 -0500
reply-to:     m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
subject:      es quote

sunny's favorite non-lyrical quote....

>>>>"i learned to play new insruments.  all of them are made out of
metal".      emily saliers <<<<<<


hey sunny, should it be noted that emily said this at the santa fe
show....the one with all of the rain, thunder & lightning.....

great line from emily, whose sense of humor was, obviously, the only
dry thing in santa fe that night.


melissa

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 15:37:00 -0500
reply-to:     the searcher <kidfears@flinthills.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         the searcher <kidfears@flinthills.com>
subject:      re: to the flame god
x-to:         "kim : goddess in her own reality:)" <rcn@prcn.org>

at 10:49 am 10/1/96 -0700, you wrote:
>and publicly, (cause tracey home home home is my very good friend + i'm mad
>as hell about this flame ) i say...
>if you only knew the damage your mean spirited words have probably done.
>people like us who do find enjoyment here on this list... who get joy and
>find a certain acceptance out of "belonging" here have sometimes used it as
>a touch stone + a lifeline. it is human contact... without strings attached,
>with people who are both intelligent + fun. it is a good place to be, and a
>great read. i refuse to feel unwelcome or give others the impression that
[snip]

that's all fine, well, and good.... if this was a 'let's all connect and
feel good' mailing list... but it is not.  it's a mailing list who's
subject happens to be the music (music.... not personal lives and certainly
not whether they smoke or not!) of the indigo girls.  anything else is off
topic and un-appropriate.  can we please stick to the topic of this
list???????

marianne

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 02:50:52 -0400
reply-to:     deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
subject:      amy/emily switching songs

hello to all in the land of indigo!

since i couldn't sleep i figured i would respond to the amy/emily
switching songs thread.

i would love to hear amy sing lead on love will come to you, you and me
of the 10,000 wars and ghost.  to hear her voice all gentle and sweet :)

i think it would be cool for emily to sing lead on center stage, reunion
and tried to be true.  i'd love to hear emiy's voice sound a little bit
rougher like on the sf version of land of canaan and high horse.

i wonder if they would ever entertain the idea of reversing roles in
a song to mix it up, or for sheer enjoyment of their faithful fans, who
sit around and imagine all these strange requests for them to do ;)

on another note, i love high horse!!!  each time i listen to my sf tape
i can't help but rewind it at least 3 or 4 times.  it rocks!
all in favor of staging a request to revive high horse speak now!
i'd love to hear in on the spring tour!

take care and peace all!

-deb

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 19:52:39 edt
reply-to:     "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
subject:      (nigc) gays, the bible, and translation
x-to:         "don a. smith" <dasmith@netspace.org>


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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 17:35:00 -0700
reply-to:     marianne barlow <mlb1@axe.humboldt.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         marianne barlow <mlb1@axe.humboldt.edu>
subject:      re: songs i skip
x-to:         jen lucero <jlucero@monmouth.com>
in-reply-to:  <199610010645.caa22256@shell.monmouth.com>

>         original songs i never miss...mystery, the wood song, r&j, hand me
> downs, dead man's hill and walk away...
>         well...i guess that's enough for now...
>                 peace
>                         jen
>

actually jen romeo & juliet (if that's what you meant by r&j) is not
original, it was written by mark knopfler of dire straits.

cheers =)

the lone coyote

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 00:35:55 -0700
reply-to:     carol gunby <mdindigo@well.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         carol gunby <mdindigo@well.com>
subject:      favorite quotes

this may not be the quote with the biggest ha! factor, but about 5 years
ago i saw the girls in berkeley, and emily made the comment that they
really liked coming to the bay area because they like to shop here. she
then looked over at amy, who was wearing a black t-shirt and those denim
shorts with red & white stripes up the side, and doc martens, and said "amy
like to go to thrift stores, and...". then looked down at herself, in
jeans, cowboy boots, and blazer, and somewhat sheepishly added, "...and i
like to go to the gap."

*********************************************************************
carol gunby                  "we are dreamers in the making
mdindigo@well.com             we are not afraid of 'why?' "
                                                          --ferron
*********************************************************************

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 20:04:56 -0400
reply-to:     laura cooksey <lcooksey@mail.clark.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         laura cooksey <lcooksey@mail.clark.net>
subject:      nigc -- posting

i'm enjoying the various discussions on the list, but i must emphasize a
point made by someone else a couple of days ago:

when you respond to someone's post, please don't quote any more of the
message than is necessary to make your point.

i don't mind short posts, but it's really tedious to scroll through forty
or fifty lines of the original message (in digest mode) to get to the next
message.

if you don't know how to cut text from the original message when you do a
reply, hey -- i'm sure someone at your university, or isp, or even someone
on the list knows. don't be afraid to ask.

my $0.02
laura
***********************************************
laura cooksey    o-    <*>   lcooksey@clark.net
"every silver lining's got a touch of grey."
                robert hunter
  http://www.clark.net/pub/lcooksey/home.html
***********************************************

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 17:10:00 -0700
reply-to:     marianne barlow <mlb1@axe.humboldt.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         marianne barlow <mlb1@axe.humboldt.edu>
subject:      re: emily says moo/drunk guy speaks - galileo on 1200 curfews
x-to:         kimberly hobbs <kimlin@vcn.bc.ca>
in-reply-to:  <pine.3.89.9609301755.a10758-0100000@opus.vcn.bc.ca>

i, too, listened more carefully than usual to this track last night, and
although i don't have a hypothesis on what the guy says, i didn't think
it was just sing or justine.  i will listen to see if it sounds like
f---ing a tonight.  thanks, listers for making life interesting!

the lone coyote


on mon, 30 sep 1996, kimberly hobbs wrote:

> i could be wrong but i listened to this about ten times and it sounds
> like: emily, "moo"
>       some drunk guy, "f---ing a"
> having been at many concerts, in many mosh pits and smelled the stale
> stench of beer burps i can see some drunk guy saying "f---ing a" after
> emily says, "moo"...so be angry no more rebekah!!! enjoy galileo once more!
> peace, kim (north van)
>
> on sun, 29 sep 1996, rebekah s scholl wrote:
>
> > out of nowhere  you hear this guy in the crowd scream, "just sing!"  that
> > makes me so mad that someone would have the gall to do that.  it is just
> > plain rude and it pisses me off everytime that i listen to the album.  as
> > soon as he say it they start playing and it seems as if they actually
> > listened to him.  i am sure that isn' t the case but it sounds that way.
> > maybe he is saying, "justine!"  but the more i think about it why would he
> >
>
> --
> administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
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>

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 15:09:16 -0500
reply-to:     karen robinson <lynn@texas.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         karen robinson <lynn@texas.net>
subject:      re: the amazing jen, nigc even tho i had some.

>date:    tue, 1 oct 1996 12:44:31 edt
>from:    jen hall <jenhall@juno.com>>

though i'm a timid 'little' thing, i just felt that i had to post my
support, even in the fray of battle that is just so frightening; (faux
southern belle a fixin' to faint),  "wow! jen, you go girl."  you read it to
them thar silly men a gittin' all het up 'bout their little lines of
bandwidth being wasted.

>show me your way oh worldly one!  this doesn't define your definition of
>a traditional family.  tradition doesn't = marriage.  tradition can mean
>anything that is carried on from one generation to another....

seems to me,(hand against brow), lotta people spendin' so much time worrying
about what the rest of the world is doing and with whom that they can't get
their own house in order. i'm with jen.  gay, straight, bi, or none of the
above is nobody's business but yours and whomever you're with.  don't base
the tax code, or job, or sale of the house on it.  move on.

>dwayne - dwayne - dwayne.  "dragonman" huh?  how manly of you.  are you
>really as macho as your e-mail tag suggests?

why jen, are you commenting on dragonboy's manliness?  i'm sure every woman
he meets is just turned to, no churned to, buttah by his gracious and
charming manner. (tic)

>>"me too"'s are a complete waste of time and resources.  as of this
>>point, i will privately flame every single "me too"er to get my point
>across.

i agree totally. i just couldn't bear to be flamed like that for a me too
post. so i had to take the time to write this long one with major meaning.

>you go boy!  you be an asshole.  it's your gawd given right.

my heart just swells with pride at our transplanted but now a real texan! :)

>>and for god's sake, stop quoting all of the post that you are
>>responding to! we have all read it once before if we ever gave a shit.

i wish you'd devote a little of that thar energy to the homeless, or
underprivileged children, or to habitat for humanity.  maybe you wouldn't
come off so high strung over these little ol' list posts by a bunch of, oh
my, i guess you'd just have to call us, well, humans.

>banger - - you're a bible banger - - not a bible thumper.  the key to
>flaming is to get the text right.

darn. i will never get that right.  got to have the key. the key karen, the key.
no key.  jen, can i borrow the key for just a little while?
save the flames.  i'll just forward them to the list anyway.

with great admiration, deep respect, and abiding support for our jen.


divinely inspired, devilishly run,

karen

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 17:19:24 -0700
reply-to:     verdi@imap2.asu.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         benjamin slavin <verdi@imap2.asu.edu>
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)
x-to:         "christopher d. payne" <owen4@adnc.com>
in-reply-to:  <32505e64.2356@adnc.com>

ok, i mean this in the most loving and supportive way.
shut the hell up!
this is an ig list not some fundamentalist bible discussion.
ben
"every tool is a weapon if you hold it right." -ani difranco

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 20:31:50 edt
reply-to:     joan morrison <103161.3515@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         joan morrison <103161.3515@compuserve.com>
subject:      (nigc) stupid flame checklist

whoever posted that "flame checklist" thing (and i can't remember who did it)
really ought to be ashamed.  i have complaints from time to time but i don't
show my ass in public over it.

peace and can we all just get a long, thank you,

joan

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 19:35:02 -0500
reply-to:     susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
subject:      re: your vote, etc (nigc)

howdy!

this is not a flame, but a reality check: bob dole is the republican =
candidate, ain't he? did i miss something?

that's all, sarah. i really wanted to check because you make some valid =
points. i intend no disrespect to you.

if i could i'd vote green party. that's ralph nader for president and =
winona laduke for vice president. problem is, i live in oklahoma (at =
least until the end of the year!) and they will not be on our state's =
ballot. :( don't assume that i am one of those "flaky" voters either who =
votes for non-traditional candidates every election. i have never taken =
my vote lightly. it's just that this year i feel the two main political =
party candidates are doing just that. taking my vote for granted. and =
yours and yours, as well. change is happening right now. i will not just =
sit and watch as my country evolves into a new country. i will be an =
active participant in the change.

power to the people,

susan

"si quieres paz, lucha por la justicia"

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 10:04:44 +0100
reply-to:     indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
subject:      re: nigc:  more anti-gay trash (yes, more nigc)
x-to:         "hsu amber r. batson" <arbatson@hsutx.edu>
in-reply-to:  <325158f2.7e@hsutx.edu>

on tue, 1 oct 1996, hsu amber r. batson wrote:

> had a message for them: repent and sin no more. i am confused about how
> "gay christians" get around new testament bible verses like 1
> corinthians 6:9-11, 1 timothy 1:9-11, and romans 1:18-32 not to mention
> the old testament story of sodom and gomorrah (gay jews).

because maybe christianity is (or should be) based on the teachings of
christ, not paul?   paul's epistles are also notorious for their misogyny.
why should we listen to what he has to say on homosexuality either?

mat

------------------------------------------------------------------------
| matthew j smith        \ "[the priest] said that if you have to work |
| mts5@aber.ac.uk         \   for anyone, an absentee boss is best."   |
| indigojo@freenet.hut.fi  \     - jeannette winterson, "the passion"  |
|----------------------------------------------------------------------|
|    billy bragg / indigo girls info:  http://www.aber.ac.uk/~mts5/    |
------------------------------------------------------------------------

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 19:23:27 +0800
reply-to:     enhiver <enhiver@singnet.com.sg>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         enhiver <enhiver@singnet.com.sg>
subject:      re : 'goosebump' moments

> from: paris lord <p.lord@student.qut.edu.au>
> okay, if you've made it to the bottom of this thingy , you win a pencil.

ma !! i won a pencil !! i won a pencil !!!! paris, do i get to choose the
colour ?

> ... amy's incredible "is there ever anything else that makes us take our
> different sides". now, someone said they shivered when they hear that
> bit. i get incredibly copious amounts of warm inner glow and goosebumps
> everytime i hear "language.." or a couple of other ig numbers. i love it
> when songs give you goose bumps...ig have a tendency to do that to me..

one of my favourite "goosebump" moment is in ghost, when emily sings "then
i start to feel a shiver (or fever) from the warm air thru' the screen...
you come regular like seasons...".

the image of the ghost of someone you have loved & lost... passing through
your body... shudder ! all the pain... you reach out your hand, but you
can't touch... and you know you'll live it over, & over, 'cos seasons go,
but they always come back.

another goosebump that wakes one up comes in "oh the fear i've known ! that
i might reap the praise of strangers, & end up on my own..." & another
.."but i knew back then.. it was a calling that said if joy, then pain..."

if emily becomes a screen-writer, it would take quite a director & some
actors to do her words justice. she mentioned interest in writing music for
films, aren't some of their songs mini-movies in themselves ?
imagine a movie inspired by or adapted from say, emily saliers' "language
or the kiss" or amy ray's "fugitive" !!

here's a possible challenge to all you aspiring screen-writers out there.
and oh, casting directors :-) .

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 06:43:27 -0500
reply-to:     steve shapiro <sms6@cec.wustl.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         steve shapiro <sms6@cec.wustl.edu>
subject:      role reversal (?), and viva uptown lounge!

so i was sitting here thinking about  a and e switching lead on songs and
wondering this:  was the intent of the original post that they merely
switch voice parts, as in a singing 10000 wars one or two octives lower
or as in one of them actually _covering_ the other's song....big
difference.  i mean, listen to the dire straits r&j (which, btw, i didn't
realize i actually had on cd until two months ago because i always
skipped it when i heard the intro...hmmmm) and then listen to a's cover.
imagine an angst-ridden pot or, um, reunion with a picked lead guitar
rather than strummed.  the possibilities are endless (and scary?).

i just saw live at the uptown lounge, and i just had to say that i think
it whups all over watershed, imho.  maybe that is just the idle longings
of one who has never seen them live in concert (not that i have seen them
live anywhere else...), but i don't think watershed captures the emotion,
and the humor and the crowd response, and did i mention emotion, of the
single full (edited) performance like latul.  compared to latul,
watershed seems like, i don't know, too slick and promoish (coining a new
word once again) with the videos and the interviews.  don't get me wrong,
i love watershed (somebody borrowed mine and never returned it, so i
borrowed my girlfriend's and haven't returned it).  i just love latul
more :)

and....on that note, someone said something about pot being, um,
something to the effect of whitney-huston-mariah-carey pop music (yes, i
take liberties with my quote).  anyone want to talk about this?  is there
a message to this song, or should it be taken at face value only?  does
there need to be a message behind a song for it to have value?  are there
other songs that face this problem?  what is the meaning of life (had to
sneak that in just in case somebody out there knows)?  is there a
corellation between the relative "depth" of a song and its appeal to the
general populace?

i just realized that i have made some inferrential statements about
whitney huston's and mariah carey's songs....hmmmm.  unintentional.
that discussion would be better for the mc or wh lists  :)

thank goodness for more igc
(sung to the tune of tg for chef boyardee),

steve

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 08:26:20 -0400
reply-to:     pat & shelly <wingstar@mulberry.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         pat & shelly <wingstar@mulberry.com>
subject:      nigc: who kissed girl info

hi all,

i was amazed at all the resposes i received answering who sang this song!
it would take me forever to email everyone personally so i would just like
to say thanks to y'all here.  i appreciated the help.  i knew i could count
on y'all!

thanks all!  have a good one!

pat

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 08:06:22 -0500
reply-to:     "dragonman (by way of karen robinson <lynn@texas.net>)"
              <djarrell@ix10.ix.netcom.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "dragonman (by way of karen robinson <lynn@texas.net>)"
              <djarrell@ix10.ix.netcom.com>
subject:      re: the amazing jen, nigc even tho i had some.

dragonman quoted me:

>i wish you'd devote a little of that thar energy to the homeless, or
>underprivileged children, or to habitat for humanity.  maybe you wouldn't
>come off so high strung over these little ol' list posts by a bunch of, oh
>my, i guess you'd just have to call us, well, humans.

then said,"what the hell do you know about me?  how can you assume that i do
not spend my time helping these causes?  your responses to jen post were
completely
inappropriate, and i would really like an apology.  i never publicly
attacked a person for the type of person i *thought* they might be.  i have
only attacked particular actions.  you find something i did that you don't
like, and you can complain about that.

:dwayne

sorry dwayne.  i don't have a clue what you do in your spare time.  you
could be a priest and the rest of us nuns for all i know.  i certainly don't
have the right to judge or suggest how you spend your time.  that was the
whole point of my post... and to, hopefully, provide a little levity in the
onslaught of flames running rampant throughout the list.  jmeo but with the
levels of crime, violence, abuse, disease, starvation, homelessness that are
being disregarded in favor of the legitimacy of whom you spend your "15
minutes" in bed with seems a little ridiculous.  i don't care and don't
think its any of my business.  so few people are happy; who am i to deny it
to them based upon the latest version of the storybook?  for those in the
'bible banger' leagues, :) sorry if i misunderstood but i thought god got to
be the judge, not us.

no, i am not a nun.  the line was not meant to be disrespectful towards any
religious group or affiliation thereof. (no, i'm not a lawyer either. ;))

divinely inspired, devilishly run,

karen

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 05:24:05 -0700
reply-to:     dragonman <djarrell@ix14.ix.netcom.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         dragonman <djarrell@ix14.ix.netcom.com>
subject:      in defense of mankind

karen robinson said:

>"wow! jen, you go girl."  you read it to
>them thar silly men a gittin' all het up 'bout their little lines of
>bandwidth being wasted.

let's agree on at least one thing here.  there will be no male bashing on
this list!  this is completely inappropriate, nigc or not.  i happen to know
for sure that there are females who are pretty upset by the way the list has
been in the past few weeks.

>>dwayne - dwayne - dwayne.  "dragonman" huh?  how manly of you.  are you
>>really as macho as your e-mail tag suggests?
>
>why jen, are you commenting on dragonboy's manliness?  i'm sure every woman
>he meets is just turned to, no churned to, buttah by his gracious and
>charming manner. (tic)

you are so wrong here, and i humbly request a private apology.  you know
nothing about me.  would you be surprised to know that if a woman turned to
'buttah' around me, i wouldn't really care much at all?  obsession with
manliness happens to be something that i detest about society.  to take a
stupid nickname that i happen to use and draw assumptions about my character
from it is completely uncalled for.

btw, i would have replied privately to this comment (as i did to jen), but i
feel the need to stop this unfounded public flaming now.

>save the flames.  i'll just forward them to the list anyway.

that is expressly forbidden in all circles of the internet.  and it shows a
complete lack of class.

whatever,

:dwayne

djarrell@ix.netcom.com
"you can spend your time alone redigesting past regrets,
or you can realize you're the only one who can forgive yourself
makes much more sense to live in the present tense" - pearl jam

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 08:44:38 -0500
reply-to:     "dimitra j. gianas" <u36252@uic.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "dimitra j. gianas" <u36252@uic.edu>
subject:      humankind

can everyone just stop flaming everyone???!!!!  maybe we can try to get back
into igc as this was the real reason i joined this list.  thank you.

dimitra

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date:         tue, 1 oct 1996 21:53:15 -0700
reply-to:     candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net>
subject:      re: a singing an e song & vice versa

>if you could pick one "emily" song that you would like to hear
>amy sing lead, which would it be... likewise, which "amy" song would
>you like to hear emily sing lead?


i'd love to hear amy doing "loves recovery" beacuse she seems to relate =
to the lyrical content so closely.  it would be interesting to hear her =
personal interpretation music-wise.  hmmm...maybe we could include a =
couple tracks of the girls doing each others songs on "cover me"....


...wheels in motion...
greta

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 09:45:42 -0700
reply-to:     pat chaney <pooh40@mc.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         pat chaney <pooh40@mc.net>
subject:      enough already!!nigc( unfortunately!!!)

ok..stop it..everyone is sorry, no body meant anything..you all remind me
of my kids..go to your rooms and don't come out till you can play
nicely.. and while your there, clean up your room and don't worry about
your sisters dirt..

hey..did anyone on this list here about this group called the indigo
girls???i understand they play music..or something..maybe we could talk
about them...what a novel idea.

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 15:58:43 +0000
reply-to:     andrew stokell <rbc31@dial.pipex.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         andrew stokell <rbc31@dial.pipex.com>
subject:      shawn's show

hey y'all!

i know that this was yesterday, but did anyone video the following show -

shawn colvin's live, in-studio interview and performance is going to be
aired tonight on world cafe at a little after 9:00 pm central time

and might be persuaded to run me off a copy? (in exchange for something
in return - shawn stuff, mcc,michelle shocked, or ig - of course!)

here's hoping!

andrew

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 08:25:37 pst
reply-to:     sarah scilley <sarah_scilley@ccmail.uoregon.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sarah scilley <sarah_scilley@ccmail.uoregon.edu>
subject:      ok, i'm totally embarrassed!!! (nigc)

have you ever had those day where you try and say something intelligent because
it's so important to you and then you totally screw it up?  well, i'm the one
who tried to express concern about abandoning the clinton ship because of doma
in a sea full of conservative sharks.

i'm sorry.  i kept saying "george bush" instead of "bob dole."  i feel like a
complete idiot and realize that i've blown my credibility.  making yourself
vulverable because of an opinion is one thing...sounding like an idiot while
you're doing it is another.

again, sorry for the brain fade.


sarah
sarah_scilley@ccmail.uoregon.edu

ps melissa, thanks for letting me know.  i'm on the digest form and hadn't seen
it yet.  i was having a conversation with someone right before i posted and
they had mentioned mr. bush.  oh well. :-(

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 10:35:49 edt
reply-to:     "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
subject:      (nigc) empty post

last night i sent an empty post (gays, the bible, and translation) to
the list.  sorry about that.

the article was about looking  back over various translations
of the bible and how its very questionable whether any of the oft
cited "anti-gay verses" really support what they are asked to support.
the post was written by a amateur bible expert (yes susan, its don =))
and it is very detailed.

i'm going to take its sudden disappearence as a sign that it was not
meant to be posted here in the first place.  if you would like a copy
of what i was going to send, please email me and i will happily send
you a copy.

                        until then peace on earth and the list,

                                        chris

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 08:21:08 -0700
reply-to:     betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>
subject:      re: role reversal (?), and viva uptown lounge!

on  wed, 2 oct 1996, steve shapiro writes:
>
>i just saw live at the uptown lounge, and i just had to say that i think
>it whups all over watershed, imho.  maybe that is just the idle longings
>of one who has never seen them live in concert (not that i have seen them
>live anywhere else...), but i don't think watershed captures the emotion,
>and the humor and the crowd response, and did i mention emotion, of the
>single full (edited) performance like latul.  compared to latul,
>watershed seems like, i don't know, too slick and promoish (coining a new
>word once again) with the videos and the interviews.  don't get me wrong,
>i love watershed (somebody borrowed mine and never returned it, so i
>borrowed my girlfriend's and haven't returned it).  i just love latul
>more :)

i have to concur with this assessment.   i've seen some live shows, and
although this crowd is well behaved ) and obviously knows they are being
taped), it is still great to see a & es connection with each other (can't
stress this enough!) and the audience.  and  i acheive altered states of
consciousness watching amy sing crazy game.


>and....on that note, someone said something about pot being, um,
>something to the effect of whitney-huston-mariah-carey pop music (yes, i
>take liberties with my quote).  anyone want to talk about this?  is there
>a message to this song, or should it be taken at face value only?  does
>there need to be a message behind a song for it to have value?  are there
>other songs that face this problem?  what is the meaning of life (had to
>sneak that in just in case somebody out there knows)?  is there a
>corellation between the relative "depth" of a song and its appeal to the
>general populace?

pot was a powerful song for me as was tws, even though there isn't this
mondo-passionate delivery like amy does with her songs.  there are
definitely messages to these songs - i would kind of doubt that a or e
would write a song with no meaning whatsoever (like the beatles did to
fulfil record contracts).  but i don't think meaning is a prerequisite for
value (or quality) - depending on your definition of value, of which we all
have different ones.  i don't fully understand the reference to houston -
carey other that some commercial success.  yes these are upbeat and
inspirational songs, but i don't find them shallow really either - maybe
simple - but that's ok.  more people 'get' simple i think.

for what its worth,
betsy

-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
..you see turning off the light switch is their only power
      when we stand like spotlights in a mighty tower
                       all for one and one for all
                    then we sing the common call.....
                                                             e. saliers
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 08:03:18 -0700
reply-to:     betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>
subject:      re: amy/emily switch

on  wed, 2 oct 1996, david rogers writes:

>how 'bout amy on the wood song and emily on land of canaan. there can
>never be enough land of canaan variations. they should put it on every
>album.

i strongly agree.  loc has to be one of my favorite amy songs, and i was
sad when amy said (i think on the 1200 curfews liner notes) that they
wouldn't put it on any more albums.  and i'd like to hear emily sing it, as
well as other artists (maybe u2? or bonnie raitt).

>with all the recent talk about religion on this list, i wonder what some
>of y'all think about amy as jesus and emily as mary magdalene on jesus
>christ superstar. i absolutely love their performances on that album. i
>happen to be a straight white male protestant, but i've always thought
>ig music and amy and emily displayed jesus' teachings better than most
>christians. you know, love, forgiveness, kindness, etc. etc.

again, i strongly agree.  i had the misfortune of never seeing (or hearing)
the original jcs so, the "resurrection" with a & e in it was my first
experince (three times in seattle).  i was blown away by it, and i have to
assume part of it was their delivery (this is embarrassing, but e doing
idkhtlh made me cry at the show).  a & e make excellent jc & mm.  although
i won't call myself a christian, ig sort of embodies some of my
interpretation of  what christianity is suppose to be - perhaps stripped
down to its essense.  aren't christians suppose to lead by example?  that's
what i always thought anyway.  who better...... (and i'm not saying they
are gods either - don't flame me, i have dry skin)  now that i think about
it, i think i will order the jcs video on daemon and relive it.  sort of an
early birthday present.  you should do this too, david, you got a birthday
coming up, don't you?

betsy

-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
..you see turning off the light switch is their only power
      when we stand like spotlights in a mighty tower
                       all for one and one for all
                    then we sing the common call.....
                                                             e. saliers
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 10:20:56 -0600
reply-to:     deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>
subject:      shirts are on their way!

hi...i received the list t-shirts yesterday and was able to get a good
portion of them to the post office this morning (i even got a compliment
for having all the packages stamped!). if you ordered an xl, your order has
been processed and is on the way. the shirts went out priority mail so you
should seen them in a few days. i'll try to get to all the other orders
(including the international orders) tonight.

deb

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 11:46:45 -0400
reply-to:     mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mark anthony donajkowski <madonajk@alpha.delta.edu>
subject:      re: to the flame god
x-to:         the searcher <kidfears@flinthills.com>
in-reply-to:  <3.0b28.32.19961001153657.0069b414@pop.flinthills.com>

in actualality(just made that up<g>) we are keeping to the list part of
the ig experience is that they r gay in one of the new songs they sing
dont hate me because im gay or some line like that hence all this
discussion is keeping with that theme

on tue, 1 oct 1996, the searcher wrote:

> at 10:49 am 10/1/96 -0700, you wrote:
> >and publicly, (cause tracey home home home is my very good friend + i'm mad
> >as hell about this flame ) i say...
> >if you only knew the damage your mean spirited words have probably done.
> >people like us who do find enjoyment here on this list... who get joy and
> >find a certain acceptance out of "belonging" here have sometimes used it as
> >a touch stone + a lifeline. it is human contact... without strings attached,
> >with people who are both intelligent + fun. it is a good place to be, and a
> >great read. i refuse to feel unwelcome or give others the impression that
> [snip]
>
> that's all fine, well, and good.... if this was a 'let's all connect and
> feel good' mailing list... but it is not.  it's a mailing list who's
> subject happens to be the music (music.... not personal lives and certainly
> not whether they smoke or not!) of the indigo girls.  anything else is off
> topic and un-appropriate.  can we please stick to the topic of this
> list???????
>
> marianne
>
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>

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 12:00:45 -0400
reply-to:     anne holderried <annieh@mitl.research.panasonic.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         anne holderried <annieh@mitl.research.panasonic.com>
subject:      re: shirts are on their way!

deb,

thanks for all of your hardwork.. it's most appreciated!

deb rules!!!


at 10:20 am 10/2/96 -0600, deb reiser wrote:
>hi...i received the list t-shirts yesterday and was able to get a good
>portion of them to the post office this morning (i even got a compliment
>for having all the packages stamped!). if you ordered an xl, your order has
>been processed and is on the way. the shirts went out priority mail so you
>should seen them in a few days. i'll try to get to all the other orders
>(including the international orders) tonight.
>
>deb
>
>--
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>
>

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 11:12:36 -0500
reply-to:     "jenn. brown" <jennb@owlnet.rice.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "jenn. brown" <jennb@owlnet.rice.edu>
subject:      re : 'goosebump' moments
in-reply-to:  <199610021133.taa20973@sunflower.singnet.com.sg>

goosebumps?
all i can say is: "and there's not enough room in this world for my pain..."

painful.

:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
jennifer nell brown                 :                          630-8530
jenn./jenni b                       :             jennb@owlnet.rice.edu
english major and procrastinator    :            lovett college, rm 305
   extraordinaire                   :      //www.owlnet.rice.edu/~jennb

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 12:40:06 -0400
reply-to:     hunterj1@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jude hunter <hunterj1@aol.com>
subject:      re: mcc on tv

hey all--just noticed mcc will be on tv tonight (here in d.c. area around 10
pm). don't think i will be home to tape it but if any body does, give me a
rattle.  did manage to tape "lakota woman" last weekend (the story of the
second seige at wounded knee in 1973).

cheers and *please* take your beautiful pill for the day!

jude :) <---unemployed but still smiling

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 13:18:13 -0400
reply-to:     joann melnik <jmelnik@lucent.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         joann melnik <jmelnik@lucent.com>
subject:      gays, christianity, etc. (nigc)

as a lesbian christian, i've read all the posts on this subject
and sat on my hands..... but now i feel compelled to contribute
my traditional $0.20:

first:

>as i sit here contemplating all the posts about religious differances and
>homosexuality...etc. i feel compelled to express my truth here.as i get
>older(i turn 40 on friday oct.4th) i find that i am constantly amazed that
>humanity has yet to figure out the bottom line in all this...that we are all
>dependent on each other in this life..no matter what our philosophical
>differances are.no matter what,you still are dependant on that jewish lesbian
>doctor to take out your tonsils,that homophobic farmer in kansas to grow the
>wheat for your bread,that afro american talk show host for entertainment and
>so on.when a person is attacked for their individual beliefs it diminishes
>not only the whole of humanity but the the attacker as well.i may not always
>appreciate or understand the views listed here but i try my best to treat all
>as i would want to be treated myself.our intrest in ig is the common
>ground,and the music brings to each of us a special message.but this list is
>wonderful example of  how  similar our experiences and feelings about the
>music are,even in our diversity.

amen--  what a beautiful statement.

second:

as a christian, i use the following verses to govern my behavior
toward others (regardless of sexual orientation, race, religion,
gender etc.):

john(13:34-35):
a new command i give you: love one another. as i have loved you, so
you must love one another. by this all men will know that you are my
disciples, if you love one another.

luke(6:31)
do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

matthew(7:1-5)
do not judge; or you too will be judged. for in the same way you
judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use,
it will be measured to you.

why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye
and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? how can you
say to your brother 'let me take the spec out of your eye,' when
all the time there is a plank in you own eye? you hypocrite, first
take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly
to remove the speck from your brother's eye.

third:

while i did speak up previously expressing my belief that a
certain amount of political/off topic content is appropriate
for this list, i also said

   "(provided any such discussions were conducted with respect and common courtesy, ie
   no flaming)."

clearly this topic has gone beyond that. this is a very emotionally
charged topic and it is very unlikely that anyone will change anyone's
opinion with postings on this mailing list. this is one of those instances
where you have to just agree to disagree or take the discussion elsewhere.

if you're interested in more info, a couple of good web links on the topic
are:

        1. http://www.bway.net/~halsall/lgbh.html
        2. http://www.critpath.org/pflag-talk/other/


joann
jmelnik@lucent.com

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 19:00:00 bst
reply-to:     rachel sefton-smith <seffy@epic.co.uk>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         rachel sefton-smith <seffy@epic.co.uk>
subject:      nff & b'shoot boots (uk)/speakeasy

hi folks,

boots...
things have been strangely quiet on my branch of these trees  - if any uk or
euro listie wants either the nff or bumbershoot boot then give me a shout.

gail:  been trying to reply but having problems with your c'serve address
and have lost your other address - get in touch!

georg:  aargh! found your envelope in the bottom of a bag - meant to post it
weeks ago - humble apologies  will be in post tomorrow, promise :) and
thanks for the patti...

speakeasy...
just in case anyone fancies popping down to loverly brighton, the next
speakeasy is on monday 7th oct, at cybar, 9-12 middle st, 9pm start.  some
really excellent performers this month, including trio hysteria, (acappella
delights from this womens group),  danny goring (fine songwriter/guitarist -
reminds me of gerard mchugh), shoddy hornbills (folk/new country duo from
london - originals and watch out for some shawn colvin & mary cc covers) and
the tina bell group (folk/rock from this brighton based guitar,cello, bass
and tabla combo).


**************
seffy
     cod==#
**************

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 14:09:42 -0400
reply-to:     cari l cartwright <cartwri6@pilot.msu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         cari l cartwright <cartwri6@pilot.msu.edu>
subject:      re: ahhhhh!

ditto amy.  please, please, please take all this hatred elsewhere.  i'm not
particularly fond of the christian religion (notice i said the *religion* not
the *followers*) but i don't feel it necessary to spew trash on a list that has
increasingly little to do with the indigo girls.
    i ask that all of you who are not particularly fond of my sexuality do the
same thing in return.  if you don't like christianity, don't practice it.  if
you don't like homosexuality, don't practice it.  thank you.
cari
all flames can be sent to
cartwri6@pilot.msu.edu

--
+'~'+.,.+'~'+,.,+'~'+
i don't like death,
i like the decay.
+'~'+,.,+'~'+,.,+'~'+

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 14:24:33 -0400
reply-to:     problem child <warra5c0@numen.elon.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         problem child <warra5c0@numen.elon.edu>
subject:      re: amy/emily switching songs
x-to:         deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
in-reply-to:  <199610020650.caa05706@asimov.oit.umass.edu>

on wed, 2 oct 1996, deb odonoghue wrote:

> hello to all in the land of indigo!
>
> since i couldn't sleep i figured i would respond to the amy/emily
> switching songs thread.
>
> i would love to hear amy sing lead on love will come to you, you and me
> of the 10,000 wars and ghost.  to hear her voice all gentle and sweet :)
>
> i think it would be cool for emily to sing lead on center stage, reunion
> and tried to be true.  i'd love to hear emiy's voice sound a little bit
> rougher like on the sf version of land of canaan and high horse.
>                                                      ^^^^^^^^^^^
this doesn't really have much to do with this post, but what is high
horse on?....  thanks!  -mandy


> i wonder if they would ever entertain the idea of reversing roles in
> a song to mix it up, or for sheer enjoyment of their faithful fans, who
> sit around and imagine all these strange requests for them to do ;)
>
> on another note, i love high horse!!!  each time i listen to my sf tape
> i can't help but rewind it at least 3 or 4 times.  it rocks!
> all in favor of staging a request to revive high horse speak now!
> i'd love to hear in on the spring tour!
>
> take care and peace all!
>
> -deb
>
> --
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>

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 11:47:07 -0700
reply-to:     candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net>
subject:      nigc--buffy st. marie

just in case anyone who lives up here in the western area is interested, =
there's going to be an hour long special about buffy saint marie on =
wednesday at 8:00.  its about her reisitance to naitve american =
opression through her music...should be interesting.  i'm taping it, so =
all you eastern folks let me know if you want a copy.


..wheels in motion...
greta


"...and when i'm driving down the street and i see some guy with a =
bumpersticker and it says something i don't believe in, what i want to =
do--i mean i try to be understanding--but what i really want to do is go =
faster and faster and ram into the back of his car!!"
-amy ray

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 19:13:09 +0000
reply-to:     andrew stokell <rbc31@dial.pipex.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         andrew stokell <rbc31@dial.pipex.com>
subject:      ig on 'unplugged'

hey fellow ig-type people!

i'm putting out this appeal again, in the hope that some kind soul out
there'll take pity on me (and a fellow listee).
we're looking for a copy of the tape of the mtv 'unplugged' session that
featured ig and michelle shocked. now i know that there are kind and
helpful people out there on the list (i've dealt with several of you now,
so take a bow!). can someone help? would be most grateful, and of course
we can sort out some goodies in exchange.

come on guys, don't let me down!


andrew

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 13:28:46 -0500
reply-to:     tracy - czar of failure <clumber@smtp.prostar.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         tracy - czar of failure <clumber@smtp.prostar.com>
subject:      igc: guessing at the 1st single

subtitled: my attempt at  a thread that won't be able to bring about any
hurt feelings, tizzies, or even a shred of sparks.

        so, choosing from our certainly incomplete list of new songs.. which
do y'all expect to see released as the first single?  actually, we could
probably make this a 2 answer thread and ask:
        1: which do you think will be the 1st single ?
                and
        2: which do you want to be the 1st single ?

        my imowo (in my often wrong opinion) answer to 1 is "shame on you".
i base that upon several things, and especially that it was played at
bumbershoot as part of the encore... a place in concerts *often* reserved
for the more popular songs a band has.  (i said often, just a personal
observation, not a rule, and not intending to irk anyone or claim to *know*
!)  plus, it seems like a good "bouncy" song that also supports the strong
political beliefs of the ig of late.   then again... i was absolutely
*shocked* that "touch me fall" was the 1st single from swamp.  so what do i
know?
        for #2 my imowo answer is "it's alright"... i just love it.  soy is
probably my favorite of the new songs as yet... but i would still love to
see ia be the first single... color me a diehard amy person... but easily in
touch with my emily side.  :-)

        publically requesting greg and dwayne to join this thread?
<hopeful friendly peaceful smile  ... how do you do that in ascii?>

tracy <definitely a loser dork idiot, but hoping not to come across as
self-righteous this time?>

ps is it not hysterically funny that my spellcheck actually recognizes
"tizzies" as a word!! lol!

"i never lie.
        oh, that wasn't the truth..."
                -- danielle howle, 28 august 1996

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 15:45:57 -0700
reply-to:     "kollin s. fencil" <ksfencil@jol.mobil.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "kollin s. fencil" <ksfencil@jol.mobil.com>
organization: mobil oil corporation
subject:      new album?

as i am new to this group, today actually, did someone say ig are coming
out with a new album...if so when?

peace

kollin

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 14:32:42 -0400
reply-to:     water <mroberts@coe.uga.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         water <mroberts@coe.uga.edu>
subject:      honor the earth stuff
x-to:         atlartists@monsterbit.com

got this from the honor the earth mailing list.  thought y'all would be
interested.


>athens benefit
>members of the athens observer are organizing a benefit for the honor the
>earth campaign in athens, georgia at the atomic music hall on saturday,
>november 2.  the event will feature a set of great local bands.  steve
>dixon of daemon is the hte liason to the benefit.
>

          http://www.mindspring.com/~water/rose.html
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

"returning to the mountains, i gave my face to the rain,
i was cleansed of confusion, freed from the pain.
mountains said, "soar with us, rest in the valley down below."
i answered, "i am worthy, nurture me and i will grow." "
         -j.g.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 16:22:16 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      ig fans on camera?

while watching live at the uptown and watershed, i always find myself
wondering if any fellow listees were lucky enough to make it in either
video. with all the crowd shots and people waiting in line on watershed, it
seems kind of probible that someone out there must be among them. so,
anybody have a story to tell about being caught on camera? i mean, how cool
would that be to be documented forever as a crazed, devoted fan in one of
their videos?! just wonderin' :)


~abigail


"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 16:22:13 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      clinton/gore yes igc!

the other day i found a recent photo of amy and emily on an ig web sight,
and emily was wearing a "clinton/gore" campaign shirt. i'm not trying to
speculate on who they plan on voting for (as far as i know, nader/laduke
probably aren't even on the georgia ticket) but that seemed kind of odd to
me to see her wearing a shirt in support of clinton. i know amy has openly
spoken out her disapproval of clinton, but i do keep forgetting that they
are two different people with very different opinions on some things! i was
just thinking that with winona laduke running for vp and all, they'd
probably support her, even though realistically the choice will probably
boil down to dole vs. clinton. am i making any sense? anyone else have a
clue what i'm trying to say? appologies for the political babbling :)

~abigail
"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 17:15:20 -0400
reply-to:     christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
subject:      emily's solo tape

hi friends and neighbors, all.

does anyone out there have a copy of emily's solo tape?  i know it exists,
although perhaps only at the level of discourse.  i *need* it.  it's
either that or phone sex, kids, so please.  help me conserve my much
needed funds from the evils of 976 numbers and get me emily's solo tape!

indigo crayons to all,
chris ii

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 17:23:00 -0400
reply-to:     indigofrk@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sasha friedman <indigofrk@aol.com>
subject:      non-lyric quotes kind of.....

this isn't exactly a non-lyric quote, but it isn't an original lyric quote,
if that makes sense.when i saw ig at patriot center in 1994, it was right
around the time when bill clinton was looking for a new surgeon general and
when a and e sing let it be me instead of saying
"well the world seems  spent
and the president
has no good idea who the masses are" ( or something close to that)

emily sings
"well the world seems spent
and the president
has no idea who the surgeon general is ..."

i found it quite amusing.

peace
sasha

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 17:15:05 -0400
reply-to:     indigofrk@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sasha friedman <indigofrk@aol.com>
subject:      nigc-ani in dc

ok, last time i made a mistake when i posted this, but is anyone on the list
going to see ani difranco in washington dc at lisner auditorium on nov 17 ???
just wondering, because i'd like to meet some of you people.  anyways. last
time i posted it as nov22  and my apologies to anyone it may have confused
because that was wrong.  it sounded right at the time.   oh well.

peace
sasha

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 16:47:19 -0500
reply-to:     the searcher <kidfears@flinthills.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         the searcher <kidfears@flinthills.com>
subject:      re: emily's solo tape
x-to:         christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>

at 05:15 pm 10/2/96 -0400, you wrote:
>hi friends and neighbors, all.
>
>does anyone out there have a copy of emily's solo tape?  i know it exists,
>although perhaps only at the level of discourse.  i *need* it.  it's
>either that or phone sex, kids, so please.  help me conserve my much
>needed funds from the evils of 976 numbers and get me emily's solo tape!

ah ha!
so i am not the only person who has heard of this tape.  does anyone have
any info about this beast (i asked this question twice in the past year and
no one knew a thing about it!!!)

marianne

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 16:27:57 -0600
reply-to:     greg matthew flamer <gflame@nwu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         greg matthew flamer <gflame@nwu.edu>
subject:      re: igc: guessing at the 1st single

>        1: which do you think will be the 1st single ?

tracy home home home brings up a fine thread :).  friends now?  :)

and in all amazement, i agree with her on all counts.  :o  shame on you
seems like the most likely first single on the map album (someone asked
when it would be released and i believe spring of 97 is as specific as
anyone knows yet).  it is peppy.   it is zippy.  (it's bouncy according to
tracy).  it is awesome.  besides the whole lalala thing means it will make
top 40 (blah!!).  i hope this song does well like ctf.  i want amy (errrr
me errr amy) to finally have a big single.

>        2: which do you want to be the 1st single ?

again agreement with tracy (wow).  it's allright (sp?) is a fave of mine.
the hate me cuz i'm gay line is just really appropriate for our political
time.  and i vote this song to be the theme song for ellen degeneres' new
show, "all i can do to make disney nervous".

>        publically requesting greg and dwayne to join this thread?
> <hopeful friendly peaceful smile  ... how do you do that in ascii?>

i'm here dah-ling.

igc is good no?

greg

!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!*
# greg m. flamer               northwestern university   @
* 1411 w. sherwin ave # 1n     mfm520@lulu.acns.nwu.edu  $
& chicago, il  60626           gflame@nwu.edu            *
^                                                        &
#   "when you're learning to face the path at your pace  )
&    every choice is worth your while"--indigo girls     *
*                                                        !
!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*!@#$%^&*%$

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 18:02:30 -0400
reply-to:     renee l grebe <grebe+@cmu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         renee l grebe <grebe+@cmu.edu>
subject:      re: clinton/gore yes igc!
in-reply-to:  <1.5.4.32.19961002212213.0070b7d8@mail.execpc.com>

excerpts from mail: 2-oct-96 clinton/gore yes igc! by abigail@execpc.com
> i found a recent photo of amy and emily on an ig web sight,
> and emily was wearing a "clinton/gore" campaign shirt.


far as i know, that clinton/gore t-shirt picture of amy and emily is
from newport folk festival about 3 years ago.  anyone out there to back
me up?

renee

* ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ *

"the same sun that warms your heart    "the beautiful ladies walk right by
will suck the good earth dry..."       ya know i never know what to say!"
       "get out the map"                       "shame on you"
        by emily saliers                        by amy ray

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 18:06:39 -0400
reply-to:     lori brinkman <lorbrink@iaw.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         lori brinkman <lorbrink@iaw.com>
subject:      computer whizzes help(nigc)

hi-sorry to post to the whole list, but i'm sure there are computer whizzes
that may be able to help me and i'm sick of spending hours playing around
with my computer.
i would like to access programs through norton desktop and can only access
them through my program manager.  which norton file should i copy files to
(from the hard drive or from program manager) to be able to access them from
"window" in norton?  just doing the usual file copy or move thing in norton
will only allow me to work with files already in icons in norton already.  i
can copy files from the hard drive to ndw but they don't appear in my
"window" choices.  i think there must be a specific ndw file to copy them to.
i hope someone can help!
thanks, lori

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 18:10:48 -0400
reply-to:     nlyng@prolog.net
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         nlyng@prolog.net
subject:      re: nigc--buffy st. marie
in-reply-to:  <01bbb057.73aecee0@ptpm052.olympus.net>

hey all,

on wed, 2 oct 1996, candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net> wrote:
>there's going to be an hour long special about buffy saint marie on wednesday
>at 8:00.  its about her reisitance to naitve american opression through her
>music...

also....if anyone would like to sample bstm's stuff, there's a cd store nearby
that has no less than 2 releases....i haven't taken the plunge myself, but if
anyone was looking for anything specific, i'd be more than happy to check it out
for ya...

:) eric

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 18:39:50 -0400
reply-to:     mmedido@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mmedido@aol.com
subject:      ig and ani q ?

soooo.....
amy an' emily backed up ani on 'not a pretty girl" huh ?
all i can say is.....
chills baby !

am i imagining things or did i hear that the guthrie thing was gunna be
filmed for telivizing some place, somewhere ????

glad to see things getting calmer around here...i thought for a minute
we were going to have to start administering some spankings.
amy and emily can't go into the studio for one minute before
we get cranky and start eating our young it would seem ;)

i must say that i showed great restraint and resisted re-posting the
entire messages regarding 'me too' and stuff (including headers !! :)
and adding "me too !"....but i figured that some folks might not find
that as hilarious as i did...but i actually broke out into a smile at the
thought (heh, heh)

tah tah my darlings !
binky
"i'm neallie !!!!! neallie o'haraaaaah !!!!!!!! *sob*"
(neallie o'harah) ( my bootifull 'lil dolls )

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 19:05:16 -0400
reply-to:     sam22479@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "samantha a. weisman" <sam22479@aol.com>
subject:      re: astrological signs
x-to:         j.l.a.long@reading.ac.uk

in a message dated 96-09-28 09:42:07 edt, j.l.a.long@reading.ac.uk (juliet
long) writes:

<< so ...aren't there really any other pisces out there????

...sounds kinda fishy to me!! :)

juliet. >>


i'm a pisces!!!!!  alright!!!!?????  :)   hee hee, but i have an aries
rising.  how weird.  my astrologer told me i was a whale instead of a
fish....

samantha

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 19:05:20 -0400
reply-to:     sam22479@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "samantha a. weisman" <sam22479@aol.com>
subject:      re: jill sobule
x-to:         ablipman@sas.upenn.edu

in a message dated 96-09-30 21:48:25 edt, ablipman@sas.upenn.edu (andrea
lipman) writes:

<< --- you wrote:
>the answer is jill soube i thinks thats how her last name is spelt she did
>the song supermodel on the clueless soundtrack
>--- end of quoted material ---

>nope its jill sobule. and juliana hatfield sings supermodel.

>oooooh, susie so smartie-pants

>bwahahah juts playing friends...

>susan

no, mark's right too...jill sobule sings "supermodel" on "jill sobule" and
on the "clueless" soundtrack.  but, she didn't write it, & neither did
juliana hatfield.  david baerwald, david kitay, brian macleod, & kristen
vigard did.  look who's the smartiepants!  :)
  >>

oooh oooh oooh you guys are driving me nuts.  that's a horrible thing to do
to me considering the fact that i am already crazy.  i am now going to go
have dreams about juliana hatfield and jill sobule being the same person but
four other people talking for them and i can't take it!  let's just stick to
amy and emily.......  :)

sam

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 19:05:17 -0400
reply-to:     sam22479@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "samantha a. weisman" <sam22479@aol.com>
subject:      re: astrological signs
x-to:         j.l.a.long@reading.ac.uk

in a message dated 96-09-28 09:42:07 edt, j.l.a.long@reading.ac.uk (juliet
long) writes:

<< ps. anyone know what signs a & e are??
  >>

yup-- just look at the song "let it be me"  emily is singing: "i was born
under the sign of cancer..." and then amy jumps in with "capricorn too".

sam

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 19:05:19 -0400
reply-to:     sam22479@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "samantha a. weisman" <sam22479@aol.com>
subject:      re: nigc: more anti-gay trash (yes, more nigc)
x-to:         jenhall@juno.com

in a message dated 96-09-29 02:42:06 edt, jenhall@juno.com (jen hall) writes:

<< i always thought religious people followed the bible page
for page - - - not pick and choose what they do and don't want to
support.  i think the bible bangers should follow the amish...just keep
to themselves and make their own life the way they want and leave
everyone else alone. >>

it's funny, but i've always noticed that "bible bangers" only "bang" when
convenient to them.  my god!  if they were to take every page literally do
you know how screwed up our society would be?  even menstruating is
considered a sin in the bible, and there is some elaborate process for
cleansing this sinner (and i don't mean douche)!
among so many other examples.  plus the bible has a neat little way of
contradicting itself all over the place, (duh-- it was written by lots of
people!!!), often the same story repeated in a totally different way.
cute little example: did anyone know that moses had a sister?  not only that,
but in one version of the parting of the seas (in the bible) it was his
_sister_ that parted them!!!
anyway, i'm done now.  i have no problem with the bible.  just some of the
hypocrits that use it.

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 18:44:57 edt
reply-to:     oh susanna <oh.susanna@dartmouth.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "susan b. marine" <susan.b.marine@dartmouth.edu>
subject:      flashback to high school (nigc)

--- you wrote:
i know that hebrew union college
has officailly oked
--- end of quoted material ---

i oked once, all over my prom date. he was not happy.

sorry, couldn't resist. "oked" was our word for puked in high school. and yes,
i did oke on him. i laugh so hard just thinking about it!!!

yes binky, its the same thing as "varmiting" :)

love y'all little hunnies

susan

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 19:59:21 -0400
reply-to:     "peter a. barta" <bartap@bulldog.georgetown.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "peter a. barta" <bartap@bulldog.georgetown.edu>
subject:      jcs
in-reply-to:  <3251bad9.4b7b@utkux.utcc.utk.edu>

i think amy's performance of gethesmane (i only want to say) is her
strongest yet. the incredible passion of a confused, scared, bitter jesus
facing his own death is amazingly well conveyed. if you don't own jesus
christ superstar: a ressurection, run out and buy it. it features both
amy and emily and it's usually priced around $16 for 2 cds.


peter a. barta
bartap@bulldog.georgetown.edu


"everything that i believe,             "i want to live as an honest man,
crawls from underneath the streets.      to get all i deserve,
everything i truly love,                 and to give all i can,
comes from somewhere high above."        and to love a young woman
                                         that i don't understand."
                        - amy ray
                                                - suzanne vega

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 17:32:45 -0800
reply-to:     stacey silcox <silcoxsl@plu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         stacey silcox <silcoxsl@plu.edu>
subject:      airplane song
x-to:         jen lucero <jlucero@monmouth.com>
in-reply-to:  <199610010645.caa22256@shell.monmouth.com>

just for the record airplane was, is and always will be one of my all
time favorite indigo girls songs.
-give it a chance-

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 21:04:29 -0400
reply-to:     indigovic@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "victor k. wertz" <indigovic@aol.com>
subject:      re: indigo-girls digest - 2 oct 1996 - special issue

<<while watching live at the uptown and watershed, i always find myself
wondering if any fellow listees were lucky enough to make it in either
video.>>

um, i'm only sort of kind of in "watershed."  at least, my voice is.  and so
is the result of my being goofy at an ig show.  it was at the lisner
auditorium of george washington university, in washington, dc, on april 21,
1990.

this was the first time i'd seen amy and emily play outside of atlanta, and i
noticed that the crowd was being much more quiet than the typical atlanta
crowd.  there wasn't much interaction between the girls and the audience, the
way i was used to.  so my friend and i started to make strange requests from
the stage.  the intent was to loosen up the audience a bit, and it seemed to
work well.  anyway, some of the request were in-joke-y ("walk away--*with*
all the 'babys'"), some were just songs i'd was pretty sure they wouldn't
actually do ("high horse"), and some were just completely whacked, like the
one that ended up on watershed.  for absolutely no reason whatsoever, we
requested "eensie weensie spider."  stunned, we were, when they actually sang
it.

they played the next night, at the same venue, and we made similar stupid
requests, including "eensie weensie spider."  emily said that they preferred
"itsy bitsy spider," so they sang that instead.  after the show, we weaseled
our way backstage, and we talked to amy, and emily, and amy's dad, who said
that he was videotaping parts of the show, and offered to send me a tape of
"itsy bitsy spider."  well, a short while later, i got a note from amy's mom,
explaining that they had looked for it, but couldn't find "itsy bitsy
spider." so she sent me something else instead.  amy's parents were really,
really nice.

fast forward five years.  amy and emily manage to shock me again when i buy
the watershed video, and find "eensie weensie spider" on the tape.  i'm
pretty certain it's from the first night at lisner (because they sing "eensie
weensie not "itsy bitsy,").  and i believe that that's me you hear screaming
"yeah!" as they start singing.

that's my "brush with ig video history."

i'm actually *in* michelle malone's promo videocassette, "building fires over
atlanta."  i'm in there quite a bit, really.  and i managed to not look too
dorky, too.  i'm also easily picked out in the audience photo of the
"building fires" cd and cassette.  i'm the guy in the white shirt in the
front row, staright down from jonny d, the guitarist.  ooh.  now ya know.

-vic.
.

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 21:08:40 -0400
reply-to:     michael reynolds <asl@umcs.maine.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         michael reynolds <asl@umcs.maine.edu>
subject:      re: not bloody ig related but read anyhow about band with
x-to:         madonajk@alpha.delta.edu
in-reply-to:  <pine.osf.3.95.961001135110.17754e-100000@alpha.delta.edu> from
              "mark anthony donajkowski" at oct 1, 96 01:53:59 pm

you deserve to live without your own personal computer and without a modem
but to only have an school email address. juno ands their software is nice,
i havent the need for it now but sometime in my life i may. i have somewhere
around 6 or 7, maybe 8 different acctounts, so your ignorant, pathetic and
insipid rant that bandwidth doesn't matter because "juno is free" is
pointless. bandwidth such as religeous views, bickering about whether
homosexuality is a sin, blah, blah blah is stupid.  as a person who has
vested personal as well as professional ties to the net, where one email can
make the difference between me landing a design job on the www, writing an
artiucle for the paper, hearing from a person i am trying to coordinate
meetings, editorial boards for my practicum project or, just as important to
some, making contacts for some bootleg trades, piling through 100+ posts in
a day is a total waste of my time!  i also administer a listserv, and have
plenty to deal with elsewhere in my life. i do not see where bandwidth comes
into play at all.  please i am not at all against most nigc, i mean the
strength in this list lies in being able to ask for things such as
videotapes of stations you cant receive, finding places to stay on trips,
finding out a show from another artist you enjoy is close to home, ect.
flame wars about homosexuality arent going to change people's minds. i did
want to post on woman's spaces, actually in support of them, as every
minority has a right to have it's separate identity at times, but then 200
people felt the overwhelming need to post their astrological sign.
sorry if i am bitching, i mean i have plowed through all of these emails
(and i already checked my email this morning) and *i* do have some cool info
about the nader/laduke campaign...lets just save it until i get through all
of today's mail, or whenever i last checked, which isnt >24 hours!
mike r.

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 20:37:11 -0400
reply-to:     michael reynolds <asl@umcs.maine.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         michael reynolds <asl@umcs.maine.edu>
subject:      re: clinton/gore yes igc!
x-to:         grebe+@cmu.edu
in-reply-to:  <cmiinq200iwsqaply_@andrew.cmu.edu> from "renee l grebe" at oct
              2, 96 06:02:30 pm

i dont remember that shirt from three yrs ago @ newport, but emily wore one
at the march on  washington in '93...
mike r.
*who just got the story of his life (even some igc...) details to come*

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 20:07:04 -0700
reply-to:     virginia wolffe <vrgwolf1@mail.airmail.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         virginia wolffe <vrgwolf1@mail.airmail.net>
subject:      re: nigc: more anti-gay trash (yes, more nigc)

samantha a. weisman wrote:
>
> in a message dated 96-09-29 02:42:06 edt, jenhall@juno.com (jen hall) writes:
>
> << i always thought religious people followed the bible page
>  for page - - - not pick and choose what they do and don't want to
>  support.  i think the bible bangers should follow the amish...just keep
>  to themselves and make their own life the way they want and leave
>  everyone else alone. >>
>
> it's funny, but i've always noticed that "bible bangers" only "bang" when
> convenient to them.  my god!  if they were to take every page literally do
> you know how screwed up our society would be?  even menstruating is
> considered a sin in the bible, and there is some elaborate process for
> cleansing this sinner (and i don't mean douche)!
> among so many other examples.  plus the bible has a neat little way of
> contradicting itself all over the place, (duh-- it was written by lots of
> people!!!), often the same story repeated in a totally different way.
> cute little example: did anyone know that moses had a sister?  not only that,
> but in one version of the parting of the seas (in the bible) it was his
> _sister_ that parted them!!!
> anyway, i'm done now.  i have no problem with the bible.  just some of the
> hypocrits that use it.
>
> --
> administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
> to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
>         with the line: signoff indigo-girls

hi, i just wanted to add my 2-cents... first, the bible was written long
ago and contains much old jewish law... many books were written by
different people who were around at the same time or shortly after
...hence different takes or stories on the same situation, just a
different perspective. that is quite reasonable. second, when christ
came, he "fullfilled" the old law... there was no need to follow it
anymore and "earn" salvation... now we can just follow him and by grace
(our sight grows stronger) and we are saved. please, please...don't judge
the bible by the old testament... the new testament is what to read.
focus on christ and his love and message....read john...or romans... btw
i am no bible thumper...as i like to say, "i am not religious, i just
love the lord!"  i believe there are many paths to the top of the
mountain and feel the biggest problem we have concerning such things is
that "christians"  are too busy pointing thier fingers at each other
(which we are called not to do "don't point out the speck in your
brother's eye and ignore the log in your own") instead of focusing on the
real calling which is to reach out and love one another... if we all just
did that... imagine!  imagine all the people living life in
peace...yoooohooooo you may say that i'm a dreamer... but i'm not the
only one... :) peace and love...

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 19:31:30 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      ellen!!!(nigc)

just a note to anyone living in a time zone where tonight's episode of ellen
hasn't been aired yet--watch it! the show is only half over where i live,
and i don't want to spoil it for anyone who hasn't seen it yet, but it's a
big episode!


:) abigail


"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 21:44:22 -0500
reply-to:     "jenn. brown" <jennb@owlnet.rice.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "jenn. brown" <jennb@owlnet.rice.edu>
subject:      modern dance (igc)
in-reply-to:  <pine.sco.3.91.961002195730.3647b-100000@bulldog.georgetown.edu>

i'm in the student modern dance group here at rice u., and the trio i'm
in just decided to do our piece to 'love's recovery' :) it was very
cool that almost all of the songs we were considering were ig...

:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)
jennifer nell brown                 :                          630-8530
jenn./jenni b                       :             jennb@owlnet.rice.edu
english major and procrastinator    :            lovett college, rm 305
   extraordinaire                   :      //www.owlnet.rice.edu/~jennb

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 23:22:40 -0400
reply-to:     "m.macvey" <mmacvey@attach.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "m.macvey" <mmacvey@attach.net>
subject:      re: same-sex marriage in a religious sense (nigc)
x-to:         alec heller <alec@nyc.pipeline.com>

> much of the
>ceremony is based on the "be fertile and increase" type thing.
alec ..

my take on that is that we have " gone forth and multiplied " too well,
and that it is time for for marriage to evolve further to meet the
global needs of human society and the other creatures we share this world
with. if you believe in the bible then you have to admit that  incestuous
partnerships were sanctioned in the past. ( if adam and eve are the
progenitors of all us), but we evolved beyond that.i could give more
example but for band-widths sake..
  the need to populate the earth is no more, but there is still a need
for loving environment for children to grow. traditional/nuclear family,
single parent, same-sex...is not the important thing, but the affection
and caring environment is. for people to be able to join together in a
legally sanctioned partnership (with rights and responsibilities) should
provide stability and  an economic advantage ( by pooling resources). and
with the aging of our population there are going to to be more old
people, who are going to be healthier and more active than the aged in
the past. if two old men or old women want to pair up, support and care
for each other, it would be to societies benefit as it could keep them
economically independent longer, which is going to be even more important
when the ssi runs out of money. why limit it to pairs, why not let
individuals define the size and identity of there new families? . give
them legal standing and let them buy group insurance.
  besides, as females are still likely to outlive the males for a few
years, there are going to be an abundance of widows looking for
companionship et al, and as most of the old alpha males their age will be
looking for  young delta females, who will they have to turn to? <;-)
  so marriage and society  has to keep evolving. the religions will
eventually come around too, (looking into my crystal ball)..
just my humble thoughts
flame away if you feel you must( seems like a lot of that going
around.must have something to do with astrology)

marilyn ( an alpha female, and a pisces, which may be why i seem to be
swimming against the current all the time)

i am a problem child- i've been wild all my days...(a.ray)

..still crazy after all these years.. (p. simon)

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 22:05:28 -0500
reply-to:     susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
subject:      re: favorite quotes

howdy all!

glad to see everyone is peaceful again. one of our favorite non-lyric =
quotes is from the in with the out crowd bootleg cd, at the end of least =
complicated, where the crowd turns the "na na na"s into some kind of all =
night rave, they speed it up, and it goes on and on, and finally a&e are =
laughing and amy says::
"it just has a life of its own!" or something to that effect.

peace, love and understanding,

susan and jocelyn

"a moment of peace is worth every war behind us" - es

" me and jesus, we're of the same heart. the only thing that
keeps us distant is that i keep fucking up." - ar

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 21:54:41 -0400
reply-to:     michael reynolds <asl@umcs.maine.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         michael reynolds <asl@umcs.maine.edu>
subject:      my talk with r. nader..(dream come true...)

imagine a person starts writing for the campus paper because he needs to get
his work published and has to have a portfolio. that was my intent when i
was going to re-try my hand at print journalism. (i think i needed to be a
creative for a while..) so i signed up as a staff writer.
first story was about a workshop on native american culture and teaching it
as curriculum for grade school kids.. i don't think it will be a peabody
award winner. good first article to be paid for tho.
second assignment: review the incredible pearl jam show i got to go and see.
(does that make me any less of a indigo girls fan ms. jen hall?? ) it was a
cool story, cant say i would review the indigo girls, honestly because i
would not be objective, and besides, i dont think it be as enjoyable as
seeing the show as a fan.
the third assignment...this is a dream come true. i love ralph nader, not
too sure i will vote for him, but i would love to see him in clinton's
cabinet. but that's beside the point. he was rumored to be speaking up here,
but the editor was a bit hesitant to grant me the story. she had no
specifics about when it was.
i saw the flyer last night, called her, told her i could do it and she gave
it to me. i knew this is my chance. i have a bazillion things running
thruogh my mind, like clarifications of statements he wrote twenty years
ago.  winola laduke was definitely a topic, so i am getting all psyched up
and i finished this assignment i lost 4 times due to various computer
errors, made a call to a mentor, had an *incredible* conversation. my friend
is a very well connected person in the state green party and so i had access
to a possible interview.
   well the rally was good, ralph was running late and had to go to two
television stations, all print media was to follow him or setup alternate
plans. my heart sank, there was no way a college paper was going to set up
alternate plans so there i was following him around to two television
stations. thankfully my transportation was willing (i get by with a lot of
help from my friends) but it all paid off.
i was the only reporter who did it, ralph gave me like 15 minutes to
interview him, we talked about why he chose laduke , his future plans, just
typical stuff. he says my questions arer the most well informed that he has
answered in his travels through maine (i just about fainted!) it was a
awesome interview. one problem did arise.
     there was no staff photographer from the paper, the guy who was going
had a class. i bought a 35 mm in atlanta because my slr died while on
vacation. i, for reasons i was sworn to never reveal on this list, also
bought a roll of black and white film. it was still in my camera and it
worked out that the only photos that the paper would use are black and
white.
so i have to work on this article. i know most of you will think it is just
another article. i consider it talking to a progressive legend. my article
goes in friday, i am sooooo psyched to not only meet nader, but to interview
a dynamic and influenicial individual is such a honor. not too bad for my
third story...
sorry for not much igc, but it sorta relates. i think...
mike r.

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 22:27:42 -0500
reply-to:     susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
subject:      re: jcs

howdy!

>>>>peter a. barta says:  i think amy's performance of gethesmane (i =
only want to say) is her
strongest yet. the incredible passion of a confused, scared, bitter =
jesus
facing his own death is amazingly well conveyed. if you don't own jesus
christ superstar: a ressurection, run out and buy it. it features both
amy and emily and it's usually priced around $16 for 2 cds.<<<<<<<<


we second that emotion - but don't flame us for "me too-ing" we have =
something else to add:
order the videotape from daemon! this is a tape of jcsar performance at =
austin at sxsw a while back. the live music on it is awesome. it rocks! =
it is a rock opera. they nail it - the entire cast - i could myself for =
having missed that live (damn damn damn! - or - if you are from atlanta =
- dang dang dang!) but the video is the next best thing. best of all, =
it's for a good cause:  proceeds go to fight hand gun violence :) you =
can order it directly from daemon records:=20
internet: www.monsterbit.com/daemon/
snail mail: daemon records
        p.o. box 1207
        decatur, ga 30031

order now - it's a hoot!

peace, love and digging the underground,
susan and jocelyn

" me and jesus, we're of the same heart. the only thing that
keeps us distant is that i keep fucking up." - amy ray

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 23:31:36 -0400
reply-to:     problem child <warra5c0@numen.elon.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         problem child <warra5c0@numen.elon.edu>
subject:      re: emily's solo tape
x-to:         the searcher <kidfears@flinthills.com>
in-reply-to:  <3.0b28.32.19961002164654.006a8454@pop.flinthills.com>

on wed, 2 oct 1996, the searcher wrote:

> at 05:15 pm 10/2/96 -0400, you wrote:
> >hi friends and neighbors, all.
> >
> >does anyone out there have a copy of emily's solo tape?  i know it exists,
> >although perhaps only at the level of discourse.  i *need* it.  it's
> >either that or phone sex, kids, so please.  help me conserve my much
> >needed funds from the evils of 976 numbers and get me emily's solo tape!
>
> ah ha!
> so i am not the only person who has heard of this tape.  does anyone have
> any info about this beast (i asked this question twice in the past year and
> no one knew a thing about it!!!)
>
> marianne
>
(sorry, i know this is illegal, but....)  me tooo!! (or three, i guess...)
i hafve never heard of this, but would be very interested in a copy...
-mandy


> --
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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 16:20:00 -0700
reply-to:     marianne barlow <mlb1@axe.humboldt.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         marianne barlow <mlb1@axe.humboldt.edu>
subject:      re: amy/emily switch
x-to:         dsrogers@utk.edu
in-reply-to:  <3251bad9.4b7b@utkux.utcc.utk.edu>

>
> can anyone point me in the right direction to find the more obscure ig
> music like blue flood, shades of grey, anything. i would very much
> appreciate it.


i, too would be interested in being pointed in those same directions, so
if the answer is not going to the main list, cc it my way???

thanks,
the lone coyote

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 20:42:13 -0400
reply-to:     andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
subject:      buffy saint marie, ellen, & guessing at the 1st single (some igc)

>just in case anyone who lives up here in the western area is interested, =
>there's going to be an hour long special about buffy saint marie on =
>wednesday at 8:00.  its about her reisitance to naitve american =
>opression through her music...should be interesting.  i'm taping it, so =
>all you eastern folks let me know if you want a copy.

it was on in the east too.  i saw part of it.  and she did "bury my heart"!
but i still think that a & e do it better, even though she wrote it.

also, i'm not sure if anyone brought this up yet b/c i get the digest, but
wasn't it great when ellen said something like, "what if i told you that my
whole life was really a lie?...that i'm really left-handed?"  <g>  she gets
closer to coming out every week...

and on this thread:

>1: which do you think will be the 1st single ?

>2: which do you want to be the 1st single ?

>again agreement with tracy (wow).  it's allright (sp?) is a fave of mine.
>the hate me cuz i'm gay line is just really appropriate for our political
>tme.

i agree w/ both tracy & greg.  i love that line!  everyone cheers after it
on the nyc boot!  i cheered too!

>and i vote this song to be the theme song for ellen degeneres' new
>show, "all i can do to make disney nervous".

and that ties together my ellen content w/ my igc perfectly!  was that
enough igc for y'all?

-andi


          _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
                              andrea lipman
                       e-mail: ablipman@sas.upenn.edu
               homepage: http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~ablipman

                     "it's only life after all."-es
          _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 17:44:26 -0700
reply-to:     gwendigo <gkeyt@paul.spu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         gwendigo <gkeyt@paul.spu.edu>
subject:      re: igc: guessing at the 1st single
x-to:         tracy - czar of failure <clumber@smtp.prostar.com>
in-reply-to:  <2.2.32.19961002182846.0069b5f0@mail.prostar.com>

my votes:
first single will probably be shame on you--good call tracy
but what i want to hear first is get out the map!  (i'm an even amy-em
split).  man whatta great song!  i'm not feeling too deep these days, and
it's sorta a feel-good (like pot)

*************************************************************************
"lighten up, francis."
******gwen keyt******
seattle pacific university
bsn class of 1997
gkeyt@paul.spu.edu
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/notime1/home.htm

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 23:26:01 -0500
reply-to:     m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
subject:      nigc-bible thumping

virginia wolffe wrote.....

>>> please, please...don't judge the bible by the old testament...
the new testament is what to read.
focus on christ and his love and message....read john...or romans...
<<<<<


ok, i can click the "delete" button so many times.  if we, the
subscribers of the indigo girls listserv want to debate all aspects
of e&a's professional lives, we have learned to do so respectfully.
this quote has us treading on thin ice.

i'm not going to debate this thread, but the bible is not an ig
thread and i found the above note to be offensive.  i think that vw's
opinion is best left to some religion list.


melissa

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 18:34:03 -0400
reply-to:     jennings_sharon/furman@furman.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "<sharon jennings>" <jennings_sharon/furman@furman.edu>
subject:      ig fans on camera?
x-to:         abaroo@execpc.com
in-reply-to:  <1.5.4.32.19961002212216.0070e6f0@mail.execpc.com>

> while watching live at the uptown and watershed, i always find myself
> wondering if any fellow listees were lucky enough to make it in either
> video. with all the crowd shots and people waiting in line on watershed, it
> seems kind of probible that someone out there must be among them. so,
> anybody have a story to tell about being caught on camera? i mean, how cool
> would that be to be documented forever as a crazed, devoted fan in one of
> their videos?! just wonderin' :)
>
>
> ~abigail

i made it onto the disney special filmed in london (november 1994).... does that
count?

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 22:19:47 -0400
reply-to:     "elaine m. rigby" <emrigby@naz.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "elaine m. rigby" <emrigby@naz.edu>
subject:      power of two

hi all!

a request from my girlfriend:
        does anyone have an instramental version of pot?
        does anyone have the guitar music (sheet music, i assume) that i
                could get a copy from ya?

if you need more info, or have info for me, please e-mail me privately.
thank you!

ttfn!
elaine r.

ps: if you want to contact her directly her e-mail is:
        satterfl@db.erau.edu    (name is lisa)

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 01:22:52 edt
reply-to:     mary kushman <ugkushma@ecuvm.cis.ecu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mary kushman <ugkushma@ecuvm.cis.ecu.edu>
subject:      everybody's waiting....

let's see...everybody's waiting...for this semester to be over with!!!
my friends and i have just broken a streak of being up for nearly three
days straight working on lab reports.  it sucked, i tell you.

anyway, on to the igc.  does anyone out there own an original copy of
"everybody's waiting (for someone to come home)"?  i am looking for a
studio version.  and what's this thing about emily's solo tape?  that's new
info to me...and of course i'd be interested in a copy if anything comes
up about it....!!!

i am willing to work out a trade for ebwfstch.  e-mail me back and i'll send
you a list of what i have to trade for.

later,
mary the fried-brain (my iq don't get me nowhere if i'm too tired...)

p.s.  anyone out there know if mensa is worth joining?

*****************************************************************
                                          ___
mary elizabeth kushman                   <|||>
"hey!  come see my ultrasonic frogs!"    <|||>
          (coming soon)                   |||       |~
university scholar 1994                   |||      o
bs physics, class of 1998                 |||
east carolina university                 _|||_          ___
greenville, north carolina              / ||| \         | |
bitnet:  ugkushma@ecuvm1                | ||| |        o o
internet:  ugkushma@ecuvm.cis.ecu.edu   / ||| \
           ugkushma@ecuvax.cis.ecu.edu /  |||  \
           mekindigo@ecu.campus.mci.net|  ---  |    |~
the "er"--been there, done that!        \_____/    o

"always tell the truth and be true."  emily saliers
"color me grey, i'm a little bit of everything today..."  amy ray
*****************************************************************

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 03:29:26 -0400
reply-to:     sea8aggie@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "amy l.steinhilber" <sea8aggie@aol.com>
subject:      the vote!!!

in a message dated 96-10-02 18:25:48 edt, you write:

<< i was
just thinking that with winona laduke running for vp and all, they'd
probably support her, even though realistically the choice will probably
boil down to dole vs. clinton. am i making any sense? anyone else have a
clue what i'm trying to say? appologies for the political babbling :)

~abigail >>

hi all.  i read a article in the advocate today by chastity bono.  it made a
good point for those of us that are upset with our straight candidates who
failed us on doma.  the point was that if we choose to take our support away
from our straight politicians that have done many good things for us these
last four years, (what prez candidate would have even mentioned us?) we play
right into the hands of the right-wing republicans that may have had this in
mind when they decided to run doma through.  face it, most gays voted for
clinton/gore in the last election.  i did and i was previously a bush person.
the president, although he has many failings, has supported us despite his
personal beliefs, a concept i insist is the basis for a good president.  one
that does what's best for his constituents (sp?) despite what one's personal
feelings are.  i for one spit at my t.v. the day cnn told me clinton's
comments on how he would sign doma, etc.  but he was right about the
republicans doing it as a political strategy.  if the gays take away their
support from various politicians, then it may balance out with the votes
perot and also the green party will take from the republicans.  would you
rather have bob dole in office (just look at his record with gays and
lesbians) or would you rather have clinton in who recognizes gays and is
attentive many times to their struggle even if he is unprepared to go the
distance for us?  c'mon.

no offense to republicans, and others.  i simply state my opinion in a
coaxing manner and hope to appeal to the hearts of some voters.  if you
already have your mind made up as to another candidate, good for you.  see
you at the voter's booths.  hey everyone, please get out and vote.  it
doesn't cost anything and it's a very good way to take action for what you
want to happen in your world.  rock the vote!

amy

p.s.   as of this posting, the green party, i believe does not in anyway
include gay issues in their platform.  please private email me and correct me
if i'm wrong.

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 02:07:03 -0400
reply-to:     lori levy <llevy03@emory.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         lori levy <llevy03@emory.edu>
subject:      re: nigc: more anti-gay trash (yes, more nigc)
in-reply-to:  <32532dd8.508@mail.airmail.net>

on wed, 2 oct 1996, virginia wolffe wrote:

> different perspective. that is quite reasonable. second, when christ
> came, he "fullfilled" the old law... there was no need to follow it
> anymore and "earn" salvation... now we can just follow him and by grace
> (our sight grows stronger) and we are saved. please, please...don't judge
> the bible by the old testament... the new testament is what to read.
> focus on christ and his love and message....read john...or romans... btw

1) i respect your christianity, and i'm glad you get what you need from
   the new testament (personally, i feel a strong tie to my god without
   feeling any sense of "loyalty" to either of these books or to any
   one particular religious doctrine).

2) i don't want to add to the flame wars, and i am kind of torn about
   whether or not to post this because i personally wouldn't mind seeing
   fewer ig list posts per day... sometimes, less *really is* more.  but
   then again, i also understand that that's what my delete key is for.

but...

i just wanted to point out that you really could deeply offend a *lot* of
jewish people here by your comments...

on a side note, for those people out there who are having a hard time
reconciling "what the bible says about homosexuality" with christianity,
i'd recommend a book called "heterosexism: an ethical challenge" (patricia
beattie jung and ralph f. smith -- two theology professors at wartburg
theological seminary).  the main argument is that it is heterosexism, not
homosexuality, that is the greater sin.  in one chapter, the book deals
with each of the typically quoted passages regarding homosexuality
(sodom and gomorrah; leviticus 18:22 and 20:13; 1 corinthians 6:9-11; 1
timothy 1:8-11; and romans 1:18-32) and puts them in their historical
contexts, forcing some pretty serious reinterpretation and reexamination.
it also provides a very sound case for church (and state) recognition
same-sex unions.  very interesting and very readable, even for a
non-biblical scholar like me.  highly recommended....

lori


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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 06:19:36 ut
reply-to:     camille kearl <sasscambo@msn.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         camille kearl <sasscambo@msn.com>
subject:      little igc surprise finds/info appreciated

okay, so i move from one small town in utah to another--logan to bountiful and
i of course spend my first free minute finding the nearest music store and
picking up shawn colvin's new album.  i do not think that it is her best work
and i had to listen to it a few times today but i am loving it now.  anyway, i
was digging through the used cd's and i found kristen hall's fact and fiction
for $4.00.  i bought it of course and was so excited--you just don't find
daemon artists here in utah all that often and much less used :-)  the shock
continued as i found a k's choice album called 'the great subconscious club',
jane siberry's 'when i was a boy' and michelle malone and drag the river
'relentless'   here is the question--do i need to go get these $4.00 bargains?
i have only heard 2 js songs, only heard mm singing with the ig on occasion,
and have no idea what kind of music k's choice plays other than the music they
provide for the girls on 'rockin in the free world' .  is the mm album
pretty rockin (say me type old rockin) or more mellow?  i know we have some
die hard fans out there so for those of you familiar with these albums i need
some advice.  please respond privately as to not waste others bandwidth.
thanks much,
cami

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date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 23:19:49 -0700
reply-to:     kathy miller <kmiller@accessone.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         kathy miller <kmiller@accessone.com>
organization: van waters & rogers
subject:      re: obscure ig request

marianne barlow wrote:
> >
> > can anyone point me in the right direction to find the more obscure ig
> > music like blue flood, shades of grey, anything. i would very much
> > appreciate it.

in this case, i think a "me too" is appropriate, since i can't think of any
other way to ask for this.  so "me too" - unless somebody wants to do a tape
tree for these recordings, & publish the info publicly? thanks!

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 02:25:10 -0400
reply-to:     sea8aggie@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "amy l.steinhilber" <sea8aggie@aol.com>
subject:      re: indigo-girls digest - 24 sep 1996 to 25 sep 1996 - special
              issue

in a message dated 96-09-25 08:01:36 edt, you write:

<<  i also like ccr, the mamas and the
papas, bob dylan, nitty gritty dirt band, billie holiday, patsy cline,
the eagles, van morrison, and many others. >>


don't forget "pure prairie league!"  eh?  you've never heard of them?  why
they had a classic song that i for one will never forget.  anybody know?
i'll give you a clue...


amy

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 02:25:08 -0400
reply-to:     sea8aggie@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "amy l.steinhilber" <sea8aggie@aol.com>
subject:      late reply on "cover me"

the album should be titled...imho...indigo pallette ...

and i just can't find it in my heart to allow my head to channel anyone else
singing an ig girls song.  i do think melissa etheridge is more suited for
either land of caanan or 123 rather than some of the softer songs.

if i was held at gunpoint though, i might say:

the smithereens - prince of darkness
garth brooks - hammer and a nail
blues traveler - chickenman
annie lennox - strange fire
k.d. lang - make it easier
joni mitchell - kid fears
bonnie raitt - nashville
stevie nicks - history of us
the cranberries - mystery
melissa e. and stevie nicks duet - this train
sophie b. hawkins - language or the kiss


after that, you'd have to just shoot me...

amy

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 02:25:19 -0400
reply-to:     sea8aggie@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "amy l.steinhilber" <sea8aggie@aol.com>
subject:      re: indigo-girls digest - 27 sep 1996 - special issue

in a message dated 96-09-27 13:44:00 edt, you write:

<< i'm interested in finding out what your favorite ig quotes are.  but there
>is one catch--the quote can't be from a song!! >>

my favorite has no real philosophical significance, it's just fun to hear and
mimick; right before galileo on 1200curfews, ".. . . . .there's probably a
cow sittin' out in the middle of a field somewhere.. . . .. lookin' up at the
stars......mooooo."  i laugh or smile everytime!!!

amy

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=========================================================================
date:         wed, 2 oct 1996 23:38:16 -0700
reply-to:     aml@scn.org
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         ann m labeck <aml@scn.org>
subject:      re guessing at the first single/s

shame on you and it's alright have that catchy, uptempo,
melodic stuff that radio stations like, so those two songs seem
like the most logical to release, except....

...are there that many stations that'll play shame on you,
with the >i keep f**king up< line, and it's alright with the
>hate me 'cause i'm gay< line?

i've got a friend who used to work for a record co. and he says
probably not (marketing and all that).

i guess we'll know next spring!

ann

--
what a waste it is to lose one's mind or not to have a mind at
all is being very wasteful.
                        -dan quayle

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 02:54:38 -0400
reply-to:     will laney <wlaney@mindspring.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         will laney <wlaney@mindspring.com>
subject:      overheard in atlanta

someone backstage at the kiss concert tonight in atlanta told me that a and
e were there.  i do not know if it is true, but i found it interesting and
thought i would pass it along!

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 05:47:25 -0400
reply-to:     margotll@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         margot laidacker <margotll@aol.com>
subject:      kid fears

   i am listening to the reverse1 cd, and at the end of kid fears, amy is
saying something, and i was wondering if anyone knows what it is. it sounds
to me like she is saying, "well, kids. we're together. aren't we?" is this
right? if so, i think it just makes the song oh so much more powerful. any
thoughts?

peace and sleep
-- margot

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 04:28:18 -0700
reply-to:     dragonman <djarrell@ix15.ix.netcom.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         dragonman <djarrell@ix15.ix.netcom.com>
subject:      re: igc: guessing at the 1st single

traci wrote:

>        1: which do you think will be the 1st single ?

i think, as do many others, that "shame on you" will be the first single.
the song is so incredibly catchy and fun.  and the politics are important.
the way it has been featured in the shows indicates the desire to showcase
this song.

>        2: which do you want to be the 1st single ?

this is a little tougher.  i have some serious mixed feelings with ig
singles.  i want so much for them to do well and reach a wide audience.  i
want them to have a hit.  but there are some serious drawbacks.  most of
all, popularity leads to larger audiences of less-devoted fans and this
means larger venues and harder-to-get tickets.  i really like the level of
popularity that the girls enjoy, and the fact that they have been able to
achieve platinum sales based on an 'army' of devoted fans.  i love being a
member of that special army.

that being said, i still think that "shame on you" should be the first
single.  i would love to hear it on the radio.  i would love to see the
video on tv.  i think it is a great song that many people will enjoy.  so i
guess that i want it to be the first single.  :-)

of course, it's alright is a great song, too.  and i would love to hear that
one on the radio, too.  :)

>        publically requesting greg and dwayne to join this thread?
> <hopeful friendly peaceful smile  ... how do you do that in ascii?>

was this good enough.  i think this is a good thread, and i look forward to
expanded discussion on this topic.  :)

whatever,

:dwayne

djarrell@ix.netcom.com
"you can spend your time alone redigesting past regrets,
or you can realize you're the only one who can forgive yourself
makes much more sense to live in the present tense" - pearl jam

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 06:33:21 -0700
reply-to:     "kollin s. fencil" <ksfencil@jol.mobil.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "kollin s. fencil" <ksfencil@jol.mobil.com>
organization: mobil oil corporation
subject:      re: igc: guessing at the 1st single
x-to:         tracy - czar of failure <clumber@smtp.prostar.com>

tracy - czar of failure wrote:
>
> subtitled: my attempt at  a thread that won't be able to bring about any
> hurt feelings, tizzies, or even a shred of sparks.
>
>         so, choosing from our certainly incomplete list of new songs.. which
> do y'all expect to see released as the first single?  actually, we could
> probably make this a 2 answer thread and ask:
>         1: which do you think will be the 1st single ?
>                 and
>         2: which do you want to be the 1st single ?
>
>         my imowo (in my often wrong opinion) answer to 1 is "shame on you".
> i base that upon several things, and especially that it was played at
> bumbershoot as part of the encore... a place in concerts *often* reserved
> for the more popular songs a band has.  (i said often, just a personal
> observation, not a rule, and not intending to irk anyone or claim to *know*
> !)  plus, it seems like a good "bouncy" song that also supports the strong
> political beliefs of the ig of late.   then again... i was absolutely
> *shocked* that "touch me fall" was the 1st single from swamp.  so what do i
> know?
>         for #2 my imowo answer is "it's alright"... i just love it.  soy is
> probably my favorite of the new songs as yet... but i would still love to
> see ia be the first single... color me a diehard amy person... but easily in
> touch with my emily side.  :-)
>
>         publically requesting greg and dwayne to join this thread?
>  <hopeful friendly peaceful smile  ... how do you do that in ascii?>
>
> tracy <definitely a loser dork idiot, but hoping not to come across as
> self-righteous this time?>
>
> ps is it not hysterically funny that my spellcheck actually recognizes
> "tizzies" as a word!! lol!
>
> "i never lie.
>         oh, that wasn't the truth..."
>                 -- danielle howle, 28 august 1996
> tracy or anyone else for that matter,

do you know where i can get a copy of whatever songs from the new album
are floating around?  it would be greatly appreciated as i was excited to
here of the upcoming album a preview would be great!

thanks

peace,  kollin

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 07:43:41 edt
reply-to:     oh susanna <oh.susanna@dartmouth.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "susan b. marine" <susan.b.marine@dartmouth.edu>
subject:      kisssss!!!!!!

--- you wrote:

someone backstage at the kiss concert tonight in atlanta told me that a and
e were there.  i do not know if it is true, but i found it interesting and
thought i would pass it along!
--- end of quoted material ---
yessssssssss!!!!! kiss fans. that seals it. i must have emily and or amy's
baby. i kneel at the kiss altar...i am a member of the kiss army (a card
carrying member i must say) and i would give a million bucks to hear em and amy
join gene on "rock and roll all night" or "beth" (can't ya hear amy singing it
y'all?)

gotta go put on double platinum right now.......

susie headbanger

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 04:46:27 -0700
reply-to:     dragonman <djarrell@ix13.ix.netcom.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         dragonman <djarrell@ix13.ix.netcom.com>
subject:      fcc issues

>...are there that many stations that'll play shame on you,
>with the >i keep f**king up< line, and it's alright with the
>>hate me 'cause i'm gay< line?

i don't think this is a problem because:

a. stations are getting more lenient about what they will play.  the
alternative station here in milwaukee will sometimes play songs with the "f"
word in them.  in fact, they have played live's "waitress", which repeats
the word quite blatently.

b. alternative versions are generally recorded with the offending words
removed.  alanis morissette certainly got a lot of air play with "you
oughtta know", which had references to oral sex in it.

:dwayne

djarrell@ix.netcom.com
"you can spend your time alone redigesting past regrets,
or you can realize you're the only one who can forgive yourself
makes much more sense to live in the present tense" - pearl jam

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 04:52:21 -0700
reply-to:     dragonman <djarrell@ix4.ix.netcom.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         dragonman <djarrell@ix4.ix.netcom.com>
subject:      saw ig on tv this morning!

well, sort of.  i saw the new ad for georgia on cnn.  they highlight their
'paper' (the paper industry), 'scissors' (a soccer player from the
olympics), and 'rock'.  for the last one, the show someone performing who i
coudln't recognize at the time and the names of the cool georgian artists
came on the screen - r.e.m., otis redding (?), and indigo girls!   :-)
(there were others but i missed 'em.)

i thought that was pretty damn cool.  and the ad made me think of a
question.  elton john sings the little georgia theme song for the
commercial, and the mention of ig with him singing made me wonder if he has
ever heard them do "mona lisas and mad hatters".  i often wonder what
artists think of the ig versions of their songs (esp. mark knopfler's
opinion of r&j).  does anyone know if any artists have commented on their ig
covers?

:dwayne

djarrell@ix.netcom.com
"you can spend your time alone redigesting past regrets,
or you can realize you're the only one who can forgive yourself
makes much more sense to live in the present tense" - pearl jam

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 07:26:10 -0500
reply-to:     carolyn <underdog@onramp.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         carolyn <underdog@onramp.net>
subject:      looking for w guthrie tribute tape

sorry to waste the bandwidth, but a couple of days ago someone posted about
having a tape from the show.  if you get this can you please email me privately?

thanks

carolyn

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 08:39:29 -0400
reply-to:     michael reynolds <asl@umcs.maine.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         michael reynolds <asl@umcs.maine.edu>
subject:      re: saw ig on tv this morning!
x-to:         djarrell@ix4.ix.netcom.com
in-reply-to:  <199610031152.eaa01158@dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com> from "dragonman" at
              oct 3, 96 04:52:21 am

i asked this question once too. i heard elton amy and emily sang it at a
atlanta pride like 1992 or earier, and i never heard a tape even tho someone
thought they had it...
yup, i want it if someone has it
mike r.

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 08:29:11 -0400
reply-to:     doug dickson <ddickson@crl.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         doug dickson <ddickson@crl.com>
subject:      world cafe setlist

hi there!
yes, the girls will be on the radio.  a little searching on the net and
look what i found!
     -----------
the indigo girls pay a return visit to the cafe studios for a special
preview performance of some of their new music...plus host david dye
spins songs from jackson browne, joan osborne, sting and more
on the next world cafe!

re:  world cafe dacs for friday october 4 feed @ 02:00
        for broadcast friday october 4, 1996

=====================================================================
00:00   1:00  open hour 1
=====================================================================
01:00   5:00  option song

                cynical girl               marshall crenshaw
                the in crowd               ramsey lewis trio
============================================================
06:00   reintro show

                sunny came home            shawn colvin
                i feel so good             richard thompson
                gone daddy gone            violent femmes
                the devil's radio          robyn hitchcock

                ***daily demo***

outcue  when we return to the world cafe
============================================================
21:16   a zipper                          :30
============================================================
21:46   i guess i know i'm right   the v-roys
                driver 8                   rem
                new test leper             rem
                every little bit           patty griffin
                fountain of sorrow         jackson browne
outcue  when we return to the world cafe
============================================================
45:54   a zipper                          :30
============================================================
46:24   land of canaan             indigo girls
                everything falls apart     dog's eye view
                lovefool                   the cardigans

                ***elliotts underwrite***

                        outq: "... public radio international"
======================================================================
59:00           1:00  local breakaway
======================================================================


=====================================================================
00:00           1:00  open hour 2
=====================================================================
01:00   5:00  option song

                right hand man             joan osborne
============================================================
06:00   reintro show

                barely breathing           duncan sheik
                the sensual world          kate bush
outcue  when we return to the world cafe
============================================================
14:46   a zipper                          :30
============================================================
15:16   indigo girls live

                talk/in
                "get out the map"
                talk
                "blood quantum"
                talk
                "don't give that girl a gun"
                talk/out:       ..."the world cafe"...
============================================================
34:21   a zipper                          :30
============================================================
34:51   wise users                 bruce cockburn
                paris in a day             ellis paul
                englishman in new york     sting
                carnival                   natalie merchant
                        outq: music vamp/"public radio international"
======================================================================
58:30   :30 promo
======================================================================

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\     doug dickson       ddickson@crl.com    atlanta, ga \
  \    keeper of the kudzu web page  \  state parks online \
   \   http://www.crl.com/~ddickson                         \

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 10:04:27 -0400
reply-to:     "keates, harry" <hak@crai.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "keates, harry" <hak@crai.com>
organization: charles river associates
subject:      singles at the crossroads.  hey, me too!
in-reply-to:  <8f847137011c0e00>

binky said:
>i must say that i showed great restraint and resisted re-posting the
>entire messages regarding 'me too' and stuff (including headers !! :)
>and adding "me too !"....but i figured that some folks might not find
>that as hilarious as i did...but i actually broke out into a smile at
the
>thought (heh, heh)

me too!   : )    i would have lol, but since you didn't post it, i fis
(frowned in silence).

ok, on to other things,

>...are there that many stations that'll play shame on you,
>with the >i keep f**king up< line, and it's alright with the
>>hate me 'cause i'm gay< line?

i think this is true for shame on you.  does anyone think they would
release a "radio-friendly" version of the song?  i hope not.  i do think
radio stations would play it's alright, and if they did it might start
some controversy, which would be a good thing (i think).  however, i
don't really think the song sounds like a single. i didn't think touch me
fall did either, though, so what do i know.

of the new songs, i am equally enamored with shame on you, it's alright,
and get out the map.  i love all three.  but considering the above, i
think get out the map will be the first single.  it's catchy, its
friendly,  radio stations would love it.  then, when people go out and
buy the album, they can get hit with it's alright,  shame on you, and
chiappas bound.

one more thing,  vh-1 has released a cd called crossroads that has live
or special studio performances from their crossroads and duets programs.
the disc includes me and joan osborne singing "bring me some water" which
if you like me at all, you'll probably love, and tori amos singing "i'm
on fire" which, while its not amy singing backstreets, is pretty great.
for me those two songs made it worthwhile, but the rest is pretty decent
too.  it has kd lang, jewel, edwin mccain (with darius r) and a bunch of
pop songs from last year like name, roll with me (i think that's what its
called), and my favorite, breakfast at tiffany's (really, i have no idea
why, but i love that song).

  harry a. keates
  email: hak@crai.com

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 07:30:14 -0700
reply-to:     betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         betsy bertiaux <bbertiaux@spectrumctls.com>
subject:      re: igc: guessing at the 1st single

i would like to see this happen, but what about the lyrics?  they don't
seem to be very pc or fcc-friendly (hoping i'm thinking of the right song).
don't get me wrong - i love this song.   i, personally, have an affinity
for give that girl a gun, but then i can't see that being a single at all,
as is true with most the songs i really like..... oh well

betsy


>my votes:
>first single will probably be shame on you--good call tracy
>but what i want to hear first is get out the map!  (i'm an even amy-em
>split).  man whatta great song!  i'm not feeling too deep these days, and
>it's sorta a feel-good (like pot)

-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
..you see turning off the light switch is their only power
      when we stand like spotlights in a mighty tower
                       all for one and one for all
                    then we sing the common call.....
                                                             e. saliers
_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 10:14:53 edt
reply-to:     tamara mizell <103660.214@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         tamara mizell <103660.214@compuserve.com>
subject:      re: world cafe setlist

where does world cafe air??  is it national or local?

if someone could fill me in, i'd greatly appreciate it.  i don't *think* i get
this show where i'm at, but that could just be because i've never looked for it
before.

thanks,
tamara

p.s.  happy day to everyone!

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 10:33:37 est
reply-to:     "paul j. sgroi" <paul_j._sgroi@ccmail.c-tec.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "paul j. sgroi" <paul_j._sgroi@ccmail.c-tec.com>
subject:      i dreamed i met a galilean...

     i've noticed some posts about the jesus christ superstar(a resurrection)
     on this list, recently--and i wanted to share my feelings on the album.
     i think it's great! when i was younger, i used to act-out different
     roles, in my room: sometimes, i'd just grab my telecaster, and pretend
     i was a musician in the pit, sometimes i'd be judas, sometimes jesus,
     sometimes even ciaphas, never pilot.

     anyway: this album is excellent, amy's gethsemene is fantastic, and
     passionate, as someone on the list mentioned(definitely my favorite)
     i also like her poor jerusalem, and one that really stands out for
     me is heaven on their minds, i can't remember the singer's name at the
     moment, i love the acoustic parts!

     i think this soundtrack should be re-made every year by different
     groups of various artists. here's a dramatic personae, that i'd like:

     jesus:  jon bon jovi(what a voice!)
     simon the zealot: prince(or whatever he's calling himself)
     pilot: peter gabriel
     mary magdaline: melissa etheridge(did i ever mention, i love her!)
     ciaphas: the lead-singer of red hot chili peppers,
     annas: neil young(in a hi-pitch mood!)
     peter: tommy shaw(styx)
     herod: ozzy osbourn(hey, it's my dream!)
     judas: this one's tough, i'm going to go with: lenny kravitz!

     other cast, such as apostles & crowds(need great harmonists):
                        emily,amy,graham nash,jackson browne,shawn colvin,
                        paul simon,david crosby,joni mitchell,joan baez,
                        everyone from the eagles,steve perry,steve walsh,
                        daryl hall,john oates,todd rundgren, you get the idea!

     guest musicians for the soundtrack:

                        electric guitars:  jimmy page, joe satriani,
                                                peter frampton(he's always
                                                doing sountracks), eddie
                                                van halen, brian setzer
                                                from stray cats(his style
                                                would be perfect for the
                                                herod song!)
                        acoustic guitars:  pete townsend, stephen stills,
                                                 richie havens
                        keyboards:         mark mothersbough(devo: he's
                                                always doing soundtracks),
                                                john paul jones(zeppelin),
                                                dennis deyoung(sytx)
                        piano:             johnnie fingers(boomtown rats),
                                                elton john.
                        drums:             sheila e.(one of the best!),
                                                and i can't remember his
                                                name, the great percussionist
                                                from grateful dead.

like i said, hey, it's my dream!!!!

                                                ...paul

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 10:19:04 -0600
reply-to:     deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>
subject:      re: world cafe setlist

>where does world cafe air??  is it national or local?
>
>if someone could fill me in, i'd greatly appreciate it.  i don't *think* i get
>this show where i'm at, but that could just be because i've never looked for it
>before.

for those of you who need to know if the show plays in your area, you can
go to the world cafe web site and do a search of the markets.

the show is also simulcast on the internet via real audio from station
klsu-fm in baton rouge. a link to that info is also available at the site.

for complete details go to:

http://pobox.upenn.edu/~worldcaf/


deb

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 09:11:05 -0700
reply-to:     candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net>
subject:      world cafe

can anyone tell me when the wc broadcast will be taking place over here =
on the west coast?  i'm all set up to listen to it on the net & i =
visited the homepage, but all they give you is the date, not the time, =
so i'm at a loss as to when to tune in...clues to the clueless would be =
much appreciated.

...wheels in motion...
greta

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 11:15:38 -0700
reply-to:     pat chaney <pooh40@mc.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         pat chaney <pooh40@mc.net>
subject:      world cafe

olease please please..someone with more technical knowledge than
i..please record this!!!!!!!!!!( so those of us who can't figure it out
can enjoy the show) please!!!

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 09:34:49 -0700
reply-to:     "karen a. vittek" <kvittek@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "karen a. vittek" <kvittek@gladstone.uoregon.edu>
subject:      back from the summer with a request

hi everyone!  hope you all had good summers.

i'm looking for some boots as usual...i have a feeling everyone else on
the planet is looking for them too, so if there's a tape tree i can latch
onto, feel free to tell me about it!  here's what i'm looking for:

newport 96
bumbershoot
the 8/12/96 new hampshire concert

i have around 100 boots here in oregon with me, so trades usually aren't
a problem (artists vary from indigo girls, melissa etheridge, dar
williams, kristen hall, etc.), but i don't have them catalogued yet this
year...bear with me!  and i can also do blanks and sase without difficulty.
  so if someone could just let me know whom i need to talk to, that would
be great.  thanks!

and before i get a lot of random trading requests, let me just ask that
you hold off for a while, i need to get organized before my mailbox gets
flooded.  without a trading list, things get a bit hairy trying to set up
trades with this many boots!  so i promise i'll be willing to randomly
trade later, but for now i'm just interested in those three concerts. =)

oh, and is jude hunter still around?  i think i owe her some
trades...drop me a line if you're here, jude!

that's all folks

s'later
k

___________________________________________________________________
"there's a crowd of people harbored in every person
there are so many roles that we play"  -ad-

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 12:24:24 edt
reply-to:     tamara mizell <103660.214@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         tamara mizell <103660.214@compuserve.com>
subject:      nigc:  d.c.& baltimore area info.

hi folks!

i am possibly going to be visiting the washington d.c. and baltimore areas in
mid-december.  i was wondering if anyone from those areas could give me possible
info on reasonably priced places to stay, places not to stay, places to visit,
and other things of this nature.  i am on a college student budget, so i'm
trying to find decent hotels, hostels, whatever to stay in, in order to cut
expense.

this will be around dec. 14 (and for about four/five days afterwards).  also, is
the weather a nightmare up there during the christmas season?!?

any help would be grately appreciated!

thanks,
tamara

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 13:16:50 -0400
reply-to:     deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
subject:      world cafe broadcast, can someone tape this ?

hello all in indigo land!

i will be unable to tape/listen to the world cafe show because i will
be at work.  can some kind sould please tape it for me and we can
work out a trade?  if anyone can do this, please email me.  thanks a lot!

take care and peace!

-deb

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 14:03:55 -0400
reply-to:     andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
subject:      ig on world cafe

i went to the world cafe webpage & it turns out that their office is right
down the street from me!  their page is a upenn.edu page too!  anyway, i'm
confused about when ig is on.  it looked like 6:30 pm tomorrow, but i could
be wrong.  if anyone has more definite details about when it will be on in
philly, let me know, b/c then i can tape it.  otherwise, i could just call
world cafe...

andi

          _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
                              andrea lipman
                       e-mail: ablipman@sas.upenn.edu
               homepage: http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~ablipman

                     "it's only life after all."-es
          _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 14:05:27 -0400
reply-to:     kmitchel@cs.utk.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "kevin j. mitchell" <kmitchel@cs.utk.edu>
subject:      world cafe question

  i read the line-up for world cafe oct 4th that was
posted to the list, but i am not really sure what time
the indigo girls will be on.  i had trouble reading that
setlist.  is this a live show?
i just want to know what time to start listening, if
i do get it in my area.

thanks
kevin mitchell
kmitchel@cs.utk.edu

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 13:21:35 est
reply-to:     "paul j. sgroi" <paul_j._sgroi@ccmail.c-tec.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "paul j. sgroi" <paul_j._sgroi@ccmail.c-tec.com>
subject:      nigc: melissa etheridge?

     okay, i was just doing some web-browsing(i don't get to do that
                very often) for melissa etheridge, and could not find-out
                how to get on her list, can anyone out there tell me????

                                                        ...paul

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 12:19:12 -0400
reply-to:     mariavee@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mariavee@aol.com
subject:      singles

>1: which do you think will be the 1st single ?
>        2: which do you want to be the 1st single ?

imho, #1 = "get out the map" (most catchy and least controverial -- hey, they
need to sell records...)

#2 = "shame on you" or "it's allright" (how about both released
simultaneously???)

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 14:28:02 edt
reply-to:     s sa hawn e daly <paa4687@dpschp11.dpsc.dla.mil>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         s sa hawn e daly <paa4687@dpschp11.dpsc.dla.mil>
subject:      re: world cafe question
x-to:         kmitchel@cs.utk.edu
in-reply-to:  <199610031805.oaa02898@cetus6a.cs.utk.edu>; from "kevin j.
              mitchell" at oct 3, 96 2:05 pm

      the world cafe is on in philly from 2-4 with the guests showing up
  in the 3'o clock hour.

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 13:32:18 -0400
reply-to:     deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
subject:      world cafe again....

hello all again!

well, i went to the world cafe website and to my dismay they do not
list any stations in mass or conn that will broadcast the show.  now
i am definately out of luck when it comes to hearing the show without
the aid of a fellow ig fan who would be willing to tape it and share
it.  let me know if someone can tape it for me.  i'm sure there are
other people out there who will be unable to get it too, so i am willing
to help run a tree, or make copies for all us unfortuantes who will miss
the 'live' broadcast and have to rely on a tape of it.  thanks all!

take care and peace!

-deb

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 14:58:48 edt
reply-to:     "joan m. cyr" <jcyr@mit.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "joan m. cyr" <jcyr@mit.edu>
subject:      re: nigc: melissa etheridge?
x-to:         "paul j. sgroi" <paul_j._sgroi@ccmail.c-tec.com>

>     okay, i was just doing some web-browsing(i don't get to do that
>                very often) for melissa etheridge, and could not find-out
>                how to get on her list, can anyone out there tell me????
>
>                                                        ...paul
>
hello paul (and all!)!  i'm new at this so bear with me!

i have info on melissa etheridge.  check out the best web page i've ever
seen.  it's not interactive like this list, but is more on the
informational side.  it's diligently kept up to date (i just looked at it
and it was last updated today 10/3).  it has detailed me info, merchandise,
concert ticket availability/sales for fan club members, etc.  the address
is:

http://www.fanasylum.com/melissa/

don't forget - melissa will be on rosie o'donnell's show 10/14...found that
out three weeks ago on her web page...

have fun surfing!


joni  :>}

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 15:01:56 edt
reply-to:     mary kushman <ugkushma@ecuvm.cis.ecu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mary kushman <ugkushma@ecuvm.cis.ecu.edu>
subject:      trade for world cafe?

hey y'all--

would anyone be willing to trade with me for a copy of this show?  i won't
be able to catch it.  e- mail me; i'll send you my list.

thanks y'all,
mary  (who is happy her organic lab has been pushed back an hour)

*****************************************************************
                                          ___
mary elizabeth kushman                   <|||>
"hey!  come see my ultrasonic frogs!"    <|||>
          (coming soon)                   |||       |~
university scholar 1994                   |||      o
bs physics, class of 1998                 |||
east carolina university                 _|||_          ___
greenville, north carolina              / ||| \         | |
bitnet:  ugkushma@ecuvm1                | ||| |        o o
internet:  ugkushma@ecuvm.cis.ecu.edu   / ||| \
           ugkushma@ecuvax.cis.ecu.edu /  |||  \
           mekindigo@ecu.campus.mci.net|  ---  |    |~
the "er"--been there, done that!        \_____/    o

"always tell the truth and be true."  emily saliers
"color me grey, i'm a little bit of everything today..."  amy ray
*****************************************************************

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 16:23:23 -0400
reply-to:     motor625@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         motor625@aol.com
subject:      re : 'goosebump' moments

you know what gives me goosebumps?  chiapas bound.  the whole thing.  lots of
ig stuff does but lately it's been that.  i needed to evoke this weird
emotion the other day for drama...working on stuff that is a huge challenge
for me right now and i was having trouble.  i knew that the right emotion was
the goosebump thing that chiapas gives me...and whoo hoo, it appeared to
work!  i love that song...
and to throw in even more igc :)...i have a question...as usual :)...the song
"caramia" that em was playing earlier.  that didn't get performed on the demo
tour?  is it new or am i missing something?  do you think it'd be on the new
album?  i love this song and i just don't know (but i do wanna know!!! :)
and in happier news...i announced to another drama class, by way of
introduction, that my name was katy and for my birthday i most wanted an
indigo girl...and someone just called and said he was working on it :)
(grin...grin...laugh...)  well, he's got nine months or so...:)
have lovely days, y'all
katy

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 16:14:18 -0400
reply-to:     margotll@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         margot laidacker <margotll@aol.com>
subject:      re: igc: guessing at the 1st single

i think that get out the map will be the first single, and i'm glad, because
that song and shame on you are two of my favorite ig songs ever.

--margot

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 15:49:01 -0500
reply-to:     owner-urgent-action@m2.monsterbit.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         owner-urgent-action@m2.monsterbit.com

end
sender: owner-urgent-action
precedence: bulk

indigenous environmental network relay message - fyi and good news!
ien and many other native and non-native groups and individuals
supported the letter writing and call-in campaign to stop this bill
that would have allowed the transportation and dumping of nuclear
waste at yucca mountain, located within the western shoshone
territories.  the western shoshone national council has always
opposed the location of a nuclear dump within their lands.


------- forwarded message follows -------
from:          "michael mariotte" <nirsnet@igc.apc.org>
organization:  nirs
to:            nirs alert list@igc.org
date:          fri, 27 sep 1996 16:35:31 +0000
subject:       celebrate victory on mobile chernobyl!
reply-to:      nirsnet@igc.apc.org
priority:      normal

yes! it's official! it's dead! the mobile chernobyl act is history!

thanks for all your hard work and help, and give yourselves a hearty
congratulations.

enclosed is a press release nirs is sending out today. please feel to
use it yourselves, or to modify it for release in your areas.
but it is important for the media to understand that grassroots
activists across the country, working with two small state senators
(bryan and reid of nevada) and a president determined to veto a bad
bill, were able to defeat the nuclear power industry in what has been
dubbed "the most anti-environmental congress ever."

two years ago, few believed we could pull this off. but we did--and
it's thanks to you.

michael


-------------- enclosure number 1 ----------------
news from nirs
nuclear information and resource service
1424 16th street nw, #404, washington dc 20036; 202-328-0002;
fax: 202-462-2183
e-mail: nirsnet@igc.apc.org  web: www.nirs.org

for immediate release

september 27, 1996
dc contact: mary olson  202-328-0002
local contact: enter your group here

mobile chernobyl bill dead in its tracks;

reason, caution and clinton veto threat prevail

today, citizen's groups nationwide declared the "mobile
chernobyl act" bill dead in its tracks. the nuclear waste policy
act amendments (hr 1020, upton, r-mich.; s 1271, craig, r-id.; s
1936, murkowski, r-ak) would have turned u.s. nuclear waste
policy upside down, mandating the shipment of highly radioactive
waste across 43 states to a parking-lot type "interim" storage
facility in nevada. the bills would have exempted the project
from federal and state environmental laws and regulations, and
would have mandated a radiation standard equivalent to a 1 in
286 lifetime fatal cancer rate.

s. 1936 passed the senate july 31, but did not garner enough
support to be able to override a promised presidential veto.
house speaker newt gingrich decided not to bring up the
contested bill, following pleas by nevada republican
congressional candidates and after president clinton again
affirmed his veto promise. citizens in nevada and the state
itself are overwhelmingly opposed to both proposed "interim" and
permanent nuclear dumps at yucca mountain. grassroots citizen's
groups across the country have worked the past two years to
prevent the nuclear industry legislation from being enacted.

said nirs executive director, michael mariotte, "more than 50
million americans live within a half mile of likely nuclear
waste shipping routes. a worst case scenario of a transport
accident involves a head-on collision and a high-temperature
fire--much the same scenario of a train accident near washington
dc last winter. a damaged cask consumed by fire could release
millions of curies of lethal radiation--the same type of
material, including plutonium, strontium, cesium and so forth,
released at chernobyl.  that is why we called this bill--and
this concept--the 'mobile chernobyl act.'"

opposition to the legislation has been widespread. cities and
counties from los angeles to upstate new york to western north
carolina have passed resolutions opposing the legislation,
primarily on the basis of their concern about nuclear waste
shipments through their area. transportation hubs such as st.
louis, denver and philadelphia all went on record in opposition
to this plan.

said nirs' campaigner mary olson: "we appreciate the clinton
administration's principled opposition to this legislation. they
very early realized that exempting high-level nuclear waste from
environmental laws and regulations and then transferring
liability for the waste it to the taxpayers, without an
acceptable permanent storage site is neither fiscally nor
morally responsible. president clinton's commitment to veto the
legislation, along with citizen opposition in every state,
stopped this nuclear utility "dream bill" from seeing the light
of day."

the nuclear utilities and their trade associations spent tens of
millions of dollars in advertising, lobbying costs and pac
contributions in their bid to start moving high-level nuclear
waste off their sites immediately, even while they continue to
generate more waste. more than 150 environmental organizations
worked to stop this legislation, calling instead for an
independent review of radioactive waste policies, including
military, civilian, high and "low-level" radioactive waste,
before there are any further legislative initiatives.

-30-

-------------- enclosure number 1 ----------------
* this message contains the file 'winpr.txt', which has been
* uuencoded. if you are using pegasus mail, then you can use
* the browser's extract function to lift the original contents
* out to a file, otherwise you will have to extract the message
* and uudecode it manually.

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 15:56:30 -0500
reply-to:     owner-urgent-action@m2.monsterbit.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         owner-urgent-action@m2.monsterbit.com

end
sender: owner-urgent-action
precedence: bulk


this is a story i  sent in last night to my editor.  i write for  the
nightlife  a  local  entertainment  paper. it should go in  this week
for  more info check out our  web page.  http://www.
midwest.net/nightlife/nightlife.     good luck.    and you  may  reuse
this  story  all you  want. i hope it  helps.

      wa-do

ani   yunwiya

   gwy
_________________________________________________________________

              unplug  america  oct  13
                      - by  ani  yunwiya -


                                                on  october  13th,  a
number  of  national  native  american  organizations, tribes,  native
businesses  and  other  indian  environmental  activists  are  calling
on  all  of  america  to  unplug !
                     the  "unplug  america - give  mother  earth  a  rest
day"  campaign  was  first  introduced  in  1992  by   native
americans,  to  invite  all  people,  to  show  love  and  respect  for
our  mother  earth.   because  the  united  states  is  currently  the
largest  energy  market  in  the  world.
                        " the  u.s.  seems  addicted  to  electricity.
we  love  to  plug  in  to  anything  we  can  find.  the  internet,  the
blow  dryer,  the  microwave,  the  stereo,  and  any  thing  eles  we
can  electrify.  it  is  about  the  masconsumption  going  on  in  our
homes,  business,  and  communities." timexx  rainwalker  a   tribal
council  member  for  the  northern  cherokee  nation  went  onto  say
"on  october  13  we  ask  america  to  take  the  day  and  enjoy  our
mother.  just  turn  off  the  t.v.  and  radios,  shut  off  the  c.d.
and  the  p.c.  and  go  out  side  and  walk.  go  visit  a  state
park.  or  walk  through  the  woods.  it's  only  one  day  but  it's
the  first  step  to  help  restore  our  land  and  our  resources  try
to  unplug  just  for  the  day  and  live  simply."
                                                              and  unplug
america  day  this  year  just  happens  to  fall  on  a  sunday  which
will  make  it  a lot  easier  to  take  part.
                                                                   one
native  group  says  that  on  october  13  a  coyote  brought  a
message  to  take  to  the  people.  and  so  coyote's  journey  began.
coming  to  the  road  he  saw  cars  speeding  by  with  loud  music
blaring,  his  fur  became  sooty  and  his  eyes  burned.  but  no  one
saw  him.  and  no  one  heard  him.                         so  coyote
went  to  the  homes  of  the  people.and  he  saw  that  the  whole
family  was  glued  to  the  television  set.  and  no  one  saw  him.
no  one  heard  him.  coyote  thought,  "where  do  the  people  gather?"
he  then  came  to  a  place  called  a  mall,  and  he  saw  the  young
people  at  the  video  arcade.  but  still  no one  saw  him  and
still  no  one  heard  him.  frustrated,  coyote  wondered  "  who  makes
the  decisions?"  so  he  went  to  all  the  state  capitols  and  even
to  the  white  house.  he  went  to  all  the  politicians  but  they
were  all  "on  line"  and  only  puppets  anyway.
                                                     so  he  went  to
the  corporations,  but,  coyote  had  no  money  and  was  told  his
message  was  not  "profitable,"  they  asked  if  he'd  like  to  make
some  money  and  take  nuclear  and  toxic  waste.  coyote  shook  his
head  no.               thunderbird  had  been  watching  coyote's
journey  and  became  concerned.  and  thunderbird  took  pity  and
hurled  lighting  bolts  at  the  things  that  ran  the  t.v.s  and
video  arcades,  to  restore  the  balance  and  remind  the  people
what  is  real  energy~what  is  real  power.  coyote  was  happy !  now
the  people  could  see  coyote,  now  the  people  could  hear  coyote.
                                                                   on
october  13  the  native  american  community  ask  that  you  unplug
america.  educate  your  family,  schools  and  your  community  about
environmental  health,  energy  and  cultural  issues.  use  as  little
electricity  as  possible,  and  think  about  what  you  consume.  we
need  to  take  action  and  save  our  resources.  our  peoples  depend
on  it  today  and  for  the  generations  to  come.

                                for  more  information,  contact:  tom
goldtooth,  c/o  indigenous  environmental  network,  p.o.  box  485,
bemidji,  mn  56601  e-mail ;  ien @  igc.apc.org.  or  nilak  butler
c/o  greenpeace  568  howard,  3rd  floor,  san  francisco,  ca  94105.
you  can  also  contact   the  northern  cherokee  nation,  210
independence  cape  girardeau  mo,  63701.   or  send  e-mail  to
pitter@juno.com.   or  call  (573)  334-4485.  and  ask  for  info  on
unplug  america  day

                                                                      gwy


________________________________________________________________


--------- end forwarded message ----------

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 15:58:38 -0500
reply-to:     owner-urgent-action@m2.monsterbit.com
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/* written  7:49 pm  sep 26, 1996 by web:eroots in igc:nfn.tempforest */
/* ---------- "save owain lake forest-help us now!" ---------- */
     owain lake ancient pine
          forest need you!!

this is an urgent call for activists to come to the aid of the third
largest remaining ancient pine ecosystem in north america.  the
owain lake ancient forest ecosystem, located in the temagami
district of northern ontario, is currently under siege by the
logging company goulard lumber.  only 1% of ancient red and white
pine ecosystems remain in north america, and one half of these are
located in the temagami district.

earthroots, an ontario based environmental action group, initiated
an ongoing action camp on august 30th in the area to stop the
destruction of this rare and irreplaceable ecosystem.  we need
support!!!  we need committed (and if possible, experienced)
activists to make their stand to save this endangered ecosystem!!
to date (as of september 25), 40 activists have been arrested in
defence of these ancient stands.  we need you to add your voice
(and your body) to the many that are demanding the preservation of
owain lake and the remaining ancient pine forests in temagami.

what you will need:
-camping gear (be ready for cold weather at night, and bring rain
gear)
-all needed registration and licenses for your vehicle (police are
checking)
-enthusiasm, new ideas and a willingness to defend this place
-donations of food, camping gear (in particular cold weather gear),
climbing gear and other action tools would be welcomed!!

what we will provide to you:
-food (we have a functioning kitchen to feed all working
participants)
-legal support
-our unending gratitude

what to expect:
-police presence-ontario provincial police are out in full force-
checkpoints are present along the rabbit lake road (the access road
to owain lake)-only the driver of the vehicle has to provide their
id-all others can decline, and vehicular searches should be declined
-a group of committed activists engaging in direct action skirmishes
to stop this destruction waiting to welcome you

other camp info:
-the camp is alcohol and illicit drug free
-please, if at all possible, leave your pets at home
-come ready to work-this is not a party zone

how to get here:
-from south or east of ontario-once you are in southern ontario,
head north on highway 400 to highway 11-follow highway 11 north to
north bay, and continue on hwy 11, 75 kilometres (roughly 40 miles)
north, to rabbit lake road (on your right, just after gramp's place
gas bar and store)-it's another 25 kilometres (roughly 14 miles) in
to the base camp

-from the northwest-follow highway 11/17, and stay on highway 11
when highways 11 and 17 split, all the way to gramp's and the rabbit
lake road as above

-from all other points, call us for specific directions

for more information:

call earthroots at (416)599-0152 to get more
detailed travel information or updates on the camp
situation, and visit our web site at
eroots@web.apc.org.  our e-mail address is
eroots@web.net.


if for some reason you cannot come to the earthroots forest action
camp in the owain lake forest, you can still help us defend this rare
ecosystem.

1.  mail or fax letters to:

premier mike harris      hon. chris hodgson
legislature building          minister of natural resources
queen's park             6th floor, whitney block
toronto, ontario              99 wellesley st. west
m7a 1w3                  toronto, ontario
                         m7a 1w3

fax:  (416)325-3745      fax:  (416)314-2216

     save owain lake
     ancient forest!!

     save the owain lake
          ancient forest!!

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 16:05:50 -0500
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authors of biotech proposal to resolve ward valley impasse call on senator
feinstein to respond; senator feinstein urged to work with senator murkowski

san jose, calif.--(business wire)--sept. 26, 1996--three california
biotechnology industry leaders who authored a compromise to resolve
the federal-state impasse over the ward valley disposal facility today
urged u.s. senator dianne feinstein to work constructively with
senator murkowski (r-ak) to convert the proposal to legislation.

in a september 19 letter, senator frank murkowski endorsed the
so-called 'biotech compromise' and sought feinstein's cooperation in
implementing it before congress adjourns. congressman brian bilbray
(r-imperial beach), whose district includes a large concentration of
biotech firms, has also endorsed the proposal along with the national
association of cancer patients.

'california's biotechnology community is looking to senator feinstein
to contribute her considerable skills to help craft a responsible
statutory solution to the ward valley impasse,' democratic biomedical
caucus chair tina berger nova, ph.d., explained. 'it is critical to
our industry that this window of opportunity is not lost,' dr. nova
added.

the biotech proposal calls for timely resolution of remaining issues
by the u.s. nuclear regulatory commission no later than march 1997.
'we believe senator feinstein understands the interior department is
unqualified to pursue these issues, and hope she will find time to
place ward valley's outcome in the hands of the scientists who have
the expertise,' biocom/san diego environmental committee chair mary
walker commented. 'as a former deputy solicitor, i can personally
assure the senator that the interior department is not up to this
task,' walker added.

access to a disposal site is vital infrastructure for the continued
growth of california's biotechnology industry, which is effectively
forced to store the bulk of its waste until the ward valley site is
made available. 'out-of-state burial figures released for the first
half of 1996 prove that california's low-level radioactive waste is
not being shipped for disposal -- it is being stored where it is
produced,' silicon valley biomedical industry council president john
vajda explained.

development of the ward valley site, licensed by the california
department of health services in 1993, is delayed while interior
decides whether to sell the development of the ward valley site,
licensed by the california department of health services in 1993, is
delayed while interior decides whether to sell the project property to
the state of california. secretary babbitt rescinded his predecessor's
1993 approval of the sale to conduct his own independent review.
following a 1995 national academy of sciences report on a series of
scientific issues, babbitt indicated that 'the national academy of
sciences says its safe, so i'm prepared to go ahead with it.' since
then, interior has reversed position to undertake a new round of
studies by itself.

with the biotechnology industry on the threshold of an unprecedented growth
phase, business competition issues are in the forefront of individual company
expansion and new plant location decisions. 'sadly, unless the ward valley site
is opened soon, california stands to lose a significant portion of the
industry's 165,000 well-paid jobs and $7.2 billion annual budget here,' mary
walker concluded.

united states senate committee on energy and natural resources
washington dc 20510

september 19, 1996
the honorable dianne feinstein
united states senate
washington, d.c. 20510

dear dianne:

i have seen, as i'm sure you have, an open letter from the democratic
biomedical caucus and the silicon valley biomedical industry council
proposing a compromise on the ward valley issue.

they have proposed that we place the matter in the hands of the
nuclear regulatory commission (nrc), an independent federal regulatory
agency with unparalleled radiological expertise. the nrc would do an
expedited review, drawing upon the substantial record created by the
state of california's licensing and environmental review compliance
actions, the national academy of sciences report, and input received
from the recent department of interior scoping process.

under the compromise proposal, the nrc would either conclude its
review with a finding that california's license approval and related
conditions were adequate to protect public health and safety, or
specify deficiencies based on existing regulatory requirements.

in the former instance, the ward valley property would transfer to the
state of california by act of congress with no further process by the
department of the interior other than title delivery. in the latter
instance, the transfer would be subject to those conditions deemed
necessary by the commission. but in either event, the issue would be
settled by march 1, 1997.

i believe this is a compromise that could work, and i urge that we
work together to implement it before adjournment. please let me know
your thoughts on this matter.

sincerely,

frank h. murkowski chairman


--30--ac/sf.. sy/css contact:
silicon valley biomedial industry council john vajda,
408/732-7277 or
endcontact:

or biocom/san diego environmental committee mary walker,
619/699-0240

keyword: california industry keyword: biotechnology
environment enmed government repeats: new york 212-752-9600 or
800-221-2462; boston 617-236-4266 or 800-225-2030; sf 415-986-4422 or
800-227-0845; la 310-820-9473 today's news on the net - business

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 17:12:14 -0400
reply-to:     melissa a kennelly <mkennell@baldwinw.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         melissa a kennelly <mkennell@baldwinw.edu>
subject:      lesbian literature (nigc)

hey y'all...sorry for the nigc, but i attend a small liberal arts school
in the midwest (that happens to have a mostly conservative population),
and needless to say, lesbian/gay studies or related classes are
non-existent here.  however, we do have the option of independent study.
next quarter i'll be doing an independent study on lesbian
literature/writers(mostly fiction).  i have already done some research on
the topic but i
have not yet had a chance to talk to my advisor to get her input.  i would
greatly appreciate any ideas for novels and/or more specific themes for my
study that those of you on the list may be interested in sharing with me.
thanks!
melissa

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 16:12:19 -0500
reply-to:     owner-urgent-action@m2.monsterbit.com
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>
>urgent action: increasing level of violence in chiapas
>
>information from global exchange.
>
>since the beginning of june, reports of violence and human rights
>violations in northern chiapas, particularly in the municipalities of tila,
>tumbala, salto de agua, and sabanilla, have increased to a crisis level.
>the government is also reported to be continuing a huge armament campaign,
>flooding the area with military troups and vehicles. this illustrates the
>climate of terror present in indigenous and campesino communities, and is
>one of the factors stated by the ezln for the decision to suspend the peace
>talks..
>
>talks between government officials and campesino representatives in tila,
>northern chiapas, to bring peace to the region and to enable the over 1,500
>displaced campesinos to return to their communties were unsuccesful.
>inhabitants of  this region, especially the masoja schuc'ja community have
>been threatened by a paramilitary group called "paz y justicia." its
>government ties enable it to manipulate the judicial system. based on their
>denunciations "suspects" have been detained and penal processes have been
>opened. it seems that the judicial system is only willing to investigate
>denouncements made by groups like "paz y justicia."
>
>the officical government campaign in response to the actions of the popular
>revolutionary army (epr) has led to a significant increase in military and
>police activity, resulting in patrols, military checkpoints and the
>detention of grassroots activists.
>
>it is important that the indigenous communities know they are not alone at
>this time. after 18 months of dialogue, there are no other results than the
>persistent misery and the encirclement of thousands of soldiers. we urge
>you to write a letter to the president of mexico, ernesto zedillo, asking
>for immediate measures. a sample letter follows.
>
>-------------------------------------------
>mr. president ernesto zedillo:
>
>        i would like to express my profound concern toward the ongoing
>violence in  chiapas. the situation continues to deteriorate. this climate
>of terror is one of the factors stated by the ezln for the decision to
>suspend their participation in the peace talks.
>
>after 18 months of dialogue there are no other results than the persistent
>misery and the encirclement of 60,000 soldiers. the resulting desperation
>amongst the population in rebellion places into question nonviolent
>political methods as a means to reach a solution.
>
>i would therefore like to ask you to listen to the demands and the needs of
>all the parties involved. the increased military activity of the last
>weeks, especially in the states of guerrero, oaxaca, tabasco, and chiapas,
>that have lead to the detention of members of campesino and popular
>organizations, must be stopped. i ask you stop the human rights violations.
>
>sincerely,
>
>-----
>south and meso american indian rights center (saiic)
>p.o. box 28703
>oakland ca, 94604
>phone:  (510)834-4263   fax: (510)834-4264
>email:  saiic@igc.apc.org
>office: 1714 franklin street, 3rd floor, oakland
>
>home page: http://www.igc.apc.org/saiic/saiic.html
>
>for more information about saiic, send an empty email message to:
>saiic-info@igc.apc.org
>

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 17:16:33 -0400
reply-to:     djohns@po-box.mcgill.ca
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         david johnson <djohns@po-box.mcgill.ca>
subject:      re: nigc: melissa etheridge?

you can find a subscription form for the melissa etheridge mailing list
on our web site: http://www.ecw.ca/mle/

happy browsing!

glenna

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 16:34:34 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      ellen last night (nigc)

i've received a bunch of private e-mails wanting to know about the show last
night, so i thought i'd post the list for anybody who is interested.
about 10 minutes into the show, there was a scene in ellen's newly purchased
house, and her realtor was going "ellen, where are you?" ellen popped her
head out of a large walk-in closet and then jumped out and said something to
the effect of "i was just in the closet, but i decided to come out. it's
awfully big, but i wouldn't want to live in there or anything!"
so basically, go ellen!
i didn't get to see the end of the episode, but as far as i saw, she never
directly mentioned her sexuality. the closet scene wasn't accompanied by the
applause and cheering i think it deserved, so realistically, anyone watching
the show who didn't know about the whole coming out business and was
watching for it probably would've missed it completely. (swoosh, over their
heads!)
so what do you all think? does this mean she's officially out on the show?
will this lead to further gay issues on ellen? i was going
whole-bunches-of-crazy when the scene happened and my family was all eyeing
me like i'd gone insane.
here's hope for prime time pride!

~abigail :)


"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 16:48:00 -0700
reply-to:     virginia wolffe <vrgwolf1@mail.airmail.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         virginia wolffe <vrgwolf1@mail.airmail.net>
subject:      re: nigc-bible thumping

m gordon wrote:
>
> virginia wolffe wrote.....
>
> >>> please, please...don't judge the bible by the old testament...
> the new testament is what to read.
> focus on christ and his love and message....read john...or romans...
> <<<<<
>
> ok, i can click the "delete" button so many times.  if we, the
> subscribers of the indigo girls listserv want to debate all aspects
> of e&a's professional lives, we have learned to do so respectfully.
> this quote has us treading on thin ice.
>
> i'm not going to debate this thread, but the bible is not an ig
> thread and i found the above note to be offensive.  i think that vw's
> opinion is best left to some religion list.
>
> melissa
>
> --
> administrative requests should not be sent to the list!
> to unsubscribe, send email to listserv@netspace.org
>         with the line: signoff indigo-girls

i sincerely apologize. i never meant to offend you. or anyone. i have
seen so many nigc on this list (some days i download 200 pieces of mail)
that i didn't think anyone would mind.  sorry is all i can say.

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 14:41:23 -0700
reply-to:     lynn cardamone <lynncar@microsoft.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         lynn cardamone <lynncar@microsoft.com>
subject:      nigc - ellen has a listserv

for those of you that can't get enough of ellen...
a friend of mine (who is on the melissa e. listserv) sent me the mail
below so i can post it to the ig listers who are interested in getting
even more mail !!!   :)

i can only handle ig mail myself - - - but i have seen a lot of "ellen
mail" on the ig list lately so maybe this will help keep ellen mail with
ellen & ig mail ellen-free!!!!  :)
no offense to anyone - just a fun-loving comment to my fellow fun-loving
ig friends...

lightheartedly yours,
lynn  :)
>----------
from:   xxxxxxxx
>sent:  thursday, october 03, 1996 2:24 pm
>to:    lynncar@microsoft.com
>subject:       fw: ellen established: list online!
>
>wanna post this to the indigo list?
>
>thanks!
>
>----------
>from:  xxxxxx
>sent:  thursday, october 03, 1996 2:19 pm
>to:    multiple recipients of list mlether
>subject:       ellen established: list online!
>
>hi all -
>
>i'm pleased to announce that the new ellen degeneres mailing list ellen in
>now up and running. thanks to all who expressed their interest. i think we're
>going to have a fun ride. be sure to share this with friends you think may
>like to
>join.
>
>to subscribe to the list, send mail to listserv@dartmouth.edu with the
>contents:
>subscribe ellen your name
>
>
>
>my apologies in advance for variations of this message you may receive in
>your
>travels in cyberspace - i'm cross-posting this to other lists who may be
>interested.
>
>
>

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 15:15:47 -0700
reply-to:     verdi@imap2.asu.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         benjamin slavin <verdi@imap2.asu.edu>
subject:      other lovely things the bible says
x-to:         virginia wolffe <vrgwolf1@mail.airmail.net>
in-reply-to:  <325450b0.7c36@mail.airmail.net>

  i am taking a course in ritual,symbol and myth and we are going over
prejudices in christianity. here are a few more quotes for all you bible
thumpers.
"woman should keep silent at the meeting. they have no permission to
talk, but should keep their place as the law directs. if there is
something they want to know, they can ask their husbands at home. it is a
shocking thing fo a woman to talk at the meeting." (romans 14:34-35)

" woman must dress in a becoming manner, modestly and soberly, not with
eleborate hair-styles, not adorned with gold and pearls or expenisive
clothes,but with good deeds, as befits women who claim to be religious.
their role is to learn, listening quietly and with due submission. i do
not permit woman to teach or dictate to the men; they should keep quiet.
for adam was created first, and eve afterwards; moreover it was not adam
who was deceived: it was the woman who yeilding to decption fell into
sin." (1 timothy 2:9-15)

obviously there is no woman in their right mind who would believe this.
but it is "in the bible". the very same bible that condemns
homosexuality. so is it your place to choose which passages you believe?
so for any christian woman who is against homosexuality and is at the
same time a feminist i think i can rightly call you a hypocrite!

ben

"every tool is a weapon if you hold it right."
-ani difranco

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=========================================================================
date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 17:23:49 -0700
reply-to:     virginia wolffe <vrgwolf1@mail.airmail.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         virginia wolffe <vrgwolf1@mail.airmail.net>
subject:      re: other lovely things the bible says
x-to:         verdi@imap2.asu.edu

verdi@imap2.asu.edu wrote:
>
>   i am taking a course in ritual,symbol and myth and we are going over
> prejudices in christianity. here are a few more quotes for all you bible
> thumpers.
> "woman should keep silent at the meeting. they have no permission to
> talk, but should keep their place as the law directs. if there is
> something they want to know, they can ask their husbands at home. it is a
> shocking thing fo a woman to talk at the meeting." (romans 14:34-35)
>
> " woman must dress in a becoming manner, modestly and soberly, not with
> eleborate hair-styles, not adorned with gold and pearls or expenisive
> clothes,but with good deeds, as befits women who claim to be religious.
> their role is to learn, listening quietly and with due submission. i do
> not permit woman to teach or dictate to the men; they should keep quiet.
> for adam was created first, and eve afterwards; moreover it was not adam
> who was deceived: it was the woman who yeilding to decption fell into
> sin." (1 timothy 2:9-15)
>
>  obviously there is no woman in their right mind who would believe this.
> but it is "in the bible". the very same bible that condemns
> homosexuality. so is it your place to choose which passages you believe?
> so for any christian woman who is against homosexuality and is at the
> same time a feminist i think i can rightly call you a hypocrite!
>
> ben
>
> "every tool is a weapon if you hold it right."
> -ani difranco

i can't believe i need to justify my comments... but if you knew me, you wouldn't take
my comments the way you have. i am bisexual myself...i have many gay friends...i don't
think i have to trade my sexuality for the things i choose to believe... i am no bible
thumper... i have chosen a path that works for me...it may not work for you... i have
never judged anyone. i live my life and that is between no one but me and what i chose
to call "god". i can't begin to think that the bible encompasses all that god is...and i
won't try to fit all that "god" is into a convenient little box... we only use 8% of our
brains for a reason... and yes, i do believe many things written then are inappropriate
for the world we live in today. my convictions are my own. if you believe something
else...hey that's fine. there are many christians who have a problem with what i believe
also, but like i said...it works for me. i think that is the most important thing. :)
there are many paths to the top of the mountain.

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 15:32:15 -0700
reply-to:     paula laine <plaine@seaccd.sccd.ctc.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         paula laine <plaine@seaccd.sccd.ctc.edu>
subject:      world cafe begging

oh so kind and generous listmates:

ok so i checked and nobody in the state of washington broadcasts world
cafe. please please is someone has an extra boombox sitting around
along with their stereo could you throw a tape in the boombox and make me
a copy? or else i know some places broadcast 2x a day.
please please?? i assume there are other people out there like me with no
access, so i beg of you, help us out!! i have a few boots i could trade
it is on tomorrows show. i am really mad that we don't get this in
seattle.
what a rip!!


:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
        paula laine             south seattle comm college - library
        (206)764-5395           6000 16th ave s.w.
        library technician ii   seattle  wa 98106
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 18:45:26 edt
reply-to:     herbert huels <73771.760@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         herbert huels <73771.760@compuserve.com>
subject:      nigc:vld@eddie's tues

did anyone go to the viva la diva show at eddie's this tuesday??? if so, did any
one tape it???  i heard it was going to be an acoustic show...
hoping....
-moe(simone)

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 20:06:46 -0400
reply-to:     christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
subject:      fave non-music quote

ok, here it is, from the buffalo ny 10/15/94 tape (thanks dwayne, sorry
about the astrology bit).  emily goes "this is what y'all sound like:
aaaahhhhhh!"  it's hysterical.

and it looks at this point as though the emily solo bootleg occurs only at
the level of discourse, and an actual tape doesn't exist.  i'll keep
lookin, though! please, if you're out there, find me!  i'm your cosmic
destiny!  it's phone sex tonight!

yours,
chris

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 20:26:35 -0400
reply-to:     janinsdale@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         janinsdale@aol.com
subject:      re: kisssss!!!!!!
x-to:         oh.susanna@dartmouth.edu

in a message dated 96-10-03 07:48:45 edt, susan.b.marine@dartmouth.edu (susan
b. marine) writes:

>yessssssssss!!!!! kiss fans. that seals it. i must have emily and or amy's
>baby. i kneel at the kiss altar...i am a member of the kiss army (a card
>carrying member i must say) and i would give a million bucks to hear em and
>amy
>join gene on "rock and roll all night" or "beth" (can't ya hear amy singing
>it
>y'all?)
>
>gotta go put on double platinum right now.......
>
>susie headbanger

scared!  running to hide from susie headbanger.........

:)
jan

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 20:26:38 -0400
reply-to:     janinsdale@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         janinsdale@aol.com
subject:      re: world cafe setlist
x-to:         ddickson@crl.com

in a message dated 96-10-03 08:45:10 edt, ddickson@crl.com (doug dickson)
writes:

>the indigo girls pay a return visit to the cafe studios for a special
>preview performance of some of their new music...plus host david dye
>spins songs from jackson browne, joan osborne, sting and more
>on the next world cafe!
>
>re:  world cafe dacs for friday october 4 feed @ 02:00
>        for broadcast friday october 4, 1996
>
>

please please  p l e a s e ! ! ! ! someone tape this....
ben will do anything for a copy  (oh, and so will i....)

jan

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 17:35:08 -0700
reply-to:     velt1682 <velt1682@tao.sosc.osshe.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         velt1682 <velt1682@tao.sosc.osshe.edu>
organization: southern oregon state college
subject:      re: 1200c's galleleo (sp??)

first, i know that the spelling of what's his name in the subject line is
wrong, but hopefully you all will know who i'm talking about.

anyway, for a first post to this list....

i took a close listen to a&e talking about galleleo on 1200c, and it
sounds to me as if amy says, "_he's_ probably a cow somewhere saying
'bout time'"  well, i'm not sure that's the entire quote, correctly, but
the point is (after a long explanation) that i think she says _he's_
instead of _there's_.

well, that's what i heard anyway.

later!

kirstin
velt1682@tao.sosc.osshe.edu

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 20:42:22 -0400
reply-to:     danaw1208@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         danaw1208@aol.com
subject:      nigc- buffy st. marie

well,  "hi" to all listees~

since tv is a popular topic these days, thought i would mention that
tonight i saw a special on cbc featuring buffy saint marie in concert.
don't think this is the same show airing out west, but could be....

i have noticed that cbc regularly airs native american programming...
there's a tv drama that airs weekly....haven't caught the show..but have
seen the teasers for it, plus they air a community award thing once in
awhile....don't know who gives the awards or what the criteria are in
picking individuals for these awards...but no doubt about it, issues
affecting native peoples are more openly discussed and
get more exposure in cultural dialogue in canada, at least in comparison
to the eastern part of usa.  i know out west that indian issues are more
a part of daily life and consideration....

hope other people had a chance to see the bsm show that i did.
she sang bury my heart at wounded knee too....very interesting
show.  i love to chat more about this with other interested readers
out there.

take care, everybody,
dana

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 22:00:02 -0400
reply-to:     christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
subject:      re: 1200c's galleleo (sp??)
x-to:         velt1682 <velt1682@tao.sosc.osshe.edu>
in-reply-to:  <32545bbc.1b35@tao.sosc.osshe.edu>

oh, my first memory of ig cyberland.  i first joined the list like a year
ago, right in the middle of the "moo" debate.  member that oldies?
newbies, we had this big fat long converation/childish argument about who
actually says "moo", amy or emily.  it was a divisive issue, but i think
emily came out on top.  anyway, my first memories of y'all.  int that
*tender*?

but please, folks, not again?!:-)

teary eyed,
chris ii
>
> anyway, for a first post to this list....
>
> i took a close listen to a&e talking about galleleo on 1200c, and it
> sounds to me as if amy says, "_he's_ probably a cow somewhere saying
> 'bout time'"  well, i'm not sure that's the entire quote, correctly, but
> the point is (after a long explanation) that i think she says _he's_
> instead of _there's_.
>
> well, that's what i heard anyway.
>
> later!
>
> kirstin
> velt1682@tao.sosc.osshe.edu
>
> --
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>

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 21:24:39 -0500
reply-to:     susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
subject:      re: world cafe again....

howdy all!

yes, please oh please somebody volunteer to tape this - we will help on =
a tape tree if necessary - it is not available on the barren plains! =
surely someone can tape this?????? (hear the begging here, ok??) thanks =
tons!

peace, love and blue skies,

susan and jocelyn

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 19:32:53 -0700
reply-to:     candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net>
subject:      soc's and buffy st. marie

hey ya'll...

i taped the bsm special last night--what an amazingly intense woman--so =
anyone who wants a copy, just let me know...
also, i'm looking for boots with soc speeches of amy's...if anybody has =
one or more, could you contact me in regards to a trade?  thanks so =
much...

oh, and another favorite non-lyric quote...

amy: "well, we are bad poetry, and i am self congratulatory...most of =
the time..."
emily: "we're just in it for the money!"
amy: "we're just kidding."
emily: "yeah right..."

...wheels in motion...
greta

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 22:41:32 -0400
reply-to:     christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
subject:      new songs--geographic motif?

has anyone else noticed the geographic motif of lots of the new stuff?
leeds, chiapas bound, winthrop are all songs about (and not about) places,
then there's get out the map, a decidedly geographic tune, and of course a
road song--hey kind friend.  what is that about?  course, no one ever
responds to my posts (sniff, sniff, somebody?  anybody?  bueller?
corinne?  howdy?  jude?  greg?  dwayne?  i'm calling on you all, dammit,
respond! :-) all in fun--frightening that i actually *know* who you are,
huh?
peace and geography,
chris ii

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 23:44:50 -0400
reply-to:     "m.macvey" <mmacvey@attach.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "m.macvey" <mmacvey@attach.net>
subject:      re: world cafe again....
x-to:         deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>

deb and other interested ig fans

i hope to be able to tape the world cafe ig segment and if successful
will be glad to provide the tape. wxpn in philly simulcasts on wkhs in md
which i can pick up pretty well. the only hook is that wkhs occasionally
preempts with their own programming (unpredictably). khs stands for kent
high school so the programming is often an assault on the senses. i'm
hoping they go home early on friday.

here's hoping

marilyn

i am a problem child- i've been wild all my days...(a.ray)

..still crazy after all these years.. (p. simon)

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 23:11:49 -0500
reply-to:     m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
subject:      geography & new album

as chris talbot wrote...

>>has anyone else noticed the geographic motif of lots of the new
stuff? leeds, chiapas bound, winthrop are all songs about (and not
about) places, then there's get out the map, a decidedly geographic
tune, and of course a road song--hey kind friend.  what is that about?
  course, no one ever responds to my posts (sniff, sniff, somebody?
anybody?  bueller? corinne?  howdy?  jude?  greg?  dwayne?  i'm
calling on you all, dammit, respond! :-) all in fun--frightening that
i actually *know* who you are, huh?
peace and geography,  chris ii<<<<<<<<<<<<

hey christ:

1)  geographic motif -- maybe that's why the new album is supposed to
be entitled, "map"

2)  no one responding to your posts.....ok, email tag -- you're "it"


here's to ig content....

melissa

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 23:43:36 -0400
reply-to:     jonny wu <wuman@warwick.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jonny wu <wuman@warwick.net>
subject:      world cafe

i am also kind of confused about this world cafe thing.  can anyone tell
in when i should tune into the broadcast if i am in new york, new york?
thanks.

                                                jonny

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date:         thu, 3 oct 1996 23:48:31 edt
reply-to:     oh susanna <oh.susanna@dartmouth.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "susan b. marine" <susan.b.marine@dartmouth.edu>
subject:      re: indigo-girls digest - 3 oct 1996 - special issue

--- you wrote:

i am looking for the the 8/12/96 new hampshire concert
--- end of quoted material ---
kay y'all, there were at least 20 of us from the list there...mike reynolds,
did i see you jumping around with a microphone in your hand? didn't anyone dub
this show????

pleaeeeeaaaaaaaaaase
okay better now

susan

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 00:24:46 -0400
reply-to:     deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
subject:      new ig songs/geographic content/map

greetings all in indigo land!

i have also been thinking a lot about the geographic content of the
new ig songs.  it's interesting that there are so many specific
referrences to places, winthrop, leeds, chiapis, in titles, but
also within the songs, spokane and the cascade range in hey kind friend,
and gainesville in shame on you.  i guess spending a vast amount of
time on the road becomes a part of a person and they continue to
reflect about specific places and events even when they are not touring.

i must say that i can't wait until the spring and hear the finished
products of these fine creations.  i feel priveleged to have had an
opportunity to hear them performed live on the demo tour.


on another igc note about the first single

i think "shame on you", "it's alright" and "get out the map" will
be the three contenders for first release.  i wonder if amy will
really put 'fucking up' on the album, or will that be saved for
live performances and the radio acceptable 'screwing up' will be
substituted.

i personally would love to have "shame on you" be the first release
because i can't get enough of this song.  after first seeing the
girls perform it at atlanta pride, i have been filled with a special
jovial feeling of optimism, and suprise when i found out it was an
amy song.  i love how they keep us on our toes!  i would love to see
a video for this song, amy sitting by a fire checking out all the
'beautiful ladies' and then blushing with a big shy grin.  so much
going on in that song that could be made into an incredibly fun video.
(maybe i should submit my idea to amy and emily and see what they think :)

take care and peace all!

-deb

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 03:17:06 -0400
reply-to:     tmp@uv.es
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         tmp@uv.es
subject:      re: skip song..(& misc)
x-cc:         fnoguerd@etsit.upv.es

ferran & monica:

--------------------------------
index:
a-preamble:(advice:quite long...)
b-part i:that comment:(skipping midnight)
c-before a trade,!!! pd( read this!!!)
d:nice quotes
e-"international greetings"(only under ferran's
responsability,:-) )
f-extremely cool suggests(shared responsability
between monica&ferran,~:-)&|8-) )):
......
z-....
unnumered( x-files "mistery" )
authors:
(post data ii)
----------------------------------

a-preamble:(advice:quite long...)
beep,beep,... connecting..3,2,1,ignition
-----------

b-part i:that comment:
---------
after a long lurk period,we write our monthly letter
to the list, we don't remember my last..

well:in reference to this comments:

!date:    fri, 27 sep 1996 17:03:57 -0400
!from:    sundara <smurphy@ups.edu>
!subject: re: do you ever skip songs

!>
!>okay, i admit it - four words... "midnight train to georgia"
!>
!>(go ahead, stone me...)

!i can't stand this song, and for the record, this is the
only ig song i !can't stand.  i'm glad to know someone else
doesn't like it either.  go !ahead, flame me,  i don't care,
but really, i'm too cute to flame, so don't !waste the
bandwidth...hee hee!

well,we understand that the 1200c version of midnight
could be so much better,but i'm sure that if you had
heard the live version from the same song performed by
ig with michael stipe (athens live show '88 boot )
you'll be crazy,atomized,enligthned... with it.in fact
it's one of our prefereds any time any place,and one of the
responsibles that we drove crazy with the girls(but also
summertime,all along the watchtower,i'll give my skin,
..all contained in the same boot).there's a kind of
special chemistry between stipe and the girls,...well
we're gettin excited so we'll stop here...

c-before a trade,!!! pd( read this!!!)
------------------------

:if you want a trade of this,wait a minute bc:

1st-i don't have already received my back tapes to the
last trade i set up (it's took more than 2 months to the
other person to send the tapes she has to send,meanwhile
i don't receive mine i won't set up more open trades )

2nd-i apologize to these persons who i haven't answered
askin for trades,read the above text and you'll know why

3rd-my e-mail account is gonna change and i don't know
how long this will be working.

4th-i'm very busy now
-----------
sorry if i've created false illusions,but i promise that when
everything be o.k. i'll tell you,

d:nice quotes
-------------
*well there are a lot of them but these could be our personal
fav's:

-----
monica:
  "i'm looking for someone who can take as much as i give...
            ... and to give as much as i need."(ig)
------
ferran:

"consuming far too much
ignoring the will to touch
the ones who don't have food at all...

i'm breathing
i'm wondering how
we watch wheel of fortune now
i close my eyes and try to see
a piece of paradise in me

beat me up
and smash my brand new tv
to help me look for
a little piece of paradise in me"

(k's choice,paradise in me)

e-"international greetings"(only under ferran's
responsability,:-) )
------------------------
au revoir!(fr) auf wiedersehen!(de) ciao!(it) adeus!(port)
hasta luego!(cast)..........adeu (sic,=bye in catalan)

greetins to the indigo land,(from ugghh.. macarena land)

f-extremely cool suggests:
---------------------------
(...by the way:
-you must hear & buy:
*k's choice-paradise in me
*rem's new adventures
...you won't be disappointed!!!!)

z-....(after 200 days in front of the pcscreen readin the
posts e missed this summer,..maybe we're on the line
between foolness and sanity...).well,if you've read
this post completely you deserve a prize but
we're out of them,..next time maybe...
,,,,,,

unnumered( x-files mistery )
10.000 wars example:
here's it's 1:30 am (european hour) & our batteries are
empty by the moment(normal ones not energizer) and
we're ready for the flame session (we'll sleep
all the night with a suit of armour on)
...byyyyyyyyyyyye(ummm we'll have an ig dream tonight)

--------------------------------------------------
authors:
ferran  nogueroles d'oliveira & monica soutto
<fnoguerd@etsit.upv.es>
universitat politecnica de valencia
valencia,the catalan lands ;--).....(southern europe)
copyright:123-456-789
isbn:45-678-899-098
all rights unreserved
---------------------------------------------------

pd2:sorry for the bandwith waste but we'll lurk for another
2 or 3 months...

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 00:22:44 -0700
reply-to:     jeni <saulinoj@olywa.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jeni <saulinoj@olywa.net>
subject:      re: new ig songs/geographic content/map

hey ya'll (it is so cool to actually know list people)
i love the geographical content in hey kind friend. i was totally blown away
to hear amy singing about my hometown.

jeni
--
saulinoj@olywa.net

you've already won me over in spite of me
don't be alarmed if i fall head over feet
don't be surprised if i love you for all that you are
i couldn't help it
it's all your fault
                -a. morissette

system error 54382183.25.a542   press any key to begin your real life

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 04:10:38 -0400
reply-to:     mmedido@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mmedido@aol.com
subject:      re: new ig songs/geographic content/map

in a message dated 96-10-04 00:29:18 edt, doobie writes:

<<  i would love to see
a video for this song, amy sitting by a fire checking out all the
'beautiful ladies' and then blushing with a big shy grin.  >>

in my mind she's sitting on the front steps of a house in the hot sun with
a bunch of folks.
(cut to girls passing by...shot at ar's eye level so we would only see
the legs and flowing (?) skirts of the ladies as they pass
ar. / cut to girls turning around and flashing her a look
*shot with a long lense wide open so they are in focus and the background
is blurred/  quick cut to ar blushing)

binkles
( i think they should get the person who did the latest rem vid....
it's stunningly beautiful !!!)
"bidlly bweee dop boo dop bee bop bwee !!!! "
(betty carter )

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=========================================================================
date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 01:43:04 -0700
reply-to:     k miller <kmiller@accessone.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         k miller <kmiller@accessone.com>
organization: van waters & rogers
subject:      re: ig dreams

well my gf hasn't gotten around to posting her long-awaited ig dream so
i'll just do it for her, i love it so much.  not much to it, but she was
hangin' out w/ amy, emily was in the vicinity too but not so involved
(funny since sue's an emily gal). anyway, she and amy were climbing a
rock wall, & amy was lookin' sooooooooo cute, & then, here's the
crack-up, amy was worrying that she didn't look butch enough.  that's
all.  now wish i could have one! (an ig dream that is.  well, maybe an ig
gal or two, too)
km

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 11:04:23 +0100
reply-to:     indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
subject:      re: igc: guessing at the 1st single
x-to:         margot laidacker <margotll@aol.com>
in-reply-to:  <961003161418_117625945@emout05.mail.aol.com>

on thu, 3 oct 1996, margot laidacker wrote:

>  i think that get out the map will be the first single, and i'm glad, because
> that song and shame on you are two of my favorite ig songs ever.
>

is there any chance that someone can email a copy of some of these lyrics to
the list (or to me)?   i'd also suggest cc'ing them to carolyn who runs the
lifeblood ig archive (underdog@onramp.net).

mat

------------------------------------------------------------------------
| matthew j smith        \ "[the priest] said that if you have to work |
| mts5@aber.ac.uk         \   for anyone, an absentee boss is best."   |
| indigojo@freenet.hut.fi  \     - jeannette winterson, "the passion"  |
|----------------------------------------------------------------------|
|    billy bragg / indigo girls info:  http://www.aber.ac.uk/~mts5/    |
------------------------------------------------------------------------

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 08:14:09 -0500
reply-to:     k645501b@edinboro.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "digest     \"karrie bowen\"" <k645501b@edinboro.edu>
subject:      nigc-  still lookin' for bon

sorry to waste bandwidth guys, but

hey bon!  are you out there???????

i have boots for you and i lost your new address......

thanks!

karrie

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 08:56:06 -0500
reply-to:     susan steinike <inky@expert.cc.purdue.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan steinike <inky@expert.cc.purdue.edu>
subject:      moo debate
in-reply-to:  <199610040353.waa25836@hermes.iupui.edu> from "automatic digest
              processor" at oct 3, 96 11:49:08 pm

this is especially for christine: another response you your post!

yes, i remember the moo debate, and i also think it is emily.
now, everyone will probably start throwing grape nuts at me for beating
this dead horse, bu remember when we were fighting about who said "who
loves us..." on the 1200 curfews version of thin line?  holy moly, that
went on forever, remember everyone??

ok, now i'm starting to sound like chris farley on the snl skit where he's
doing a talk show but instead of actually talking to the guest he sits
and reminisces about past shows with people who call in.

hope everyone has a good weekend, and while i'm babbling, i'd like to recommend
the nike air quierra for anyone who might be shoe shopping.

sue

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 08:29:52 -0600
reply-to:     corinne simpson <corinne@utah-inter.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         corinne simpson <corinne@utah-inter.net>
subject:      favorite non lyric quotes

well.  call me simplistic but i think my favorite non lyric quote is a big
resounding "thanks y'all!!!!!!!!"  from the girls.  i loooooooove that!
fabulous!


love
corinne

ps....  chris, pally, are we trading?  oh, and sundara i got your tape
yesterday, thanks...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
i know it cuz i'm like
that a lot....--ani
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 10:31:53 edt
reply-to:     oh susanna <oh.susanna@dartmouth.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "susan b. marine" <susan.b.marine@dartmouth.edu>
subject:      world cafe and a big b-day... (nigc)

hellllo little indigoheads.

hope one of you computer geniuses can figger out how to tape the world cafe'
thingy today so us nimrods like me can enjoy it too :)

just wanted to let everyone know that today is the fabulous  ig lister amy
putnam's birthday... please inundate her with messages of birthday love at
pegasus@crl.com

h and a k,
susan
p.s. sorry amy, i can't help myself....

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 11:01:43 edt
reply-to:     "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
subject:      re: new ig songs/geographic content/map
x-to:         doobie@student.umass.edu
in-reply-to:  <199610040424.aaa11333@wilde.oit.umass.edu>; from "deb odonoghue"
              at oct 4, 96 12:24 am

  i definately think the first single will be "shame on you" and the
second will be "its alright", but could be "get out the map".

  one song each from amy and emily (hasn't that been the pattern on
the other albums?).  both are "catchy" with the potential to be big
money makers (this music thing is a business long with everything
else), but moreover both soy and ia have very strong messages and it
wolud be an ig thing to do putting those choices in front of a wide
audience.  and, to be honest, i just don't think the adult
contemporary radio stations are ready for em's lead banjo on gotm.
plus the girls seem to be very comfortable with shame on you, it was
an encore song at hampton beach and it hadn't even been recorded yet!

  as for the "obscentity", my guess is they will record two versions
for the cd single, one with it and one "cleaned up" for the radio
stations.  personally, i would hope that amy would leave it in but
there are practicalities to consider.

  to start another sub-thread, from what we've heard what do you think
will be the "surprise song" -- that song that really wasn't marketed
hard but really finds a nitch?  personally i think that will be
"winthrop."  its absolutely gorgeous and heart-wrenching. it would be
hard to promote as a single, but there may well be a huge popular demand
for it.

                                -- chris

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 11:09:47 edt
reply-to:     "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
subject:      ig and summerfest (mke)

well the new album is being recorded and the ig are going to tour
behind it.  i have a question for folks who attend milwaukee's
summerfest -- who do we petition to make sure ig are included in this
year's lineup.  is bo black still running the thing?

last year's choices were pretty sad (to be fair, the pearl jam thing
wasn't their fault) and the last time the girls were there they didn't
get the mainstage.  perhaps if we express interest now they will set
up a date.

it couldn't hurt to try....

                                -- chris

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 11:14:01 edt
reply-to:     tamara mizell <103660.214@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         tamara mizell <103660.214@compuserve.com>
subject:      world cafe is on...  ?'s

hi folks!

world cafe is on right now in my area (and making me late for work cause i'm
trying to figure out if i need to try to tape it or not!)... they're saying that
the guest is lara (laura?) someone and they're playing music by john gorka and
kris mckay, etc.

my question is... is this the show that ig are supposed to be on???  it's not
giving me any indication of that and i can't get a play list from the internet.
so, if anyone who knows anything about this could contact me, i'd be
appreciative.  i was gonna try and tape it for you guys, but i'm guessing that
it will be on at a later time???

peace,
tamara

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=========================================================================
date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 11:27:33 -0400
reply-to:     weenracer@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         lisa savu <weenracer@aol.com>
subject:      re: the vote!!!!(nigc)

sorry 'bout the nigc, but i have to respond in agreement --  i would love to
put my support behind the green party, but, sadly, what it comes down to is
this: a vote for nader, (against clinton), is basically just another vote for
dole....   shudder to think...    because there's not a chance that the
greens will actually win.  i was so hurt and upset when i heard about
clinton's intent to sign doma, (defense of marriage?... come on!)... but the
fact is he's alot more gay-friendly than what is our only other _realistic_
choice... if we fall apart on this, then dole has a better chance ---
   scary thought.

my $.02,
lisa

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 11:32:38 edt
reply-to:     tamara mizell <103660.214@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         tamara mizell <103660.214@compuserve.com>
subject:      world cafe once more

hi again!

i think i've figured out that the station playing wc is just waaay behind, like
by a five days.  i finally got a list off of the internet.  so... someone else
will probably tape this for you all.  if not, i'll still try to tape it... it'll
just be about a week from now.

peace and all that,
tamara

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 10:54:30 -0600
reply-to:     deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>
subject:      re: ig and summerfest (mke)

chris wrote:
>well the new album is being recorded and the ig are going to tour
>behind it.  i have a question for folks who attend milwaukee's
>summerfest -- who do we petition to make sure ig are included in this
>year's lineup.  is bo black still running the thing?

yeah bo still runs the fest, but i believe it's bob babbish (sp?) who
establishes the line-ups.

>last year's choices were pretty sad (to be fair, the pearl jam thing
>wasn't their fault)

well the pearl jam thing actually worked out. they initially cancelled (as
they did their whole tour that year) but then ended up playing two shows
because they felt bad for cancelling there the year before. it was a great
show, right dwayne? ;)

>and the last time the girls were there they didn't
>get the mainstage.  perhaps if we express interest now they will set
>up a date.

well the office number is 414.273.2680 if you want to start plugging away.
but personally i would not want ig playing the mainstage (which is a
25,000+ seat amphitheater). i would rather they play one of the smaller
stages. the koss pavilion/leinie lodge stage in particular would be perfect
(michelle malone and bds played there a year ago). sure it would be packed,
but the atmosphere would be much more to their style.

deb

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 08:51:23 -0700
reply-to:     never loved elvis <napikosk@scf-fs.usc.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         never loved elvis <napikosk@scf-fs.usc.edu>
subject:      quote, misheard, and the f-word a la radio
in-reply-to:  <199610031146.eaa00981@dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com>

> removed.  alanis morissette certainly got a lot of air play with "you
> oughtta know", which had references to oral sex in it.

and said "fuck!" go, alanis. i've notice that the stations that play ig
(i'm thinking of aaa stations) tend to be more open to playing the word
than other stations. sometimes. not in l.a. where stupid kroq, thinks it
is sooooooooooooo cool whenever it plays a <gulp> "bad word."

ok, here's a great emily quote from a brisbane show:
"i went to woolworth's and bought him a ring. this disturbed him. i think
it was a control issue, really..."
        (ok, maybe it's funnier in context. shake it off.)

and i know i'm way late in this thread but i thought of some misheard
lyrics the other night: i used to think forever that it was "just a raging
psycho" in "land of canaan," and "destination my community" in hammer and
a nail.  but the strangest one was in "blood and fire." for some unknown
reason i used to think it was "i feel forsaken *by* the things i gave
away." this is quite a different meaning which i had a hard time
relinquishing actually, when i finally read the liner notes.

inspired by gravity,
linda

      interviewer: i like the honesty with which you present yourself.
      billy bragg: i have no choice really; here i am! i mean, what do
                   you think i am, kiss?

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 12:13:18 -0400
reply-to:     michael reynolds <asl@umcs.maine.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         michael reynolds <asl@umcs.maine.edu>
subject:      nh tape, nader, dar list meetr tomorrow????

my nh tape suxs. really, sunny has been begging me for it and god i want one
of her tapes so bad (actually any '96 tracy c. stuff!!!!) i got busted
taping, but with help from a friend (who actually sabotaged my tape by
talking on it) got it and my recorder back. the guy who i met in my dorm is
setting up a dat trade with someone who has hampton, so i will get it from
him the day he gets it. i would rather wait till a *great* sounding tape is
circulating, before i seed anything, i also think i may know another person
who may have it.
i also trade and tape much more than ig, case in point being my pearl jam
masters from augusta on 9/26 (pristine recording btw) medeski martin and
wood last night, and (possibly) dar tomorrow (is anyone going, i will be
there and i wont have any access to email cus i'm going home but i have
cerebral palsy and i will most likely have a ll beans's hippack, brown hair
about 5' 10", maybe with blue pullover and jeans. )
i also havent sent out letters, packages, and other things because i have
been so busy. i really do want to help with the soc tape, i really do want
to trade other stuff (as well as replace my red light boot that got eaten)
but i literally have very little free time. i almost can see why soome
people pay for tapes, it does take time... but of course i am broke.
so, if dar comes out well, i might be able to seed it before next century,
okay? possibly the week after next, when i supposedly am on break (ha!)
mike r.

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 12:48:47 -0500
reply-to:     k645501b@edinboro.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "digest     \"karrie bowen\"" <k645501b@edinboro.edu>
subject:      skipping songs

ok, even though i am the biggest ig fan in pa (i'm kidding...please let's not
start that thread again)  i do admit that i skip songs.  mostly emily songs,
as i relate better to amy.....but there are a couple.

i always, always, always skip "southland in the springtime."  i had an ex
boyfriend from atlanta who used to always tell me how much he wanted to be
in georgia than in pa, and i always took it as "there" than "with me", so
anything that pumps up the south as primary living area always rubs me the
wrong way.  not that i wouldn't live there, but the idea of prefering north
carolina or texas or anywhere else south of the mason/dixson line over me
is shattering to my self-esteem.  :)

i also always used to ditch "chickenman".  man, did that song get long.  but
now i love it.  i think i grew into a new appreciation for it.

and i always skip "hey jesus" too.  don't know why.  it is basically the song
that really bugs me by the ig.

what do i never ever skip?  evereverever?

"closer to fine"  "ghost"  "you left it up to me" "watershed" and "walk away."

i just could never do it.

and what do i skip songs toward??  "let it be me" and "nashville."  and "the
river" on 1200 curfews.

ok, enough...

peace-

karrie;)z

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 12:04:00 -0700
reply-to:     ksfencil@jol.mobil.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "kollin s. fencil" <ksfencil@jol.mobil.com>
organization: mobil oil corporation
subject:      re: skipping songs

digest "karrie bowen" wrote:

> i always, always, always skip "southland in the springtime."  i had an ex
> boyfriend from atlanta who used to always tell me how much he wanted to be
> in georgia than in pa, and i always took it as "there" than "with me", so
> anything that pumps up the south as primary living area always rubs me the
> wrong way.  not that i wouldn't live there, but the idea of prefering north
> carolina or texas or anywhere else south of the mason/dixson line over me
> is shattering to my self-esteem.  :)
>
> i also always used to ditch "chickenman".  man, did that song get long.  but
> now i love it.  i think i grew into a new appreciation for it.
>
> and i always skip "hey jesus" too.  don't know why.  it is basically the song
> that really bugs me by the ig.
>
> what do i never ever skip?  evereverever?
>
> "closer to fine"  "ghost"  "you left it up to me" "watershed" and "walk away."
>
> i just could never do it.
>
> and what do i skip songs toward??  "let it be me" and "nashville."  and "the
> river" on 1200 curfews.
>
> ok, enough...
>
> peace-
>
> karrie;)z
>

karrie, i can relate on chickenman totally, i now love the song, i often
think that the song now replaces ctf as the headliner at concerts.  that
may sound weird but the past five or six shows i've ben to it seemed
like the ig were attempting to get away from play ctf as there encore
song and started playing cm, well that is the wasy it seemed in michigan
and illinios, can anyone back me up on this or am i way out in left
field?

my song to never skip would be ptntf.

peace, kollin

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 13:22:07 -0400
reply-to:     christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
subject:      hte minn bootleg

hi kids.  got amy's hte minn bootleg, and kids, be excited.  it's a
hottie!  before i get thousands of requests, though, a tape tree is in the
works!  hooray for bootlegs!

chris ii

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 12:26:42 -0600
reply-to:     deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>
subject:      another shirt update

i just want to let you know that i have mailed out about two thirds of the
shirts. unfortunately the remainder are going to have to sit in my spare
room for the next week while i continue to prepare for the gre (the test
date is next saturday). i still don't have the meaning of "amelirate" and
"sycophant" down pat, so i feel the need to put my attention there :) sorry
for the inconvienence, but right now studying is more important.

if you really need to know if your shirt is on the way, feel free to ask me
privately. i have a list of what went out.

deb

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 13:35:24 -0400
reply-to:     rob williamson <rwilliam@doas.state.ga.us>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         rob williamson <rwilliam@doas.state.ga.us>
subject:      jane! stop this crazy thing!!

hello.
can
somebody
please tell me
how to
get off of the digest version of this list??
i've tried everthing and nothing seems to work. the instructions do not
seem to apply to the digest version???!!!
my mailbox is so full i cannot send outgoing mail and am now using an
alternate account . . .
private e-mail please as i cannot keep up with the digests.
i know i'm not the only one with this problem as i've talked to others with
the same dilemma . . .

tia!
rob

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 13:43:09 -0400
reply-to:     andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
subject:      world cafe

i'm so confused about this world cafe thing.  i'm in philly, & i heard that
it was on 90.9 from 2-4.  it's almost 2:00, & this station does not sound
musical.  if anyone has any relevant info., please e-mail me, b/c then i
can tape this show.  thanks...

andi

          _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
                              andrea lipman
                       e-mail: ablipman@sas.upenn.edu
               homepage: http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~ablipman

                     "it's only life after all."-es
          _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 13:52:36 edt
reply-to:     "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "christopher m. becker" <cmbecker@space.mit.edu>
subject:      re: world cafe
x-to:         ablipman@sas.upenn.edu
in-reply-to:  <v01540b05ae7ac4c08f0d@[130.91.233.114]>; from "andrea lipman" at
              oct 4, 96 1:43 pm

>
> i'm so confused about this world cafe thing.  i'm in philly, & i heard that
> it was on 90.9 from 2-4.  it's almost 2:00, & this station does not sound
> musical.  if anyone has any relevant info., please e-mail me, b/c then i
> can tape this show.  thanks...
>

world cafe is a public radio show which means a few things:

        1) that you will hear a lot of talk and news programming
                on the station.
        2) the station is _probably_ located at the low end of the fm
                dial
        3) programs like world cafe are shuffled around in the
                the line ups of various stations about the country.
                it will not be on all places at the same time.
        4) whatever programming the station puts on the air its
                probably good =)

ok, so i'm a huge fan of public radio ;)

if i remember correctly, one of the philly npr stations is whyy ("this
is 'fresh air' with terry gross...").  if the paper pointed you there,
you are probably doing just fine.

                                -- chris

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=========================================================================
date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 13:40:10 -0500
reply-to:     casey connor <chc1@cec.wustl.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         casey connor <chc1@cec.wustl.edu>
subject:      world cafe in st. louis

i believe you can catch 'cafe at 10pm on kwmu 90.7 fm on _saturday_. i'm
assuming that there is just a day delay so it won't be live (saturday is
the 5th...)

later,

/~~ /~\ /~\ |~ \ /
|   |_| \-\ |-  |
\__ | | \_/ |_  |

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 14:27:03 -0400
reply-to:     andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
subject:      world cafe

the world cafe is on!!!  but it's some stupid fundraising thing.  it's on
88.5 in philly.  bring on a & e!  does anyone know if this is live or
previously taped or what?  and if it is live, does that mean that i can go
over there & maybe see a & e when they're coming out or something?  it's
only a few blocks away.  well, i can dream...

andi

          _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
                              andrea lipman
                       e-mail: ablipman@sas.upenn.edu
               homepage: http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~ablipman

                     "it's only life after all."-es
          _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 14:58:31 -0400
reply-to:     problem child <warra5c0@numen.elon.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         problem child <warra5c0@numen.elon.edu>
subject:      high horse anyone?

> high horse is a song on the original strange fire lp/tape put out
> on amy and emily's indigo records independent label in 1987.  it is
> a song that emily wrote, a really rocking one, about being dumped by
> a lover and then having them come back as if they were the only thing
> that you lived for.  it is a great song imho, but emily said "it's a
> song only a mother could love."  it is really a hoot.  listen to it if
> you ever get the chance.

does anyone have this and a bit o' free time that they'd be willing to copy
it for li'l ol' me?  i remember emily saying (in some interview) that
this is the one song she wishes she could change because it's "forced,"
but i'd still like to hear it... and i don't have the origional strange
fire anyways...  so, i'd just loooove to add it to my collection...
btw, what is different on the origional "indigo girls"?  is it worth
hunting down to listen to?  thanks bundles!
-mandy

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 15:16:47 -0400
reply-to:     problem child <warra5c0@numen.elon.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         problem child <warra5c0@numen.elon.edu>
subject:      re: nigc: melissa etheridge...
in-reply-to:  <32542d31.47a3@po-box.mcgill.ca>

ok, i know i might get flamed for this beig so off idigo subject, but...

have any of you ever noticed that a lot of melissa's songs refer to
dancing?  "technique in moderation"  "dance w/out sleeping"  "you used to
love to dance"  there are so many more, but thsoe are the ones that come
to mind...  does anyoe know about her dance history?  my friend, abby
(the choreographer) and i (the struggling dance student) have been
wondering about this...  any reply is welcome....  (unless you're going
to yell at me and tell me to go discuss this on the melissa list.  i
don't want to talk about melissa 24/7, i just have one question....)
thank you kind friends....
-mandy, the queen of foot digestion...

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 12:38:50 -0700
reply-to:     gwendigo <gkeyt@paul.spu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         gwendigo <gkeyt@paul.spu.edu>
subject:      re: skipping songs
in-reply-to:  <32555fa0.e3a@jol.mobil.com>

i think, actually, the only song i ever skip (will this get me lynched?)
is closer to fine.  can you believe it?  i don't always skip it,, just
when i'm really feeling its years...you know, it _is_ a pretty old song
and i've heard it soooooo much.  it just preserves the original message
for me if i don't hear it quite so often anymore.

*************************************************************************
"lighten up, francis."
******gwen keyt******
seattle pacific university
bsn class of 1997
gkeyt@paul.spu.edu
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/notime1/home.htm

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=========================================================================
date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 19:24:19 gmt
reply-to:     ahidalgo@fc.emc.com.ph
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         anna hidalgo <ahidalgo@fc.emc.com.ph>
organization: the e-mail company
subject:      change in amy's songwriting style ... ?

hello everyone!

is it just me, or has anyone else noticed how amy's songwriting style seems
to have become much more narrative and direct in this new group of songs?
(seems to be moving towards what we usually think of as emily's style in that
sense.) her new songs seem to be a lot more specific about what she's talking
about and how she feels -- and not as abstract as most of her older stuff.

i'm a generally emily person, and i have to say that i am very impressed with
amy's new material. i always love emily's stuff right away, but usually it
takes me a bit longer with amy's songs. that's not the case with amy's songs
this time around, though.

does anyone have any thoughts/reactions?

:)

anna

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 16:15:51 -0400
reply-to:     andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         andrea lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
subject:      world cafe (again)

okay, now i'm officially pissed off at the world cafe.  i listened to this
thing for over 2 hours, but the ig were not on.  any ideas why?

andi

          _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_
                              andrea lipman
                       e-mail: ablipman@sas.upenn.edu
               homepage: http://www.sas.upenn.edu/~ablipman

                     "it's only life after all."-es
          _-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_-_

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 15:16:27 edt
reply-to:     chickensoprano <creechal@aslan.emu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         chickensoprano <creechal@aslan.emu.edu>
organization: eastern mennonite university
subject:      nigc  - lesbian flick

hey, just thought some of y'all would like to know that the back page
of the washington post today has a review of "bounded" (or something
like that).  i put out the newspapers in the morning at our campus
library, and i noticed it today.  it stood out because i think some
on the list have mentioned it in a recent thread.  anyway, if you
don't get the post, i'm sure your local library does.

anna

"pride is a strange disease; it makes everybody
sick except for the one who has it."
          -anonymous

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=========================================================================
date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 15:45:36 -0700
reply-to:     verdi@imap2.asu.edu
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         benjamin slavin <verdi@imap2.asu.edu>
subject:      re: skip song..(& misc)
x-to:         tmp@uv.es
in-reply-to:  <199610040716.daa24856@netspace.org>

you actually like the stipe and ig version of "midnight train". that's
the most god awful thing i've ever heard. it's supposed to be at least
semi r&b! at least one of the pips helps out on the 1200 curfews version.
ben

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 19:46:56 -0400
reply-to:     queen minerva <amytryon@phoenix.princeton.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         queen minerva <amytryon@phoenix.princeton.edu>
subject:      a and e's land of canaan comments

i was listening to the 11-13-87 chapel hill show, and right after they
play land of canaan, emily (who has been sounding a little, um, happy for
the whole show) says, "what a party song!" and then starts to talk about
amy's family in their sears clothes... but amy says, kind of in the background,
"what a _party_ song?!" like she can't believe her ears at what emily just
said. she sounds a little hurt and dismayed that emily would say such a
light-hearted comment about her heart-wrenching song. i just noticed that
today and was wondering if anyone else had. or, for that matter, are
there any other instances where a and e have disagreed/argued? they always
seem to be in such perfect harmony... in more ways than one :^)

just rambling,
amy

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 18:57:31 -0500
reply-to:     cylinda parga <ccp5913@tam2000.tamu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         cylinda parga <ccp5913@tam2000.tamu.edu>
subject:      world cafe comments

hey y'all,

so anyone else manage to catch the wc??  what'd y'all think?  does david dye
annoy the heck outta anyone else sometimes??  i dunno, sometimes he's just a
little too...um, goofy or something for my tastes.  but hey, he has good
people in the studio most of the time, and plays good music....i just wish
he'd do the interviews a bit different.  anyway, i thought the girls sounded
pretty good overall.  the broadcast just reaffirms my belief that "get out
the map"  should be played by amy and emily _only_.  no band backing them.
i've heard it with emily solo, the two of them together, and a full band,
and i think just the two of them suits the song best...i wonder how it'll be
on the album.  anyone else with an opinion (surely in this group _someone_
must have an opinion ;)  oh, but it was interesting to hear that "blood
quantum" was inspired by a dream of amy's.  i wish she had explained that a
bit more.  so, wow, like how many songs does this make that have come out of
amy's deepest sleep subconscious ramblings??  geez, it must be nice to be so
talented you can even write dreams in your sleep :)  okay, well, enough from
me, just wanted to know what anyone else who caught the broadcast thought,
have a good weekend y'all....

peace,
cylinda
*************************
"we are me, we are you
and the power of two"
           -tish hinojosa
*************************

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=========================================================================
date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 20:02:59 -0400
reply-to:     joe hamilton <fhamilto@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         joe hamilton <fhamilto@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu>
subject:      re: indigo girls wanted (fwd)

hey folks :) though i'd pass this along. i checked on the prices...
$250 for the amy and $350 for the em. more than i can afford, but cheaper
than i've seen them go for in the past. my suggestion..if you have the
money..you might not see them again. also...you might ask him for a
description of the amy. i know the emily's are pretty much hand drawings
the amy's however vary quite a bit. i'm guessing in the beginning
she had more time to work on them and painted them full out, but later on
ones are black spray painted with drip drop paint art. the full on painted
ones go for quite a bit more. my site should be up in a week. i'm getting
excited.

oh yeah.. while i'm writing. i thought of something kind of weird. i was
recalling some of my discussions with the sound guys and they, when
possible, mixed the show in stereo. of course amy coming out of the left
speakers and em the right if you are facing the stage. you know that left
handers are predominately right brained and so on..so then maybe left
handers are predisposed to like amy more? :) and going from the right ear
to the left brain, the more analytical side..we have emily. i listened to
1200 curfews and on a stereo walkman and sure enough..amy into my left ear
and em into my right. hmmmm. i have tested the theory on studio
stuff..anyway..if any of you get either of the hand painteds...let me know
so i can get first in line to buy them from you when i have the money :)
we are fortunate ones,
joe

---------- forwarded message ----------
date: tue, 1 oct 1996 05:55:13 -0400
from: eqs1999@aol.com
to: fhamilto@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu
subject: re: indigo girls wanted

hi, we have the hand painted rites of passage album cover.  one by amy, one
by emily.
you can call for details at 315-252-1999.
thanks!
brian
eqs

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=========================================================================
date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 21:05:06 -0400
reply-to:     seaphish@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "sheri e. allen" <seaphish@aol.com>
subject:      re: indigo girls wanted (fwd)

in a message dated 96-10-04 20:14:56 edt, fhamilto@bayflash.stpt.usf.edu (joe
hamilton) writes:

>you know that left
>handers are predominately right brained and so on..so then maybe left
>handers are predisposed to like amy more? :) and going from the right ear
>to the left brain, the more analytical side..we have emily. i listened to
>1200 curfews and on a stereo walkman and sure enough..amy into my left ear
>and em into my right. hmmmm.

interesting theory-  although, all auditory information is processed in the
left hemisphere (temporal lobe) of the brain.  and music and language are
processed on the left side as well.  wow, i actually remember that from my
anatomy class last semester :) hothead, help me out here- you may actually
turn out to be the more famous audiologist ;)

well, i'm right-handed and also an emily person so i at least support your
theory.

any other ideas?

-sheri :)

\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\

  _       _ ------ _               o      |....when you learn
{  ~\_/         o   \    o  o           |to love yourself
{  ~ _   ]          <  o                 |you will dissolve
{_~/  \ _        _ /                    | all the stones
             v-----                        | that are cast....
   seaphish@aol.com                  -amy ray
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 21:26:58 -0400
reply-to:     danaw1208@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         danaw1208@aol.com
subject:      stage setup question

hi all!

one quick question...where does michelle malone stand on stage
when she plays with a & e?  just wondering..since i haven't had the
pleasure of seeing any of the map tour shows....

thanks,
-dana

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 20:57:03 -0500
reply-to:     "jenn. brown" <jennb@owlnet.rice.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "jenn. brown" <jennb@owlnet.rice.edu>
subject:      tape tree
in-reply-to:  <pine.sol.3.95.961004132049.1707e-100000@frogger.rs.itd.umich.edu>

ok, i am going to sound really ignorant here... but what is a tape tree?
i haven't been on the list for very long and haven't picked up all the
lingo yet...

jenn.

jennb@owlnet.rice.edu

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 22:25:26 -0400
reply-to:     indigofrk@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sasha friedman <indigofrk@aol.com>
subject:      nigc shawn colvin in dc

just a note for everyone in the dc area ...if you buy shawn colvin's new cd
from tower records you get two free tickets to her show october 22 at 9: 30
club.  it's a pretty good  deal,  in my opinion. hope to see you all there.

peace
sasha

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 23:28:07 -0400
reply-to:     stgilis@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         stephen mcgill <stgilis@aol.com>
subject:      ig cartoon request

this might sound vague, but please bear with me...

somewhere, sometime, i saw a little cartoon drawing of amy and emily.  i
don't remember exactly what it looked like, but i think they were dressed  in
clerical robes, crowns, haloes, etc. (a la the rolling stone pic of a few
years ago).  i've seen it somewhere on the web, but i want desperatly to
download it!  does anyone know where i can find it?  thanks!
stephen

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date:         fri, 4 oct 1996 03:08:31 edt
reply-to:     gail anthony <101635.715@compuserve.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         gail anthony <101635.715@compuserve.com>
subject:      list t-shirts

hi,

just like to say a big huge thank-you to deb for organising the "ig list shirt 2
- the new batch" for all us listies who didn't manage to get one the first time
around.

gaun yersel' deb !!!!!!!! :) :) :)

toodles :)

gail <--  secure in the knowledge that she will be the only ig fan in aberdeen
to have a list t-shirt. :)

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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 01:48:35 -0500
reply-to:     m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
subject:      closer to fine...encore

kollin wrote....

>>>> that may sound weird but the past five or six shows i've ben to
it seemed like the ig were attempting to get away from play ctf as
there encore song and started playing cm,<<<<

ok, get your flame throwers & portable fire hydrants ready....i would,
personally, like it if ig would stop playing ctf at every concert,
especially as an encore.  did the dead play "truckin" at every show?
no way.  it's not as if ig plays large venues with a high percentage
of people who relied on songs heard on the radio.

ig fans appreciate the scope of their musicality and that does not
mean relying on their first "hit."  there is a rumor that ig has
performed ctf more than mcdonalds has served hamburgers, but this is
merely a rumor.  truth is that i would rather hear them do a cool
cover than ctf.  i would love to hear them do "tangled up in blue,"
certainly.

melissa
"who is prepared to be served up "medium well"

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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 13:03:00 bst
reply-to:     rachel sefton-smith <seffy@epic.co.uk>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         rachel sefton-smith <seffy@epic.co.uk>
subject:      amy's soc's

wow...just read loads of amy soc's on the indizone web page -
(http://pages.prodigy.com/indizone/index.htm)  i feel really ..i
dunno..inspired and exhausted now!

i'm ashamed to admit i haven't paid much attention to soc's before - kind of
thought - oh boy, amy's gone off on one again, wish they'd get on with the
music - made me feel almost uncomfortble.., but reading them now and
understanding what she means - pretty fascinating!
one from a show in charleston really struck me and made me curious- the
others are cool, but style much more story telling, conversational
tumbling.., and then i came across this one and its like fucking poetry...!
absolutely morbidly beautiful!  does anyone happen to know if it's inspired
by some classic literature or is it amy creating a classsic of her own...?
be interested to know...

so, i'm sure this has been posted before, but i'll reprint it for benefit of
those with no web access.....       oh, and if you don't know already, soc =
stream of consciousness - in other words, the bits where amy goes off on one
in the middle of a song... :)

enjoy,
**************
seffy
     cod==#
**************
>chickenman s.o.c. charleston, sc 2/7/95 (reprinted without permission)
>
>i asked my love what will breathe eternally? i asked my love what will
breathe eternally? i said love would you know these hands lying unforgiven,
imobile in the bottom of a desperate hole? would you know these eyes if they
were on fire on a funeral pyre floating down a river side? would you know
this chest sunken and depleted reaching to be filled by you? would you know
these arms, stretching up to the trees past the moon? would you know this
soul reaching vilely(?) explaining waiting for some further fascination? i
said love would you know me? would you know my mouth if it wasn't on you?
would you know my feet lying dead in the middle of the wood growing up like
trillion on the forest floor mushrooms flying all around? i said love what
will breathe eternally? what can i leave you? what part of me? what will
breathe eternally? and love will you know my body stretched out like so many
skins along this carcass
>highway? love.
>

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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 14:06:20 +0100
reply-to:     indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
subject:      re: amy's soc's
x-to:         rachel sefton-smith <seffy@epic.co.uk>
in-reply-to:  <m0v9vsd-000dalc@post.epic.co.uk>

on sat, 5 oct 1996, rachel sefton-smith wrote:

> wow...just read loads of amy soc's on the indizone web page -
> (http://pages.prodigy.com/indizone/index.htm)  i feel really ..i
> dunno..inspired and exhausted now!
>

i'm afraid that's the wrong url cos i got a "page not found" message.

mat

------------------------------------------------------------------------
| matthew j smith        \ "[the priest] said that if you have to work |
| mts5@aber.ac.uk         \   for anyone, an absentee boss is best."   |
| indigojo@freenet.hut.fi  \     - jeannette winterson, "the passion"  |
|----------------------------------------------------------------------|
|    billy bragg / indigo girls info:  http://www.aber.ac.uk/~mts5/    |
------------------------------------------------------------------------
adverts and junkmail will be read for 500 pounds sterling per item;
sending such email to me constitutes agreement to pay for the priviledge
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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 14:12:08 +0100
reply-to:     indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
subject:      re: amy's soc's
x-to:         rachel sefton-smith <seffy@epic.co.uk>
in-reply-to:  <m0v9vsd-000dalc@post.epic.co.uk>

on sat, 5 oct 1996, rachel sefton-smith wrote:

> wow...just read loads of amy soc's on the indizone web page -
> (http://pages.prodigy.com/indizone/index.htm)  i feel really ..i
> dunno..inspired and exhausted now!
>
i just got this page through yahoo! ... "indizone" has to be spelt with a
capital i.

mat

------------------------------------------------------------------------
| matthew j smith        \ "[the priest] said that if you have to work |
| mts5@aber.ac.uk         \   for anyone, an absentee boss is best."   |
| indigojo@freenet.hut.fi  \     - jeannette winterson, "the passion"  |
|----------------------------------------------------------------------|
|    billy bragg / indigo girls info:  http://www.aber.ac.uk/~mts5/    |
------------------------------------------------------------------------
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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 23:30:03 +1000
reply-to:     sherlyn koo <sherlyn@fl.net.au>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sherlyn koo <sherlyn@fl.net.au>
subject:      faq questions

hi folks,

just a quick note to let you all know that the new version of the faq should be
available very soon.  i couldn't have picked a better bunch of folks to work
with -
thank you guys. :)

just a couple questions i need the answers to, if anyone knows what they are:
        - what are they saying at the end of least complicated and at the end of
                i don't wanna know?
        - i know we've done this already but how many brothers and sisters do
                a&e have and where do a&e come in order of age (no. of older and
                younger sisters/brothers is what i'm after here)?

please email the answers directly to me at sherlyn@fl.net.au, and please only
email me if you know the answers for sure (sorry, i'm busy, don't have time
to wade through peoples' guesses for now).  the faq will be posted soon, and
you all can read the answers for yourself then. :)

thanks all, take care,
sherlyn (tired and in a hurry and probably grumpy)
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- sherlyn koo - sherlyn@fl.net.au -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
"and the best ones were the ones i got to keep as i grew strong,
and the days that opened up until my whole life could belong;
it's like getting the answers when i don't need them anymore,
i'm finding the pictures, and i finally know what i kept them for.
i remember..."                              - dar williams

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 10:35:03 -0400
reply-to:     renee l grebe <grebe+@cmu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         renee l grebe <grebe+@cmu.edu>
subject:      re: closer to fine...encore
in-reply-to:  <199610050548.baa24376@mime2.prodigy.com>

yea know, i must admit that i've heard them end with songs other than
ctf, and, well, it was really cool, but i had a sorta empty feel inside,
just cause i was so used to them playing it!

don't get me wrong, i love hearing different endings, and i hope they
continue it!!!!!  but, it is weird, sorta like ya can't leave the
concert cause it's not over!  ctf is sorta like a period at the end of a
sentence!

renee

* ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ *

"the same sun that warms your heart    "the beautiful ladies walk right by
will suck the good earth dry..."       ya know i never know what to say!"
       "get out the map"                       "shame on you"
        by emily saliers                        by amy ray

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 10:57:27 -0400
reply-to:     renee l grebe <grebe+@cmu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         renee l grebe <grebe+@cmu.edu>
subject:      re: amy's soc's
in-reply-to:  <pine.osf.3.93.961005141134.2500b-100000@osfb.aber.ac.uk>

so what do you all think emily thinks about amy's soc?  i mean, i was at
that erie show on 4/15/95, which i personally believe to be the most
meaningful, and longest i've ever heard, soc.  and, it really made me
think about life, and it really made me respect amy even more than i
had.  but, then i'd look at emily sitting there in the darkness while
amy was talking, and she looked so bored, like maybe she was saying
"damnit amy, just get on with it."  i mean, do ya think she gets bored
of it?  when amy doesn't do a soc do ya think it's cause she doesn't
want to, or cause emily doesn't want her to, or a combo of both?

i've just always wondered what emily thinks of them...  hmmmm...

renee

* ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ *

"the same sun that warms your heart    "the beautiful ladies walk right by
will suck the good earth dry..."       ya know i never know what to say!"
       "get out the map"                       "shame on you"
        by emily saliers                        by amy ray

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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 08:15:45 -0700
reply-to:     kimberly hobbs <kimlin@vcn.bc.ca>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         kimberly hobbs <kimlin@vcn.bc.ca>
subject:      re: amy's soc's
x-to:         renee l grebe <grebe+@cmu.edu>
in-reply-to:  <ymjbrle00iwti1gn9c@andrew.cmu.edu>

on sat, 5 oct 1996, renee l grebe wrote:
<so what do you all think emily thinks about amy's soc?  i mean, i was at
that erie show , emily sitting there in the darkness while
amy was talking, and she looked so bored, "damnit amy, just get on with
it."  i mean, do ya think she gets bored?
i've just always wondered what emily thinks of them...  hmmmm...renee>

* i can't imagine spending any..any period of time with some one i knew
from the sixth grade! i commend them for not scratching each other's eyes
out. i think it's a miracle, a true miracle! granted i moved a lot and
never formed true adolescent relationships of any longer than a few
months but, nevertheless, everytime i run into someone from highschool i
am tempted to run..run, run away. remember the girls on the video? "i'm
so sick of you..laugh laugh..give me my drugs.." in awe of them...kim (n.v.)

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 10:41:47 -0500
reply-to:     cylinda parga <ccp5913@tam2000.tamu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         cylinda parga <ccp5913@tam2000.tamu.edu>
subject:      blood quantum explanations and questions

hey y'all,

deb odonoghue was kind enough to type out this transcription of an interview
where amy goes into a little more detail in explaining the story behind
'blood quantum' than she did on the world cafe (thanks deb!).  we both
thought it was pretty interesting, and think you might think so too.

>i have a recent radio interview from philly after the show there in aug.
>where amy describes how she got the idea for the song.  i will try to
>transcribe it as she spoke:
>
>
>"blood quantum, this song, this songs about a, indian policy, genocide
>through bueracacy and paperwork.  there's a lot of weird issues around
>blood quantum laws, and the tribes decide blood quantum laws on their
>own you know, but then agian tribal councils were put into place as a
>way to relate to a, as a way for our government to relate to indian
>nations.  it's all really convoluted, but it's based on a dream i had.
>i started the song....i had this dream that i'm standing in line with
>this pitcher of blood and it was being, you know everybody's getting
>their blood measured to see how much indian they are.  it was the most
>bizare dream i just finished reading all these books on blood quantum
>you know and so i started this song and couldn't finish it, so emily
>finished this song for me.  she wrote wrote lyrics and music, wrote
>bridge and stuff."
>
>apparently amy never told emily about the dream cause while she is explaining
>about it you can hear emily in the background saying wow, about her standing
>in line with the pitcher of blood in her hand. emily says like wow three
>times when amy was talking about the fact it came from a dream and the blood
>part.  she sounds really suprised.  hearing this conversation is really cool.

so now i have a question.....does anyone have a definition for blood quantum
or blood quantum laws?  i'm a little unclear as to what amy is talking
about.  powerful dream, anyway.

peace,
cylinda
*************************
"we are me, we are you
and the power of two"
           -tish hinojosa
*************************

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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 16:57:00 bst
reply-to:     rachel sefton-smith <seffy@epic.co.uk>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         rachel sefton-smith <seffy@epic.co.uk>
subject:      suzanne vega/map guests

me again,

oops, i meant to get so much work done today but having www access from this
kit is way too much of a distraction!

really disappointed 'cos at lunchtime i tried to buy the new suzanne vega
album...couldn't find it so settled for the new sheryl crow instead.  did a
bit of surfing when i got back and am now officially pissed off, 'cos
according to her website, the uk release of nine objects has been put back a
few months to avoid a clash with the release of...yes, you've guessed
it...sheryl crow.  bummer!  anyway, interested to find out that several
tracks feature jerry marotta and jane scarpantoni....also interested to read
that tombstone is inspired by her cat dying...(you can imagine all these
cats up in heaven bragging about having inspired songs - let alone all this
roadkill going "yeah man, that chicken song - that's me in there you know...!!")

so, got me thinking about which musicians will be playing on the new ig
album.  i'm assuming that jerry and sarah are involved again, but who else
do you think might be?  who would you most like to hear?  any suggestions...?

to get the ball rolling, i'm really hoping that michael lorant does his
backing vocal on dgtgag - as heard at nojf - really love that part...would
also hope that michelle malone'll be in there somewhere...joan baez maybe..?
i can just hear some backing vocals in gotm provided by mary cc, nanci g and
shawn c.... or how about carol king guesting on one of emilys piano songs -
would be kind of fitting as em's style seems very king inspired, and we know
they used to cover some of her songs when they were starting
out....soy...has anyone else noticed the similarity to brown eyed girl?
p'raps van the man would do back-up!  and, er, in light of the recent
revelation that a&e are kiss fans...well... you never know!!

s'pose at the end of the day an album crammed full of guest artists would
detract from what we really want to hear, i.e. a&e, and we'd probably hate
it, but a few well-chosen guests can really add something i think...  be
interested to see what everyone else thinks...

oh, and if anyone wants to swap a us copy of sv's cd for a uk copy of
something, then give me a shout :)

later,

**************
seffy
     cod==#
**************

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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 11:11:17 -0500
reply-to:     "s. steffen" <ssteffen@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "s. steffen" <ssteffen@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
subject:      boots, nigc, sorry

hi y'all
due to a computer flip-out, i've lost people's private email addresses,
so sorry.

liz palmer:
i'm sending three blank tapes w/envelopes and postage to you for newport,
all three people are cancers including me, my bro, and a friend, hope
that's okay with you, let me know if you need something else.

mary who's doing bumbershoot (i think?) for cancers:
i lost your address in the accident, can you re-send it to
ssteffen@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu please?  thanks!

finally, to deb, good luck on the gre, i found it waaaaaaaaaay easier
than the sat, if that helps ameliorate your stress level.  :)   thanks
for all your work on the list t-shirt!  i'm waiting patiently though.
you kick butt!

--suzi steffen
ssteffen@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu

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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 13:09:28 -0400
reply-to:     mmedido@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mmedido@aol.com
subject:      re: a and e's land of canaan comments
x-to:         amytryon@phoenix.princeton.edu

in a message dated 96-10-04 20:00:13 edt, amy writed:

<< "what a party song!" and then starts to talk about
amy's family in their sears clothes... but amy says, kind of in the
background,
"what a _party_ song?!" like she can't believe her ears at what emily just
said. she sounds a little hurt and dismayed that emily would say such a
light-hearted comment about her heart-wrenching song. >>

although i have never heard the tape :( it sounds like their usual banter to
me.....somewhere along the lines of "are you talkin' out of your butt ?"

blinkeeeeee (must have that tape !!!!!)

'painfull pearls !"
(ar's evil twin)

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 13:09:23 -0400
reply-to:     christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         christine talbot <talbotc@umich.edu>
subject:      re: amy's soc's
x-to:         rachel sefton-smith <seffy@epic.co.uk>
in-reply-to:  <m0v9vsd-000dalc@post.epic.co.uk>

does anyone have a bootleg of this?  ooh, i gotta have it!  i've much to
trade, pleaase, someone?

yours,
chris ii
> **************
> >chickenman s.o.c. charleston, sc 2/7/95 (reprinted without permission)
> >
> >i asked my love what will breathe eternally? i asked my love what will
> breathe eternally? i said love would you know these hands lying unforgiven,
> imobile in the bottom of a desperate hole? would you know these eyes if they
> were on fire on a funeral pyre floating down a river side? would you know
> this chest sunken and depleted reaching to be filled by you? would you know
> these arms, stretching up to the trees past the moon? would you know this
> soul reaching vilely(?) explaining waiting for some further fascination? i
> said love would you know me? would you know my mouth if it wasn't on you?
> would you know my feet lying dead in the middle of the wood growing up like
> trillion on the forest floor mushrooms flying all around? i said love what
> will breathe eternally? what can i leave you? what part of me? what will
> breathe eternally? and love will you know my body stretched out like so many
> skins along this carcass
> >highway? love.
> >
>
> --
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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 13:10:15 -0400
reply-to:     mmedido@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mmedido@aol.com
subject:      re: suzanne vega/map guests

in a message dated 96-10-05 11:52:59 edt, seffy writes:

<< to get the ball rolling, i'm really hoping that michael lorant does his
backing vocal on dgtgag - as heard at nojf - really love that part.. >>

i for one would love to see him play a major role...i love
the way his voice sounds with a & e...i also like
his work on the drums..it's very 'sharp' and precise.
after listening to soy at no and from the nff...i was
dissapointed in the version with the regular band (nff)
i felt that marrotta gave it a strange 'pop' beat...kind of quasi reggae
that took away from the song.... it felt like a person running and
tripping every three steps...whereas lorant gave it a driiiving beat
that added to the song greatly. i was also dissapointed with the lyric
changes after n.o....but that's a different thread...

the cd 'lucky" from the big fish ensemble has a song called 'city of sin'
with ml singing lead and a & e backing him up...its a great song and a good
example of his voice with theirs in a more prominant manner.

so...how about the 'indigo girls and boys" ??? with ml as a permanent
fixture ???

binkeee (of course ani "d" needs to be on it too !!!!!)

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 13:09:48 -0400
reply-to:     mmedido@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         mmedido@aol.com
subject:      re: closer to fine...encore

melissa says .....

<i would,
personally, like it if ig would stop playing ctf at every concert,
especially as an encore. >

i'm with you on this one !!!!!

once ....i ate a whole buch of german brown bread because i loved it
and now the thought of it nauseates meee :) not that ctf nauseates me....
but if i overdo my favorite things, i get sick of them....which is why i
would be afraid to do a road trip for an ig tour.
as a matter of fact i'd like to see less recognizable 'standards '
if you will (gallileo, lc ect.....) and more obscure songs
(ha...as if there are any to us ;)
"love will come to you" for example (with a soc in it !!!! heh, heh, )
ig has a large enough body of work now to mix it up a little more :)
love
countess binkofsky
[ a right handed amy carbon based unit....except when i am a
  right brained emily unit...but allways a left brained dreamer !]
(i don't see a connection between left handed and right handed
and l & r brained person ...this is making my entire brain hurt.)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
home page and art barn !  http://members.aol.com/mmedido/index.htm
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 12:55:04 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      re: a and e's land of canaan comments

i can't think of any examples of them arguing, but one thing that's always
bugged me is in the watershed video, toward the beginning where amy was
answering one of the interviewer's questions.
i think amy was saying something like "that's why it's always so hard to do
interviews" and emily kind of cuts in with "yeah, they all start to feel the
same" like she knew what amy was trying to say, but then amy was kind of
like "oh, go ahead" and i got the feeling that amy didn't get to finish her
thought because she couldn't verbalize it right quickly enough. i've always
wanted to know how amy would have continued on, no offense to emily! did
anyone else get that impression or am i reading way too much into it! :)
i'm not trying to make this out to be a disagreement of theirs, it just
happens to be the only example i can think of where they weren't in perfect
harmony in public!

~abigail

"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 14:23:59 -0400
reply-to:     jennie <jriley@sophia.smith.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jennie <jriley@sophia.smith.edu>
subject:      re: closer to fine...encore
x-to:         renee l grebe <grebe+@cmu.edu>
in-reply-to:  <imjb8lo00iwtq1gl44@andrew.cmu.edu>

on sat, 5 oct 1996, renee l grebe wrote>
         but, it is weird, sorta like ya can't leave the
> concert cause it's not over!  ctf is sorta like a period at the end of a
> sentence!

        i agree!  its not just the song ctf that i love (which i do)  its
the big happy feeling i get being a part of an audience that screams and
sings along with it(:  most of the songs they play are so intense and
involving, that ctf is like the final cleansing before i can leave.
        i liked at nff '96 that they played dbtr, which totally blew me away
and ripped my heart out, and then they played ctf which brought me back
to from planet indigo to planet earth!

...know what i mean?

happy day,
jennie

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 13:57:13 -0500
reply-to:     abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         abigail <abaroo@execpc.com>
subject:      first single

well, i'm gonna go out on a limb here and suggest that don't give that girl
a gun could be released as one of the first singles. i really love that song
and it seems like one they'd choose to promote the album, but hey, what do i
know. :)

i'd also love to hear shame on you, and i think that would definately be the
most successful single, but it'll probably depend on whether they decide to
try and promote it as a pop song. if they do, soy will probably be in for a
lot of radio play if amy cleans up the "fucking up" line. i wonder if she'd
do that though, i hope not. it seems to me that she wouldn't dream of
changing a song just to make the media happy, but i don't want to assume
anything.


~abigail (eagerly awaiting the single, whatever it is!)

"i will not be....

a pawn" ~emily saliers

afraid of women" ~dar williams

complacent!!!" ~amy ray

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 14:42:31 edt
reply-to:     "joan m. cyr" <jcyr@mit.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "joan m. cyr" <jcyr@mit.edu>
subject:      re: michelle malone stage setup question

on friday, october 4, 1996, dana (danaw1208@aol.com) wrote:

>one quick question...where does michelle malone stand on stage
>when she plays with a & e?  just wondering..since i haven't had the
>pleasure of seeing any of the map tour shows....

dana:

i saw ig in august at the newport folk festival and at the hampton beach
casino.  both times, michelle malone stood on amy's right side.  so,
looking at the stage from the audience, the line up was left to right:
michelle, amy, and emily.  it worked out well when they sang idwk, which
amy and michelle co-wrote (they looked like they were having fun!).

the map tour shows were great (as ig always is), but especially since the
girls are trying their hands at new instruments.  can't wait until the new
stuff is released!

joni  :>}

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 15:06:54 edt
reply-to:     "joan m. cyr" <jcyr@mit.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "joan m. cyr" <jcyr@mit.edu>
subject:      (a little) igc - dar williams at somerville, ma

wow!  did anyone else see this show 10/4?  it's was my first time seeing
dar:  i had only heard a few of her songs, but what i heard i liked, so i
went.  i have to say...if you want a night of big laughs and great music,
you have to see her!  she is a riot live!  and what a vocal range!  dee
carstenson opened for her.  i never even heard of dee, but after the show,
i plunked down $15 to buy her cd! what a talent!
singer/songwriter/pianist/harp....wow!  she also came out and stood at the
cd table to thank everyone who was buying.

here's the igc:  wouldn't it be a hoot to see dar play with ig?  dar can be
so high strung and seem like she's from another planet at times, and the
girls are so down to earth.  imagine amy's face/reaction when dar goes off
on a tangent....

have a great weekend everyone!  i'm off to see the burns sisters and
kristen hall tonite at the somerville theater!

joni  :>}

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 15:34:57 -0400
reply-to:     sundara <smurphy@ups.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sundara <smurphy@ups.edu>
subject:      i got my shirt....and other stuff(very little igc)

i got my shirt!!! naa na na naaaana naaaaaaa!  sung in sundara's sing-song
voice!  yay!!!  thanks deb!!!!  you are awesome.  i looooooove my new
shirt.  sundara jumps around gleefully, grinning.

okay, everyone who i'm making boots for,  please oh please be
patient...b-shoot is having technical difficulty, due to my brain fog.  and
i'm going home to sequim!!!!!  tomorrow to visit the 'rents and the sibs
and the new puppy and get yoko the subaru fixed. (so no email for me)  then
i have to study like a mad-woman for the gre...everyone!!!  send deb and i
happy gre thoughts, so point of the story,  i'll try to get everything out
this week, but probably nothing will get done till next sunday.

and to all my regular emailers (and everyone else)...i love you!!!
(especially you susan)  i'm not ignoring you all, i just don't have access
to my email till wednesday,  and i'm a nervous wreck about this whole gre
thingy,  so i'll write as soon as i can.

i love you.

peace, love, and pain killers,
sundara, who has had a two week long headache and really hopes to seek medical
        attention soon so she can think again

"in the recognition of loving lies the answer to despair."

                        audre lorde

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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 17:00:46 -0400
reply-to:     janinsdale@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         janinsdale@aol.com
subject:      run amy, run!
x-to:         abaroo@execpc.com

in a message dated 96-10-05 13:48:34 edt, abaroo@execpc.com (abigail) writes:

>i can't think of any examples of them arguing, but one thing that's always
>bugged me is in the watershed video, toward the beginning where amy was
>answering one of the interviewer's questions.
>i think amy was saying something like "that's why it's always so hard to do
>interviews" and emily kind of cuts in with "yeah, they all start to feel the
>same" like she knew what amy was trying to say, but then amy was kind of
>like "oh, go ahead" and i got the feeling that amy didn't get to finish her
>thought because she couldn't verbalize it right quickly enough. i've always
>wanted to know how amy would have continued on, no offense to emily! did
>anyone else get that impression or am i reading way too much into it! :)
>i'm not trying to make this out to be a disagreement of theirs, it just
>happens to be the only example i can think of where they weren't in perfect
>harmony in public!
>
>~abigail

yes, i got that feeling the first time i saw watershed....amy said in the
newport ff program that she and emily have never had a fight...and i find
that really hard to believe...i mean, you are with someone almost every day
of your life for as many years as they've known each other...and they have
never fought?

i am not saying that amy is lying (protecting myself from the flames...), but
what is the true story here?

which leads me to another thought...in galileo, emily pushes amy out of the
camera's view. remember?  um...maybe there is some kind of underlying message
there...i mean, amy laughs it off, but what is she really thinking?  what is
emily really up to?  maybe she wrote get out the map, because she wants amy
to be chiapas bound?  i have noticed that when i play its alright backwards
(which i often do...) i can hear emily saying "amy go away, cant take another
day..."
go ahead, see for yourselves...**

jan (who is raising one eye-brow in suspicion of emily's actions...)


**disclaimer:  this is only a joke!  isnt today april 1st?  :)

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=========================================================================
date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 20:48:52 +0100
reply-to:     indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         indigo jo <mts5@aber.ac.uk>
subject:      re: suzanne vega/map guests
x-to:         rachel sefton-smith <seffy@epic.co.uk>
in-reply-to:  <m0v9z6k-000dalc@post.epic.co.uk>

on sat, 5 oct 1996, rachel sefton-smith wrote:

> backing vocal on dgtgag - as heard at nojf - really love that part...would
                   ^^^^^^

can someone explain this abbreviation?

mat

------------------------------------------------------------------------
| matthew j smith        \ "[the priest] said that if you have to work |
| mts5@aber.ac.uk         \   for anyone, an absentee boss is best."   |
| indigojo@freenet.hut.fi  \     - jeannette winterson, "the passion"  |
|----------------------------------------------------------------------|
|    billy bragg / indigo girls info:  http://www.aber.ac.uk/~mts5/    |
------------------------------------------------------------------------
adverts and junkmail will be read for 500 pounds sterling per item;
sending such email to me constitutes agreement to pay for the priviledge
of my attention.

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 16:02:38 -0400
reply-to:     miia hebert <mhebert@scad.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         miia hebert <mhebert@scad.edu>

hello...i love the indigo girls and would like to know when they are going
on tour again...any information that is interesting and especially
information concerning tour dates is appreciated...thank you...miia,
savannah,ga ...mhebert@scad.edu

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 16:09:58 -0400
reply-to:     lmd21@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         lauren dick <lmd21@aol.com>
subject:      amy and emily

hey y'all!!
    the thread about which songs of amy's we think emily should do and
vice-versa brought back some memories of my earlier indigo days.  my first
indigo tape was so (indication that i haven't been a fan that long)  and soon
after i got everything that they had out, but i still knew little about the
girls.  i always pictured the "dark haired one" to be the one with the deeper
voice, but i thought the "strawberry blonde one" was amy.  i don't know,
emily just looks like an amy to me!!  did anyone else ever make this mistake?

*lauren*  who has been enlightened in so many ways
(i don't really remember when i distinguished amy and emily correctly, but it
was a grand accomplishment!!)
*************************************************

"it is of immense importance that we laugh at ourselves." katharine mansfield
(who does this sound like?)

"the state of the world today demands that women become less modest and
dream/plan/act/risk on a larger scale."  charlotte bunch

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 13:55:59 -0700
reply-to:     kristina <andrade@az.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         kristina <andrade@az.com>
subject:      skipping songs

im so behind in digests (i have like 6 un-read in my box) so i dont even
know if there is a huge discussion about skipping "closer to fine" but i
almost always skip that song. i really do like the song a lot, i just have
heard it so many times for so long, i fear i will suffer from burn-out. :)

and i feel really protective of chickenman, like i can't believe people
hate that song. i think it's one of their best, if not the best. i do
agree though that hearing it live is a thousand times better than the
studio release and i was very happy to see chickenman on 1200 curfews
when i bought it (and just about died when they played it at b-shoot).

kristina

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
trying to read                                               andrade@az.com
the greek upon the stars                         http://www.az.com/~andrade

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 17:41:07 -0400
reply-to:     "m.macvey" <mmacvey@attach.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "m.macvey" <mmacvey@attach.net>
subject:      ?world cafe?

hey all

i've got a nice tape of wxpns fund raiser, good sound quality-90 mins
worth if any one is interested.a few songs (non-ig, mixed in with david
dye, who does say this is the hour we usually do our interviews) wha
happened did i miss them , was it the wrong hour/day/month/year? i know
i'm often of in my own dimension but this is strange and disappointing.

sorry if i goofed up
confused in maryland
marilyn

i am a problem child- i've been wild all my days...(a.ray)

..still crazy after all these years.. (p. simon)

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 14:51:40 +0000
reply-to:     jeff & kirsten <bull@unixg.ubc.ca>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
comments:     authenticated sender is <bull@pop.unixg.ubc.ca>
from:         jeff & kirsten <bull@unixg.ubc.ca>
subject:      re: amy and emily

> from:          lauren dick <lmd21@aol.com>
> subject:       amy and emily
>  i always pictured the "dark haired one" to be the one with the deeper
> voice, but i thought the "strawberry blonde one" was amy.  i don't know,
> emily just looks like an amy to me!!  did anyone else ever make this mistake?
>
> *lauren*  who has been enlightened in so many ways
> (i don't really remember when i distinguished amy and emily correctly, but it
> was a grand accomplishment!!)

i had similar problems for a while because i had two dolls when i was
little, and the blonde one was amy and the brunette was emily.  it
took me ages to be able to swap the hair colour associations with ig.
pretty funny coincidence about my dolls' names, though.

kirsten in van.

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 19:55:21 -0400
reply-to:     "m.macvey" <mmacvey@attach.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "m.macvey" <mmacvey@attach.net>
subject:      re: the vote!!!!(nigc)
x-to:         weenracer@aol.com

lisa

i too support the greens.even tho they aren't going to win, a vote for
them represents your agreement with their platform. at this time it is
unlikely that the green vote will shift the balance between democrats or
rebublicans, but their bean counters will notice, and if x million vote
for the greens, both parties are going to try to figure out ways to
modify their positions to attract these millions to them in the future.
if all the greens vote for clinton, they will adjust their positions to
try to attract other independents/third parties and figure that the
greens agree with them. you gotta keep up the pressure and don't back
down. a vote for a third party isn't wasted from that perspective.for
more info if your interested check out the following on the web
greenparty page http://www.rahul.net/greens
3rd party central http://www.math.princeton.edu/~tpbarber/3pc

go birds (hee hee)8-)


i am a problem child- i've been wild all my days...(a.ray)

..still crazy after all these years.. (p. simon)

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 19:54:16 -0400
reply-to:     jen lucero <jlucero@monmouth.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jen lucero <jlucero@monmouth.com>
subject:      amy/emily arguing

        hi y'all...in reference to a 92 interview, the girls were asked how
they stand each other on the bus.  emily jokes that "amy sleeps in the back,
and i sleep in the front"...amy pipes in with a "that's right", then emily
continues with, "we've known each other since elementary school, and we're
great friends and we've learned when to have our space and when to have our
time together and we usually always get along...umm, it's been a remarkable
partnership, you know, on a personal level and on a professional level as
well..."

        just my brief input on this subject...
                peace
                        jen

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 19:06:47 -0500
reply-to:     susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
subject:      hte realaudio again!!

hola,

we just ran across this on the web and thought y'all would want to know!

honor the earth!

special events


          internet broadcast -- the honor the earth campaign is
          proud to announce the second in a series of live internet broadcasts. on
          october 17th, monsterbit media inc. will broadcast a benefit show live
          from the shangri-la studios in malibu, ca featuring artists on the
          honor cd. starting at 7:30 p.m. cdt, the broadcast includes
          performances by indigo girls, toad the wet sprocket, bonnie raitt,
          sherman alexie, john trudell, and poetic justice. all net proceeds benefit
          the honor the earth campaign.

                      thanks to progressive networks for donating 250
          streams to the honor the earth broadcast!!!! point your player to
          pnm://monsterbit.com/live.ra and the port is 7070.

          any problems, comments, or suggestions regarding the show should be
          directed to hello@monsterbit.com

          if you've never participated in an internet broadcast before and would like
          to see this one, please read the information at monsterbit.com.

maybe someone out there will be smart enough to tape the feed off the computer (wink! deb :)! )

peace,

susan and jocelyn

si quieres paz, lucha por la justicia. - quien sabe {alguien que sabe mucho ;-) }

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 18:38:18 -0600
reply-to:     sunny <sun@swcp.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sunny <sun@swcp.com>
subject:      es quote from sf

>sunny's favorite non-lyrical quote....
>
>>>>>"i learned to play new insruments.  all of them are made out of
>metal".      emily saliers <<<<<<
>
>
>hey sunny, should it be noted that emily said this at the santa fe
>show....the one with all of the rain, thunder & lightning.....
>
>great line from emily, whose sense of humor was, obviously, the only
>dry thing in santa fe that night.

   yea, it should be noted that there was an intense thunderstorm goin' on.
in fact during dgtgag they blew an amp fus. they also stopped the show for
a while hoping the storm would blow over.  emily also said something like
"this is a perfect night to be sticking your face in a microphone"  and amy
asked her if her shoes had rubber soles.
     i've seen many ig shows over the years in many, many different states.
santa fe is the best place to see ig play.


                        --sunny

hippocrates said   "life is short, art long, opportunity fleeting,
experiment treacherous, judgement difficult".

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 19:55:48 -0500
reply-to:     susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
subject:      re: amy's soc's

howdy!

we don't know much about this soc, but we do know one other thing. we =
agree that it is beautiful, haunting, incredible! basically, this soc is =
part of what amy sings on a viva la diva track, "when you're ready" =
which is this 10-minute long journey into a relationship and more. it is =
incredible - it really rocks, but it, like the soc, is more than a =
little disturbing at times. check it out for yourself - the whole vld cd =
is excellent - and draw your own conclusions, and really, like any work =
of art, only the artist herself could tell you what it truly means.

peace,

susan and jocelyn

" is there a rule? is there a rule? . . . let's break it!" - amy ray in =
new orleans (uno lakefront, this year - thanks dwayne!!)

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 20:04:01 -0500
reply-to:     susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
subject:      re: blood quantum explanations and questions

hola, all!

cylinda says:
so now i have a question.....does anyone have a definition for blood =
quantum
or blood quantum laws?  i'm a little unclear as to what amy is talking
about.  powerful dream, anyway.
cylinda's done talking!


we say:

we are not absolutely sure, but, we believe it is referring to the =
percentage of native blood one must have to qualify in certain =
instances, for example, you must have a certain percentage of native =
blood, like a sixteenth, a quarter, whatever, to be listed on the rolls =
for a specific tribe. we think it may even get down and dirty to the =
point that if you have a certain percentage, you are eligible for money, =
land, etc. from the government. we're not certain, but that's what we =
think, having grown up in oklahoma, where we have lots of native people. =
we even remember filling out surveys in elementary school - they wanted =
to know if anybody in your class had a sixteenth or more of "indian =
blood", because then the school would get more money, special funding or =
something, from the fed. govt. the teachers would urge us to take the =
surveys home and make sure we "weren't indian" - ask our parents, and =
they especially pressured darker-complected students. if anyone has any =
more info on this, please post or e-mail us privately. susan is working =
on a piece of writing about growing up in "indian country" and the lies =
that little white children were told.

peace,

susan and jocelyn

"is there a rule? is there a rule? let's break it!!!" - ar in nola at =
nojf '96!

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 21:21:17 edt
reply-to:     oh susanna <oh.susanna@dartmouth.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "susan b. marine" <susan.b.marine@dartmouth.edu>
subject:      the em and amy dynamic

--- abigail wrote:
i can't think of any examples of them arguing, but one thing that's always
bugged me is in the watershed video, toward the beginning where amy was
answering one of the interviewer's questions.
i think amy was saying something like "that's why it's always so hard to do
interviews" and emily kind of cuts in with "yeah, they all start to feel the
same" like she knew what amy was trying to say, but then amy was kind of
like "oh, go ahead" and i got the feeling that amy didn't get to finish her
thought because she couldn't verbalize it right quickly enough.
--- end of quoted material ---

that's so interesting!! i have always felt a little uneasy with that part of
the watershed video too, but because i always felt like amy cut emily off, not
vice versa...em starts to say (in reference to interviews) "yeah, they all
start to feel the same " and amy says "well no...." and i have always thought
"man if i was em, i'd have felt really small when amy said that!"....

isn't it funny how different perspectives on their interactions make us think
more deeply about them as a "duo", a partnership?

okay, enough depth from me, i'm back to "oking" and blowing kisses to corinne
across america :-0

oh!susanna

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 21:46:33 edt
reply-to:     oh susanna <oh.susanna@dartmouth.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "susan b. marine" <susan.b.marine@dartmouth.edu>
subject:      bad sound effects choice

sorry to be post happy tonight y'all, but at least it's actual ig stuff!!!

i adore my copy of the newport boot, and listen to it incessantly (carolyn, you
rock the universe)...and i'm probably in the minority here, but at the moment,
"hey kind friend" is probably my favorite of the new tunes...

so i have to know....

why do they do that cheesy fake-thunder sound in the background? have they done
this elsewhere or just at newport? or did it not actually happen at newport and
i was just high from the second hand smoke of the folks with reefer behind
me....????

thoughts?

bye, really

sushi

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 21:59:44 -0400
reply-to:     sea8aggie@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "amy l.steinhilber" <sea8aggie@aol.com>
subject:      elton john and ig

in a message dated 96-10-03 12:39:53 edt, you write:

<<  elton amy and emily sang it at a
atlanta pride like 1992 or earier, and i never heard a tape even tho someone
thought they had it...
yup, i want it if someone has it
mike r. >>

me too me too me too
me me me me
pleeeeeeeaaaaaze!

amy

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 23:05:54 -0400
reply-to:     indigofrk@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sasha friedman <indigofrk@aol.com>
subject:      nigc aids walk

hi everybody...i hope everyone is having a great day. i was just wondering if
anyone frrom the dc area is going to the aids walk tomorrow.  just wondering.
i will be there with my indigo girls shirt on ( either 1200 curfews or demo
tour, i haven't decided yet) so, if you see me .....holler on over to me.

peace
sasha

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date:         sat, 5 oct 1996 23:19:58 -0400
reply-to:     indigofrk@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sasha friedman <indigofrk@aol.com>
subject:      shame on you, first single etc.

i hope if they do release shame on you as the first single, they leave the
fucking up line in it.  i not sure why....i think if they did the radio would
just cover it up like they did alanis, and green day and nine inch nails and
many others. i'm not sure if this post has a real point, i think i'm just
rambling.  ok that's enough.  but i think first single will be shame on you
or don't give that girl a gun.  just my opinion.

peace
sasha

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 00:02:06 -0400
reply-to:     renee l grebe <grebe+@cmu.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         renee l grebe <grebe+@cmu.edu>
subject:      re: bad sound effects choice
in-reply-to:  <33277966@dancer.dartmouth.edu>

excerpts from mail: 5-oct-96 bad sound effects choice by "susan b.
marine"@dartmo
> why do they do that cheesy fake-thunder sound in the background?


i actually think that that's just the wind blowing over the mic, or
maybe one of them breathing on it...  anyone else?

renee

* ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ * ~ *

"the same sun that warms your heart    "the beautiful ladies walk right by
will suck the good earth dry..."       ya know i never know what to say!"
       "get out the map"                       "shame on you"
        by emily saliers                        by amy ray

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 00:08:08 -0400
reply-to:     indigojrny@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         digest jeanne stuart <indigojrny@aol.com>
subject:      em's clinton/gore shirt?

someone posted a few days ago that they saw a picture on a website of emily
wearing a clinton/gore shirt & asked where it was taken. i was wondering
which website this was so i could see the pic.
thanks
jean

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 00:14:57 gmt
reply-to:     doug shaw <shawd@boe.qacps.k12.md.us>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         doug shaw <shawd@boe.qacps.k12.md.us>
subject:      world cafe / philly?

anybody who is in the range of wxpn in philly (this means pretty much pa,
md, and maybe de?) will be nice and pissed off at them now.  they had their
freaking npr fundraiser all weekend.  i can only hope that they will replay
the episode .. perhaps next weekend?  maybe we could call them and
complain....

%&*%&^!!!!

doug
.----------------[board of education of queen anne's county]----------------.
|   doug shaw | internet system administrator | shawd@boe.qacps.k12.md.us   |
'---------------------------------------------------------------------------'

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 01:11:38 -0400
reply-to:     deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
subject:      amy's soc

hello all in indigo land!

since the amy soc thread is going on i thought that i would chime in on
a mini-soc that amy did at nff during "down by the river."  she began
saying the soc/lyrics that are from the viva la diva song "when you're
ready"  then too.  i remember during the song i was thinking this would
be a great place for a soc and then she went into it a little bit, but
not full blown like the one posted.  amy also did a mini soc during
"southern man" on the atlanta pride boot, about manifest destiny and
on "chickenman" about the shotgun shiver that has been heard before.

just my little insights on the soc topic.  is there going to be a
compilation tape of all soc's big and small coming together in the
future?  inquiring minds want to know.


on another note, i am not sure about the elton john/ig connection at
atlanta pride.  i recally amy and emily commenting (as well as the mc's)
at pride that it was the first time they had played at atlanta pride
because they were always touring and not near atlant during the previous
pride celebrations.  i hope they play next year.  what a good excuse to
visit atlanta for a week  :)  !

as far as the emily clinton/gore shirt, i belive that photo was taken
at the march on washinton in april 1993, but i could be wrong.  i have
an 8x10 color photocopy of it hanging on my wall.  it is a cute shot.

take care and peace!

-deb

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 01:15:55 -0400
reply-to:     deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb odonoghue <doobie@student.umass.edu>
subject:      it won't take long question

greetings again to all in indigo land

i forgot one question.  when i was listening to it won't take long through
my headphones yesterday i noticed a part i had missed before in the past.
towards the end of the song when amy is singing the verse "the divison
among the people......"  you can hear emily saying something, but i can't
figure it out.  does anyone know what is being said?  any clues?

take care and peace!

-deb

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 01:16:49 -0500
reply-to:     deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>
subject:      re: ?world cafe?

>wha happened did i miss them , was it the wrong hour/day/month/year? i know
>i'm often of in my own dimension but this is strange and disappointing.

so am i like one of the only people who actually heard the show? they
played it here in milwaukee and i must say that i really liked how "get out
the map" sounded with just the banjo and mandolin. it was the first time i
could really make out the instrumentation. i think they did well with their
lessons :)

it was also nice to hear the vocals so clearly. and of course there was
that incredible high note that amy hit towards the end of the song. did you
catch that? if it weren't for the fact that emily can be heard singing
something else, i think we could have had a debate on who actually hits the
high note :) and the more i hear dgtgag. the more it becomes my favorite of
the new songs. it's just so powerful (although the show was taped right
after newport so she didn't do it with the bridge she sang in minneapolis).

my only qualm is that i wish their segment would have been longer and that
amy would have done "hey kind friend" so i can catch the words i can't make
out on my boots.  oh well, maybe next time.

deb

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 10:59:48 -0400
reply-to:     indigofrk@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         sasha friedman <indigofrk@aol.com>
subject:      indigo shows

hey all...
now that i am caught up in school and all , i was wondering if anyone is
interested in trading with me ( again...perhaps? ) i am going through the
sort of withdrawel of going to check the mail and there not being any tapes
there. so i'm looking to trade again.  i've got a handful of indigo shows and
some melissa etheridge shows so if anyone is interested lemme know.

peace
sasha

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 09:27:16 -0700
reply-to:     candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         candice gohn <cgohn@olympus.net>
subject:      nigc--realaudio

sorry to waste bandwidth, but i've been fighting with my computer for =
about three hours and still cannot figure out how to play real audio on =
my sound system.  it seems i've downloaded it, but i can't figure out =
how to access the file...is there something really easy that i'm =
missing?  i am, admittedly, comepletely computer illiterate.
also, my normal veritable plethera of mail has dwindled down to one =
(count 'em) post this morning.  is no one sending any messages, or is =
this yet another thing that is wrong with my dear computer?
i'm pining for fresh air.  i think i'll give it a rest and go take a =
walk....

"every devil i meet becomes a friend of mine"  -ar
greta

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 11:08:45 -0500
reply-to:     "s. steffen" <ssteffen@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "s. steffen" <ssteffen@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>
subject:      a paean to the list, and boots for my sis..
x-cc:         c642693@showme.missouri.edu
in-reply-to:  <199610060402.aaa01104@netspace.org>

hi all you wonderful ig listers!  i was thinking yesterday about what a
great community this (usually) is.  even the people flaming each other
like crazy and messing up everyone's days will usually get calmer when it
comes to tape trees, t-shirts, etc.  i got a warm and fuzzy feeling
thinking about how generous most people on the list appear to be, and i
thought, yeah, this is a wonderful way to interact with totally wonderful
people.  (and for all of you who aren't totally wonderful, get in
gear!!! <g>)

anyway.  my sister, who is trying even as we speak to figure out how to
subscribe to this list, wants bootlegs, especially of the hte in
minneapolis.  she went and said that the girls were great but that a lot
of people didn't know it was going to be a cd release thing and were rude to
the other performers, especially bruce cockburn, who played right before the
girls.  hm.  i know no listers did that because we had the info correct!
anyway.  she has pictures of the concert, and i daresay she might make
copies of the pix to trade for boots, but i can't really speak for her.


so, here's the info:
she's a scorpio, b-day nov.4, and she wants boots of 9/21 hte (ig part
only, i think) or anything else that people are taping right now.  her
email address is
c642693@showme.missouri.edu
and if any of you could email her with what to do to get a boot, she'd be
more than grateful.  oh yeah, her name is cathy and she's responsible for
introducing my brother and me to the girls.

thanks, y'all, and let's keep up the great igc threads that are going!

love,
suzi
ssteffen@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 17:47:38 +0000
reply-to:     andrew stokell <rbc31@dial.pipex.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         andrew stokell <rbc31@dial.pipex.com>
subject:      shawn on tour

calling all u.k. fans of shawn colvin -

has anyone heard about any more u.k. tour dates yet??

please help!


andrew

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 13:47:55 -0400
reply-to:     jonny wu <wuman@warwick.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jonny wu <wuman@warwick.net>
subject:      no curfews

to fellow listees,

        i was hoping someone could help me out.  i have heard about this "no
curfews" tape.  what exactly is it and what's on it?  is there a tape
tree for it, and if not, is anybody willing to work out some sort of
trade?  please enlighten me!!


                                                jonny

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 14:50:46 -0400
reply-to:     indigopony@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         indigopony@aol.com
subject:      ellen today at 4:00! (nigc)

just a quick little note to let all of the ellen fans know that there will
be some sort of special on her on the e! channel today at 4:00
eastern time.  i just saw the commercial for it, and it should be
interesting...=)

peace, love, and counting stars,
ponygirl

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 14:51:56 -0400
reply-to:     indigopony@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         indigopony@aol.com
subject:      jonas and ezekial video (please help me!)

i have to make a video for a tv/radio class i'm taking, and i chose
to do a music vid of jonas and ezekial.  the problem is that i seem
to have writer's (director's?) block, and can't come up with any strong
images for many parts of the song... if anyone has _any_ ideas, i
would very much appreciate them as this counts for a major part of my
grade...=}  even amy said that she didn't really know what the song
was about, but i wanted it to have a sort of "native american" theme...
continuing the prophets in the graveyard idea, i found some information
about a paiute prophet named wovoka whose ghost dance religion
sparked the wounded knee massacre... i wonder if amy could have
been referring to him?  amyray, thanks for your help, and please e-mail
me privately (i don't want the bandwidth police after me again! ;).

peace, love, and building fires,
ponygirl

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 15:21:32 -0400
reply-to:     alec <alec@pipeline.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         alec <alec@pipeline.com>
subject:      re: closer to fine...encore
x-to:         mmedido@aol.com

i would have to say that though i have never seen them live, i would
probably prefer to see it during their first set, without any kind of
preamble, and then have the encore be hand me downs...  i mean, i'm getting
to the point where, though i like ctf, i prefer hand me downs so much
more...  has to be my favorite ig song... hey...  that can be part of my sig
file...  now i gotta think of what line to use...

the alec who's finally elated because he knows what song to use for his sig
file...  have an indigrated day...

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 15:44:07 -0500
reply-to:     maggie poulos <me_poulos@acad.fandm.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         maggie poulos <me_poulos@acad.fandm.edu>
subject:      world cafe in the pa/md area

hey all,
i called wxpn 88.5 in philly and they said that the girls would be on world
cafe monday, october 7th..tomorrow..within the 3 o'clock hour.  the show
airs from 2-4 daily...they were having a fundraiser on friday.....so,
that's what's up ...
another thing:
regarding newport 96,
that was my best friend lynn who got to sing with the girls.  she is in
italy for the semester and asked me to ask you all, if you are the person
with whom she talked about getting a boot from, to get in contact with me
so i can get it and send it to her.  so, if you know that was you, please,
please, please email me and let me now what's going on.  and, we were on
the cover of the newport daily news that day...lynn was quoted as saying
"i'm a big, big, big, indigo girls fan.  i could die a happy girl now"..
that's so lynn and sooo funny:)
so, thanks and take care....
shine on,
maggie
ps...hi joe..you better write soon:)

                     +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
                     + "just like in a dream                 +
                     +  you open your mouth to scream,       +
                     +  and you won't make a sound..."       +
                     +      -ani difranco                    +
                     +                    a+e=ig             +
                     + maggie poulos                         +
                     +bkrbkr@aol.com~me_poulos@acad.fandm.edu+
                     +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 12:40:55 -0700
reply-to:     paul lorette <plorette@cln.etc.bc.ca>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         paul lorette <plorette@cln.etc.bc.ca>
subject:      new cd?

forgive me for this question, but i 've been away for quite awhile.  is
there a new ig cd?
paul  lorette  (plorette@cln.etc.bc.ca)
vice-principal, clarence michiel elementary school
terrace, bc, canada

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 15:49:31 -0400
reply-to:     cancerlili@aol.com
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         lisa anderson <cancerlili@aol.com>
subject:      emory?

hey y'all...
i heard that there will be an indigo girls concert at emory sometime this
fall. has anybody heard anything pertaining to this? please reply..
thanks y'all
nub,
lisa

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 15:20:32 -0500
reply-to:     susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
subject:      layered vocals

hi all!

as part of our ongoing support of igc, here's another subject we really =
dig! we took this from lifeblood, thought it would be easier to preface =
this subject in amy's words, not ours, so here goes:

amy said. ". . . i'll have six extra lines that i couldn't put into a =
song that
are really important. like in 'reunion' (on swamp ophelia), i had a =
whole extra verse so i stuck it
behind another verse (as a harmony). that's a thing we always do. =
anytime you hear extra words in
there, it's something that we couldn't fit into a song."

so, the question is, what is your favorite layered vocal - that is, any =
place in an ig song where they are not singing the same words? my =
favorite has to be reunion - "i remember you, when we were shiny and =
new, now, guard your faith, temper your speed, it feels so funny being =
free" and susan says her favorite is the wood song. i think the other =
one i really like is secure yourself, where the chorus is sung at the =
end, and amy and emily move in and out of each other's voices - pure =
heaven!

peace, love and harmonies!

susan and jocelyn

"actually, they're pajamas!" ar in buffalo 1994

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 15:27:18 -0500
reply-to:     susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan tomlinson <teddie@telepath.com>
subject:      fw: nigc chiapas

hello all -=20
we received this week, and thought we would forward it to the list, =
since there has been some discussion on this topic. thanks for the =
space.

peace,
susan and jocelyn

"si quieres paz, lucha por la justicia"

>
>urgent action: increasing level of violence in chiapas
>
>information from global exchange.
>
>since the beginning of june, reports of violence and human rights
>violations in northern chiapas, particularly in the municipalities of =
tila,
>tumbala, salto de agua, and sabanilla, have increased to a crisis =
level.
>the government is also reported to be continuing a huge armament =
campaign,
>flooding the area with military troups and vehicles. this illustrates =
the
>climate of terror present in indigenous and campesino communities, and =
is
>one of the factors stated by the ezln for the decision to suspend the =
peace
>talks..
>
>talks between government officials and campesino representatives in =
tila,
>northern chiapas, to bring peace to the region and to enable the over =
1,500
>displaced campesinos to return to their communties were unsuccesful.
>inhabitants of  this region, especially the masoja schuc'ja community =
have
>been threatened by a paramilitary group called "paz y justicia." its
>government ties enable it to manipulate the judicial system. based on =
their
>denunciations "suspects" have been detained and penal processes have =
been
>opened. it seems that the judicial system is only willing to =
investigate
>denouncements made by groups like "paz y justicia."
>
>the officical government campaign in response to the actions of the =
popular
>revolutionary army (epr) has led to a significant increase in military =
and
>police activity, resulting in patrols, military checkpoints and the
>detention of grassroots activists.
>
>it is important that the indigenous communities know they are not alone =
at
>this time. after 18 months of dialogue, there are no other results than =
the
>persistent misery and the encirclement of thousands of soldiers. we =
urge
>you to write a letter to the president of mexico, ernesto zedillo, =
asking
>for immediate measures. a sample letter follows.
>
>-------------------------------------------
>mr. president ernesto zedillo:
>
>        i would like to express my profound concern toward the ongoing
>violence in  chiapas. the situation continues to deteriorate. this =
climate
>of terror is one of the factors stated by the ezln for the decision to
>suspend their participation in the peace talks.
>
>after 18 months of dialogue there are no other results than the =
persistent
>misery and the encirclement of 60,000 soldiers. the resulting =
desperation
>amongst the population in rebellion places into question nonviolent
>political methods as a means to reach a solution.
>
>i would therefore like to ask you to listen to the demands and the =
needs of
>all the parties involved. the increased military activity of the last
>weeks, especially in the states of guerrero, oaxaca, tabasco, and =
chiapas,
>that have lead to the detention of members of campesino and popular
>organizations, must be stopped. i ask you stop the human rights =
violations.
>
>sincerely,
>
>-----
>south and meso american indian rights center (saiic)
>p.o. box 28703
>oakland ca, 94604
>phone:  (510)834-4263   fax: (510)834-4264
>email:  saiic@igc.apc.org
>office: 1714 franklin street, 3rd floor, oakland
>
>home page: http://www.igc.apc.org/saiic/saiic.html
>
>for more information about saiic, send an empty email message to:
>saiic-info@igc.apc.org
>

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 16:49:16 -0500
reply-to:     m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         m gordon <hdtx97a@prodigy.com>
subject:      confessions of a tape tree branch; nigc

dear everyone:

confession time...

i have been on the list for a little less than a year.

1)   at the beginning a was "queen lurker"

2)   then ventured to post a few notes

3)   started being the recipient of others' tape trees and plain ol'
generosity (i.e. jude hunter, melanie ebig etc.)

4)   a few months back i started volunteering to make tapes & being a
tape tree branch.

i had a dual deck cassette (never used in the 6 years i've had my
system), but found it didn't work well, so i used a local duping
service, who had done some business work for me.  i found out 2
things:  1)  it was a pain using the service (& time consuming) and
tapes didn't get out fast enough  and 2)  they guy did a shitty job.
low quality tape, sometimes they were done wrong etc.   in one case
(at least)  i sent out a blank to a fellow-lister.

making copies:  so, i've had my cassette recorder fixed and have been
doing my own duping as of late.  in doing so, i've tried to come up
with ways to do this in a time efficient manner.  for example; if i
am receiving tapes for a particular boot, i try to pre-tape as many
copies on my own tapes and then send out the copies when the request
comes.  then i use the blank tapes i receive for future tapes.   this
often means putting a tape in the recorder before i go to bed and
then putting another one in as i leave for work.  i'm getting used to
seeing little red (recording) lights on in the dark of night in my
living room.  if i ever have to live on a submarine, i'll feel right
at home.

have supplies ready:  one problem i've had in the past is not having
the right materials.  now, i have a drawer at work, complete with
padded, mailing envelopes (for 1 & 2 tapes), blank tapes (90 & 100
minutes) and inserts.

duping:  i have learned recently not to use the 2x speed.   yes, you
too can make tapes twice as fast and twice as bad.  lower quality, i
am told by my friend experts (thanks sunny, thanks howdy).

inserts:   i am now using copies of the insert provided or use a word
processing program to create my own inserts (not pretty, mind you).
if any of you have received dups fm me without inserts, i am truly
sorry.

nice little fun notes:  since i am usually crazed in trying to get
tapes or stuff out fm work, i tend not to include fun notes (but have
received some nice ones from tape requestors).  nothing personal,
just busy; sometimes i just don't earn my style points).

time consuming:  for those who make copies and are regular branches
of tape trees, you probably know that it is a time consuming offer. i
do this because, "i have received, therefore i want to give."


now, with that off my chest, if you are requesting a copy or boot:

1)  please, please, please, include a self addressed stamped envelope
commonly referred to as a sase.    make sure the envelope is in good
condition and has a clearly written address.  if you have a reusable
envelope that is in good condition, please make sure it has the right
amt of postage on it and has all other markings (postal & otherwise)
covered.

2)  do not send money for stamps or stamps separate.   have the right
amt of postage on the envelope.

3)  send the tapes in the right size envelope and with an envelope
that will fit the tapes (padded preferred).  if you send tapes
without their protective plastic covers, they could be damaged.

4)  i would suggest including a note on the tape as well as writing
it on the sase (lower left corner) of what tapes are requested.  that
way the person making the copies can lose your orig envelope & still
know what to send you (i've done that!).  also, some tape tree
branches are handling different tape trees.

5)  tapes:  send the exact size (90 min/100 min) tape requested.
otherwise duping doesnt work correctly.  also, use hi-bias, tapes for
cd's (i.e. maxell xlii).  buying in quantity (most warehouse clubs, i.
e. price club/costco/sam's club) sells in larger pkgs (i.e. 6-8 tapes
per pack).  try to avoid tapes with lengths over 100 minutes as the
tape becomes pretty thin and will self-destruct fairly easily.


sorry if this note is too nigc or in too much detail, but there might
be some who can learn fm my mistakes.  i am certainly not an expert,
but have learned a great deal in the past year (mostly by screwing
up).  also, if anyone has comments or suggestions i would love to
read them.

peace & love (& hopes that this post does not reward me with my own
personal fbi agent for tape trees)....

melissa

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 18:17:50 -0400
reply-to:     "m.macvey" <mmacvey@attach.net>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "m.macvey" <mmacvey@attach.net>
subject:      re: ?world cafe?
x-to:         deb reiser <debbie@mei.com>

>so am i like one of the only people who actually heard the show?
rub it in....well i hope you taped it (or somebody taped it!! :-)

some kind soul (maggie) says wxpn is gonna broadcast igs in this area
monday 10/7, so i will try again. please (insert deity of your choice)
make wkhs, stay off the air tomorrow during the 3 o'clock hour.
marilyn

i am a problem child- i've been wild all my days...(a.ray)

..still crazy after all these years.. (p. simon)

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 19:46:12 +0000
reply-to:     dave jackson <jacksond@uoguelph.ca>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
comments:     authenticated sender is <jacksond@mailsrv.uoguelph.ca>
from:         dave jackson <jacksond@uoguelph.ca>
subject:      re: nigc- re: desert hearts and other chickx2 flicks

date:          wed, 25 sep 1996 10:31:39 -0700
reply-to:      kimberly hobbs <kimlin@vcn.bc.ca>
from:          kimberly hobbs <kimlin@vcn.bc.ca>
subject:       nigc- re: desert hearts and other chickx2 flicks
x-to:          tuesday's child <dc3545@cnsvax.albany.edu>
to:            multiple recipients of list indigo-girls
               <indigo-girls@netspace.org>

hey tuesday's child and all,

now.. let us see. yes.. incredible adventures was groovy. bar girls was
funny, i'd recommend it. go fish is the best of these three. i mentioned
a movie last week called "a village affair" i am in canada so wtn played
it and i don't think you get that in the states. look for it on pbs.
anyway, it was great until the end. what follows is a small sample of flicks
with undertones of lesbian relations if not outright openness*

hotel new hampshire (jodie foster and nastasia kinski)
siesta (jodie foster and ellen barkin)
the rainbow (sammy davis and amanda donohoe)*
anne trister (french, don't know the actors)*
little vera (russian - natalya negoda)*      enjoy, peace, kim (north van)
__________________________________________________________

hi...  :)

okay, this may be a long shot, but --

what about "fried green tomatoes"?  there have been speculations that
idgie (mary stuart masterson -- yay!)and ruth (mary-louise parker) were lovers.  i've read the book as well (*best* book
i've ever read!) and the novel alludes to the relationship as a
romantic one.  it's very subtle and wonderfully depicted.

also, i visited a mary stuart masterson web site, in which clips were
posted from her various movies (okay, okay...she's my favourite
actress.  <grin>  did you guess by now?).  one of the photos shown
was of ruth and idgie lying on a picnic blanket together.  the scene
was edited out of final filming --> perhaps the movie business
thought it a risky move?

great film + great book = wow!

sincerely,
lisa j. :)

*just read a post where someone commented about the reference to the
above, so i suppose my post is a bit dated.  <sheepish grin>  i guess
this tells me to keep up with ig info, hmmm?  oh well...i'll send
this message anyhow.  you know what they say, strength in numbers.
:) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :) :)

plus, if i remember a couple .sig quotes, goddess kim backs me up in
praising this wonderful piece.  <grin>
**************************************************
lisa j. :)

"it's okay.  you don't have to explain.
once i was crazy too."
                       -martha plimpton
                        "running on empty"
**************************************************

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 20:41:04 -0400
reply-to:     andrea b lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         andrea b lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
subject:      sorry...

sorry for my last message.  first of all, my computer is having problems
logging in the the mail system here, so i'm on my roommate's computer.  i
think that my last message didn't have a subject line, so i apologize.
also, i repeated exactly what maggie had written to me, w/o realizing
that she had posted it to the list too. anyway, sorry for all the wasted
bandwidth.

andi

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 20:45:20 -0400
reply-to:     andrea b lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         andrea b lipman <ablipman@sas.upenn.edu>
subject:      sorry again (nigc)

okay...i take back what i just wrote...this stupid computer sent the first
mail back to me...they better fix this mail problem soon!

andi

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 17:50:07 -0700
reply-to:     "alex t. king" <asailers@accesscom.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         "alex t. king" <asailers@accesscom.com>
subject:      skipping songs...ctf

i have been an avid ig fan for at least 5 years, and my reason for being
slightly turned off by ctf is that is seems to be the only song most poeple
know the ig by...they have so many other good songs, that i feel frustrated
for these folks...and that frustration now is extended to the song itself.

anyone out there have the same experience?

alex

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 19:58:08 -0500
reply-to:     jorge sanchez <jsanch@wpo.it.luc.edu>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jorge sanchez <jsanch@wpo.it.luc.edu>
subject:      skipping songs...ctf -reply

>>> alex t. king <asailers@accesscom.com>  10/6/96, 07:50pm >>>
i have been an avid ig fan for at least 5 years, and my reason for
being slightly turned off by ctf is that is seems to be the only song
most poeple know the ig by . . . .

anyone out there have the same experience?

alex

sorry, i'd have to disagree.  in my experience, most people know
galileo or least complicated, and sometimes both.  i'd say ctf comes
in 3rd, but a distant 3rd.  i'd definitely say many more people know
galileo and least complicated that ctf.

-j

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date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 21:25:41 -0400
reply-to:     jen lucero <jlucero@monmouth.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         jen lucero <jlucero@monmouth.com>
subject:      nigc pres debate

        hi y'all...i'm listening to the debate and have to chuckle a
bit...clinton is answering the questions (whatever this may mean) and dole
is hitting below the belt again and again...my favorite...when dole said
something to the effect of "i address you as mr. president, something you
didn't do when you debated with george bush in 1992..."
        i love american politics...it's so humorous at times!!!
                just my opinion....i wonder if a&e are watching???
                        peace
                                jen

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=========================================================================
date:         mon, 7 oct 1996 12:40:53 est+10
reply-to:     susanj@journalism.ss.rmit.edu.au
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         susan jackel <susanj@journalism.ss.rmit.edu.au>
subject:      nigc - don't go changing

hi all

in response to all the smoke and flames about list content and list culture,
i offer the following thoughts

i am on a number of very different mailing lists and they all have a place
in my life and a virtual culture all of their own.

i love this list the way it is.

it is a virtual cultural community and what do we all do - we chat happily,
we talk about nothing, we fight with each other and make up later, some of
us are very quiet and we talk about stuff that's real important to us and
some leave and others take holidays and come back and we all come here with
one base line thing - the girls.

also i am a co-list owner of a much smaller list than this and when cas and
i set the list up we made the rules and if people dont obey the rules they
get chucked off.  i have been on lists where i have seen others chucked off.
this may sound a little facsist to some but the point is our ig list owner/s
aren't complaining, in fact i'm sure they're delighted (tell me if i'm
wrong)  so let's keep doing what we all do well - talk - and remember to
laugh, hit the delete key and say sorry if we have to.

dont go changing

sue

----------------------------------
"i aint no damsel in distress
you aint no prince
and i sure as hell aint no princess"  wendy bucklew
    susan jackel
                                ultibase clearinghouse  http://ultibase.rmit.edu.au
                                faculty of social sciences and communications
                                rmit city campus
                                gpo box 2476v
                                melbourne 3000

                                telephone = 03 96601702
    mobile = 019 148 979
                                fax = 03 96603709

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 20:35:31 -0700
reply-to:     dragonman <djarrell@ix4.ix.netcom.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         dragonman <djarrell@ix4.ix.netcom.com>
subject:      re: amy's soc's

>had.  but, then i'd look at emily sitting there in the darkness while
>amy was talking, and she looked so bored, like maybe she was saying
>"damnit amy, just get on with it."

i imagine that she was probably just concentrated to hard on following amy
so that she woudn't miss her cue to start playing again.  it must be pretty
hard for her to know when amy is done, and she probably has to be ready
pretty quickly.

:dwayne

djarrell@ix.netcom.com
"you can spend your time alone redigesting past regrets,
or you can realize you're the only one who can forgive yourself
makes much more sense to live in the present tense" - pearl jam

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=========================================================================
date:         sun, 6 oct 1996 20:36:45 -0700
reply-to:     dragonman <djarrell@ix12.ix.netcom.com>
sender:       indigo girls mailing list <indigo-girls@netspace.org>
from:         dragonman <djarrell@ix12.ix.netcom.com>
subject:      non-lyric quotes

at the risk of starting another discussion on higher education, i would have
to say that one of my favorite all time quotes comes from emily at the
university of rochester show on 4/27/91 (my first show :).  she was
introducing "history of us" and explaining that she travelled to europe
right after graduating from college.  she said:

"amy and i both graduated from college and then decided to play guitar for a
living."

another good one comes before that.  emily is alone on stage and some fool
screams "blood and fire".  emily says "i don't sing that one".

whatever,

:dwayne

djarrell@ix.netcom.com
"you can spend your time alone redigesting past regrets,
or you can realize you're the only one who can forgive yourself
makes much more sense to live in the present tense" - pearl jam

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